I think a team containing Whelan, Kilbane etc cannot expect to beat one of the top four - Portugal, France, Russia or Germany, a draw at home and honourable defeat away is my prediction...I think these seedings are the Final Nail in our coffin.
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I think a team containing Whelan, Kilbane etc cannot expect to beat one of the top four - Portugal, France, Russia or Germany, a draw at home and honourable defeat away is my prediction...I think these seedings are the Final Nail in our coffin.
Don't understand why people are rating France & Portugal so highly. Both are struggling in average groups now. IMO France would be a very good draw
Totally agree. France make very poor use of the players they have, Portugal continue to have problems scoring goals.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibs4Ever
If the draw was made today (based on the current top eight teams in the second place table and FIFA rankings) we'd play Greece which I'd definitely take.
Russia (6) v Slovenia (54)
Croatia (9) v Bosnia & Herzegovina (46)
France (10) v Norway (43)
Greece (12) v Ireland (38)
(Current FIFA Ranking in brackets.)
I don't think it works like that, there'll be a draw made with 4 teams in one pot and 4 in another and then a second draw to determine home and away legs will take place. It's not a case of just bottom ranked team plays top and so on.Quote:
Originally Posted by eaststand85
Disgraceful decision by FIFA but not in the least bit surprising.
We tend to struggle against weaker teams anyway, bring it on if we get second. Had a terrible dream last night that we got beaten 1-0 by Montenegro and missed out on 2nd, think it was down to watching that Montenegrin lad destroy Liverpool last night! Mind you Dunne had got injured so Gary Breen had been recalled and was at fault for the goal so it wasn't exactly realistic!
Apologies, you're right. Just re read the article:
"We have decided on seeding the teams into two groups of four, taking the Fifa world rankings into account, with the top four in one pot and the others in another pot," Blatter said. "There will be a separate draw to decide home and away," he added of the two-leg ties to determine four European places at the 2010 finals in South Africa.
Even more annoyed now as there's no benefit in being 5th seed as opposed to 8th (although I know this may all change).
FIFA are definitely like Fianna Fail. Look after their friends and sh*t on the little people.
People are saying that France and Portugal are not performing well of late but with the calibre of players available to them, they can always pull a win out of the bag. Wouldn't mind playing Croatia or Greece out of the current top 4 2nd placed teams.
Let's hope the bottom 7 mess-up in their remaining games and we get 4 points to put us in the strongest possible position.Quote:
Originally Posted by EastTerracer
Anyway, this is Ireland. We don't do things the easy way....
Depressing news indeed, on a slightly brighter note newstalk are reporting that if we do get to South Africa we'll be in pot number 2 for the group draw.
This is a complete joke and there is no way FIFA can justify this, the FAI and others really should be making more of a song and dance about this. If anything the seeding should be based on the number of points accumulated in each respective group. Even still that wouldnt be necessarily fair, an open draw is the only thing that makes sense. I'd take Greece, France and Croatia above Russia anyday.
I'm numb about this. It's enough being punished for past sins by being seeded in the groups.
If the groups were arranged fairly, surely all the teams who finish second should be treated equally?
That said, I'm extra nervous when Ireland go into matches as favourites (however slight) and I think I'd prefer us to play someone like Greece, Portugal or Croatia than Bosnia or Norway or someone.
If 2 teams tie on points for 2nd place does it go down to goal difference or games played against each other?
If it's goal difference, then Sweden have a good chance of holding onto 2nd place ahead of Portugal, Latvia (if they draw in Greece) could sneek into 2nd spot by outscoring Greece in the last game of the group (Lat v Mol, Gre v Lux), Slovenia could hold on to 2nd place ahead of Czech, and there is a chance Ukraine can catch Croatia if they beat England at home (not that it matters in terms of seeding).
Russia/Germany, France and Bosnia have all secured 2nd place. If it was to work out as above, Russia/Germany, France, Croatia/Ukraine and ourselves would be in the top seeds. It's a long shot but there is always a possibility.
Although, if we win our last 2 games and Cyprus snaggle a draw against Italy then we can forget about this play-off fixing scandal!!!!
If we were in the top 4 group then I suppose everybody would think that it was our fully deserved hard earned right to be seeded and FIFA done good.
In a way, a tie against a potentially complacent France could be easier than a nationalistically fired up Bosnia.
I'll take what comes to be honest. I just hope we get to the playoffs first.
I felt like puking up my breakfast after reading about this but after thinking about it, apart from the Germany/Russia group, I'd fancy our chances against any of the others. Shame though, I had my heart set on a trip to Ljubljana.
it was my understanding that the seeing would work on FIFA rankings, not based on the points we finish with in the group, so we are destinted to play either france, russia, greece or croatia, and so we can't play sweden, slovenia or bosnia.
so, out of those, i'd say i'd take my chances against greece or at a push croatia,
(being the two i'd say that there's less of an "interest" from within FIFA to get them to the world cup)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Agree with that, though I really really hope we beat Italy and with a play off spot secured the final game against Montenegro really meaning something and with plenty of pressure on Italy to deliver a result it would make it really interesting and nervewracking - but in a good way!!!!
From some reason the penalty shoot out against Spain comes to mind here, Remember Beglin saying as Finnan steped up to take the last, "make them finish the job Steve" or something along those lines, anyway my point is if we only get a draw at home to Italy, happy days for Italy home and dry. Whereas if we win, it puts all the pressure on them, they must win at home to Cyprus, you never know what could happen in that scenario.Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior
Sickening to see FIFA do a u -turn on this. Am I surprised? No, after all it is obvious that they are making sure that countries with big tv audiences qualify. They are also trying to give players like Ronaldo every chance of being there.
Decisions like this really shake my love of the game to the core, but then we are talking about a rotten corrupt organisation like FIFA here.
would you guys want Ribery running at Kilbane or McShane? France are not the force they were but they still have the individuals to conjure up a bit of magic and capitalise on any defensive howlers. Henry at LR a few years back is a painful memory.....
We have to get 2nd place first but we are still in with a shot of 1st and two wins next month would make the other nations sit up and take notice if we still finished second.
I don't know why people are assuming that Sweden, Russia and Croatia are definitely going to be in the play-offs. I think Portugal will make 2nd place in Group 1. They have 2 winnable games at home, and unless Sweden win in Denmark I can't see them getting second. We would have no chance against Portugal, imagine Ronaldo running at Kilbane over 180 minutes.
Russia have got Germany at home next and if they win they will probably win Group 4. The Germans have also got Finland at home in their last game, and they have a bad recent record against them (2 draws in 2002 World Cup qualifiers, without these Beckham's goal against Greece wouldn't have mattered). To be honest, I'd rather draw the Germans than the Russians in a play-off. I think Russia have got a very good side now and a great manager, and Moscow in November is the ultimate nightmare draw. I think the Germans would probably beat us as well, but I don't think they are as good as everyone thinks they are.
If the Ukraine beat England in Kiev then Croatia are as good as out, as Ukraine play Andorra in their last game. Not sure if they will but it's more than possible as England have nothing to play for. Also Norway are as good as out as the worst placed second team, so I'm not sure why they are being mentioned. If we draw France, Russia or Portugal I think we'll lose; Germany or Croatia we'll probably lose but we'd have an outside chance; Czech Republic, Greece or Ukraine is the best we can hope for out of the top seeds.
Terrible news alright, in a play-off situation the bigger boys usually have enough over two legs. Even when it's a one off they seem to scrape through, I'm fearing a repeat of the Netherlands play-off in Anfield.
On a separate note, what's the deal with a Russian visa if we were to play them, are they difficult/expensive to get?
I woke up yesterday and saw the seeding news on the world cup page of soccernet, and i posted it foolishly without a link figuring it was old news as I am 5 hours behind Dublin here in NY....But I apologize for not linking it yesterday morning.
You know what else I was curious about, would as many Irish fans travel to a place like say Serbia or Greece as would travel to Paris? Taking into consideration this doesnt happen every year (or even every 4th year)? I would consider going to many places but not Serbia.
Quote:
Originally Posted by irishfan86
that's an absolute rubbish post
Its just bloody favourtism again by FIFA and not in any bit surprising. They are worried about the revenue that will be lost if Germany and France lost in a playoff, so they bring in this joke of a rule a month before the playoffs to assist these teams. They always do this, they essentially have a set list of teams that they want in the world cup. Its no advantage whatsoever to FIFA to have little old Ireland qualifying rather than say Germany. Just look at the World Cup draw for example. 32 teams will have all gone through very tough qualifying and will have deserved their place there. Yet when the draw takes place for the groups, FIFA seeds teams to again assist the big boys. It should be a level playing field in the main competition and only geography should seperate teams.
Give me a trip to somewhere like Serbia over the same to Paris any day. Paris will have tens of thousands of Irish day trippers, Serbia will be one for the hardcore fans and that always means a better time!Quote:
Originally Posted by Crosby87
FIFA are absolute gangsters. It should be a level playing field as all the teams are in the play-offs on merit after finishing second place in groups that were already seeded and should have therefore been of similar quality anyway.
There is only one reason for them to do this and that is to prevent the countries with the big TV audiences from knocking each other out. There is no other possible point to do it. Its shocking that these wan*ers can hijack the world's most popular sport and turn it solely into a business. To decide to wait and see first what teams are likely to make the play-offs and then to announce the draw will be seeded makes it even more obvious of their intentions. It also shows that they don't really give a sh*t whether people know it or not. Maybe they'll start seeding the knockout stages of the World Cup Finals if it looks like Germany, France, England or Brazil might get knocked out in the second round.
Anyone got an email address for FIFA we should give them a piece of our minds?
An English lad from work had a lot of bother with the Russians in trying to sort his visa for the game played on astro turf. I'm pretty sure they lost 2-1 :D. I don't think it was expensive, just the chasing up because there was a back log and the Russian embassy in London didn't sound the friendliest of sorts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jicked
Yeah we would really be ****ed against a team that draws nil nil at home to ten man Albania. We have nothing to worry about in portugal, they have been made to look extremly ordinary in the qualifiers. A bit of me would prefer a team like portugal rather than a real form team like BosniaQuote:
We would have no chance against Portugal
I honestly think that the more Italy need to beat Cyprus, the lighter work they will make of it. Obviously, it would still be better that they do need to win. It would be fantastic to win our remaining games anyway, would do an awful lot for our rankings I'd imagine. The win against italy would carry a lot of weight I suspect.Quote:
Originally Posted by elroy
As for the playoff seeding, it's completely backward that it doesn't have to be laid out at the beginning of the qualification process. Not sure why they don't just do that though, it was always going to be the best way of ensuring the big teams are at the Finals.
Wouldn't mind Portugal, we've gotten results off them in the past when it mattered. Russia is who you want to avoid, although I do remember Wales going out there in the Euro 2004 playoff and getting a 0-0.
But they are the greatest shower of cheats I have seen in football and would always worry against them if the ref was anyway dodgy...Quote:
Originally Posted by carloz
are you sure...Quote:
Originally Posted by Jicked
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8280399.stm
Also got a spanking off them in 95 when it mattered, would much sooner avoid them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leeside Swagger
Indeed. Was about to say the same thing..Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
Russia are an awful team to get in a play-off situation. I remember the Wales matches well, and they did brilliantly to get a draw in Moscow. However its history which weighs heavily on Russia's side; i'm pretty sure they've only ever lost one 'competitive' home match.. ever (V France in '98). And this includes results as USSR. A phenomenal record.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leeside Swagger
Anyone who fancies our chances over two games against Portugal is insane. I realise they have played badly in their group, that is why they are even struggling to make the play-offs, and ordinary sides like Denmark and Sweden may knock them out. But they are still capable of raising their game, and they are one of the teams to avoid in the play-offs which is why we'll probably get them. For the same reason I think France would not be a great draw. Their only problem is that they have got a clueless manager. There's nothing wrong with a squad that can boast Henry, Ribery, Benzema, Evra, Clichy, Diarra, Gallas etc. We also haven't got a great record against the French.
Anyway, I don't like all this talk of who we are going to get in the play-offs. We haven't got there yet. I just hope that Bulgaria don't win in Cyprus, because if we lose to the Italians then the Montenegro game will be very difficult. They are a good side with outstanding individuals in Jovetic and Vucinic, and it will be a hard game and a very nervy evening if we need to win.
Don't understand all the uproar.
If we were good enough in the past, we'd be seeded and have no complaints.
If we're good enough now, we'll beat a seeded team in the play off.
If we were good enough during the group stage, we'd qualify without a play-off.
Any team that beats us in a play-off, deserves to qualify ahead of us....if we are good enough we'll qualify.
The real interest have been and have always been money.Quote:
Originally Posted by irishfan86
If and when we finish 2nd, we will have finished 2nd as equals to all the other teams who finish 2nd. After that, there should be no seeding, and if there is, it should have been clarified long before qualification started.Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenbod