To anyone taking pleasure in Cork's demise imagine your club not existing anymore ,because I can't:(
All the best to Cork and its fantastic supporters truly black day for league:(
To anyone taking pleasure in Cork's demise imagine your club not existing anymore ,because I can't:(
All the best to Cork and its fantastic supporters truly black day for league:(
Some bitter sh!te on here...just don't get it TBH. I can see people gloating over another teams relegation, but over ANOTHER teams demise? Its not right.
All the best to the other City.
You that's all fair enough, but we're talking about a club that has acted so irrespondsibly it's hard to believe. Cork signed players from under the noses of other clubs using money it should have been using to pay the taxman. Remember Cork even gave free entry to a league match with Drogheda and gave it's season- ticket holders a refund relating to that match. Of course fans of clubs that play by the rules and pay taxes will believe that Cork under it's current management should not be in the league. Fans know very well that when Cork goes another Cork club will replace them in a season or two. The FAI have to come down hard on clubs that are getting an unfair advantage by spending money it hasn't got.
its the exact same situation, fans have money for the club but wont hand it over, cause they built a demoracy and now dont like the person that they voted in and accepted,Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco
what would you know anyway that vine is rotted,
its a joke that ye think FORAS done the right thing, people bought tickets for there events and draws in the belive that they were helping out there club Cork City FC, only in actual fact some joe soap is sitting on it, FORAS didnt want a premier league club in january, why the hell would the want an A league one now,
and that stupid statement they made might aswell have been a blank piece of paper,
id love to se a club run by these fools
You do realise that in Cork's case the fans and the club are not one and the same? Most Cork fans were wary of Arkaga taking over (where the original damage was done) but they couldn't do anything about it. When Arkaga bailed out the damage was done, the debts were so large that saving the club was beyond the means of fans.Quote:
Originally Posted by SMorgan
AFAIK your own club isn't members owned or controlled so there's nothing to stop the same thing happening in Dundalk.
A terrible day for Irish football.
Sympathies to the Cork City supporters. The entire league is weakened and diminished by a club going under like this.
Heard Joe Gamble interviewed on Morning Ireland and he wasn't hopeful or confident of any further developments by Friday.
This is awful.
I have every sympathy for Cork fans, players and officials (and even Paul Doolin) this morning.
If they haven't already, FORAS people need to sit down with people from Rovers to help them map out strategy to take over the club - or start a new club - and run it as a members club. Best ground in the league, best fans - both numbers wise, and enthusiasm: if Cork can't support a team in this league, nowhere can.
I don't really agree with that. There has to be an earlier warning system put in place. This notion of penalties only applying if you're over 65% at the year's end isn't enough. Coughlan not meeting his repayment requirements to Revenue should have been the signal for the FAI to get involved, be it with a transfer embargo or a points deduction or something. It's been shown time and again (Dublin City, Drogheda, Shels, Bohs, Cork) that licencing doesn't work as a deterrent or as a detector, and I think the FAI need to take their share of the blame there (obviously Coughlan has to take most of the blame).Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
Echo most of what's been said about Cork fans thus far, including mocking don ramo.
Small point - the option of taking over existing entity is a non runner.Quote:
Originally Posted by sonofstan
New club needs a slow and measured early life. Players and fans need to be convinced that the long term strategy is right, businesses that have been stung by City need to be convinced that new guys are intent on doing things right. Still hard to believe that a few weeks short of 25 years in the League city are no more.
Yeah, I see that - could an new business entity take over the name 'Cork City'?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronnie
Would not be an adiviasble thing to do. Need a clear break with the old, and be sure that no one can come after you for old stuff.
What rubbish?Quote:
Originally Posted by don ramo
The Examiner appointed Coughlan, nobody voted him in or accepted him.
The implication here is that a member-owned club is a guarantee of sensible and prudent financial management- clearly not, as the current Bohs debacle illustrates.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
It must be crystal clear at this stage that the "rope is too long", and while the 65% rule is a step in the right direction it is insufficient in itself. Apart from unequivocal implementation of the sanctions for breaching this rule, the FAI need to introduce further "early warning" measures with appropriate penalaties for clubs - defaulting on Revenue payments is a consistent indicator of impending financial implosion. Ultimately the mindset of those running clubs needs to change, but all the available evidence is that this will not happen without stringent regulation by the governing body.
No, that's your implication.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezeikial
What being a members owned club does it take away the opportunity that one person, or a small number of people, can do something stupid.
It doesn't solve all ills, but it's the best form of organisation for fans, as proved all around the world.
It must be crystal clear at this stage that the "rope is too long", and while the 65% rule is a step in the right direction it is insufficient in itself. Apart from unequivocal implementation of the sanctions for breaching this rule, the FAI need to introduce further "early warning" measures with appropriate penalaties for clubs - defaulting on Revenue payments is a consistent indicator of impending financial implosion. Ultimately the mindset of those running clubs needs to change, but all the available evidence is that this will not happen without stringent regulation by the governing body.[/QUOTE]
But is the Cork scenario not the ultimate test. I'm no great fan of the process, but the clubs were against the 65%, esp the big ones (or that seasons big ones, Drogs, Shels, Cork, as it was restrictive!!!!.)
We have had clubs relegated, Shels, deducted points, Drogs, Rovers, Longford, Cork. In all those case, bar Cork, the lessons seemed to have been learned. Looks like the next to be punished will be Bohs and remains to be seen whther they will learn or not. The lesson? In our league paying wages of 2million a year is nuts!
Absolutly gutted that it has come to this,but you could see it happening as to be honest we were like a financial time bomb waiting to explode over the last year and yesterday's news left my hartbroken last night. Life without this club for me is unthinkable
Actually, isn't there a bit in the licence agreement that states a club has to be solvent (defined here as having more assets than liabilities) to get a licence? There's several clubs this clearly doesn't apply to. So the FAI are flouting their own rules in this regard.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
[QUOTE]Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezeikial
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
It seems to me a reasonable interpretation of your original statement - if you mean something different, please clarify.
But it also opens up the possibility that a large number of people, led by a few, can also do something stupid. You don't need to search hard for the current evidence of this.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
It's understandable that you would be in favour of a members-owned solution, given recent history at Cork City. A new FORAS-owned club, is probably the best (maybe the only) road forward for Cork, and I fervently wish that this succeeds - I hope that other Cork City supporters are also mindfull of your point that it doesn't solve all ills.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
In fairness, I think his post already clarified for you, and comes to the same conclusions you did, more or less.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezeikial
With the revenue now only accepting the full amount or nothing by Friday, it really is the end of any hope that might have lingered there. Club will fold.
Terrible news, but dont see how they can come up with that money now.
I know some of our fans dont seem to care, but because of the crap we took from cork the last time we were in trouble.
Personally, i loved the matches we played against them, munster derby's were always the best. Good club with a good support!
Sympathy to all the Cork City fans though, and all the players and staff who will lose their jobs. Sad times!
When did this come about? The requirement of the full amount by Friday?Quote:
Originally Posted by adamd164
Today, after they met tom. He confirmed it on 96fm.Quote:
Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid
Well then thats certainly the final nail in the coffin.Quote:
Originally Posted by micls
Lets hope FORAS can save the club name and lets start again next year.
Talking about it on Liveline now.
firstly i have the utmost sympthy for all conected with CCFC however Cork city have been on a roller coaster of a ride for a number of years that could only end in tears, and should now serve as an example to all clubs on how not to do buisness (but alas this lesson will not be learned)
As somebody who supports a small club that has been sneared at because of its size and "because it is holding back the league" and while i personally feel sad at the demise of a LOI club i cannot help but feel a certain amount of contentment. (maybe not the right word)
finnally don you are wrong on so many levels foras should stand back and let the ship sink then try and save as many souls as possible before launching a new vessal
fair enought not voted, but i know a good few city fans, who were delighted when couglan arrived to save the club, everyone in cobh knew he was a pure chancer, hes well known and it was said, and the city fans defended him for the first 2 months, untill they saw who this guy was, moving the club shop to his building in the city center and moving the clubs offices to his hotel in cobh, and chargeing rent, hes probably a creditor of CCFC,Quote:
Originally Posted by razor
i believe from what ive heard that couglan actually has money and is capable of saving the club, but refurses to invest hes personal wealth, i dont understand this logic, why buy a club you dont want to invest in,
It was a cork city fan (who sometimes posts on here as well) that got me into irish domestic soccer when I was in college down there, so for me personally this is a very sad and dark day in domestic irish soccer history.
I found the Cork City supporters a great bunch and I enjoyed the atmosphere and being in the old shed. The league needs a team from Cork, the interest is clearly there so heres hoping that there will be some involvement in the league from there. The supporters, players and management are the real loosers here i feel particularly the supporters.
[QUOTE=Ezeikial;1200711]I'm not a Cork fan :confused: but yes, I'm strongly in favour of member-owned clubs.Quote:
It seems to me a reasonable interpretation of your original statement - if you mean something different, please clarify.
But it also opens up the possibility that a large number of people, led by a few, can also do something stupid. You don't need to search hard for the current evidence of this.
It's understandable that you would be in favour of a members-owned solution, given recent history at Cork City. A new FORAS-owned club, is probably the best (maybe the only) road forward for Cork, and I fervently wish that this succeeds - I hope that other Cork City supporters are also mindfull of your point that it doesn't solve all ills.
Your Bohs example is valid but not entirely representative.
[QUOTE=OneRedArmy;1200975]rovers would be the club to contact about that,Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezeikial
member clubs can be great or they can be a disaster,
personally i havent seen anything from FORAS in anyway that would say they could run a club, and if they do they should just start from scratch,
forget CCFC,
forget the crest,
foregt the players
and forget contract for the cross,
start a new club with a new name FC of Cork seems like a grand name, or Cork Rangers, design a new crest cause that one is god awful, and then go to the MFA and negotiate a better deal to play in the cross,
i think the funny thing is that a new club would most likely ascend the league rather quickly, and be back in the premier league in less than 5 years, but when it got to the top they would just GO FOR IT again,
Everyone in Cork had heard all the stories about Tom also but what choice did we have? It was Kieran McCarthys call, thanks Kieran.Quote:
Originally Posted by don ramo
Tom may well have the money, personally I don't believe that Tom has put one red cent into the club but thats just my opinion.
i thought FORAS worked with the examiner as a sort of official entity to represent the clubs interests, and i thought they released a statement sayin they were satisfied the right man had taken over the club,Quote:
Originally Posted by razor
am i wrong or is this true
[QUOTE]
Not representative of what?Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy;1200975
Your Bohs example is valid but not entirely representative.[/QUOTE
There are examples of member-owned clubs being run badly, and privately owned clubs being run well, and similarly vice versa.
While you favour member clubs, it does appear that we are both in agreement that the member-owned model is not automatically a panacea. The recent progress of Shamrock Rovers indicates what is possible, but equally Bohemains remain as the stand-out illustration of how a membership can be hoodwinked or deluded into colluding with financial recklessness.
The club being embedded in the community, and the community being embedded in the club, can occur in either scenario.
I think the point is that with a fan owned club the fans can at least call a halt even in some cases quite belatedly. This seems to be beginning at Bohs.
With clubs in the hands of one person they can do whatever they like no matter what the community or supporters feel about it, like with CCFC, where everyone could see it was a train-wreck in the making but TC was the only hand on the tiller.
I know last year with the talk about Roddy Collins investing in us with his cronies this was strongly opposed by our supporters club and trust.. so it shows that fan power does work as people would have withdrawn their subscriptions to the trust if Roddie was allowed near our club..Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr A
I remember some Cork city fans laughing on here at Dublin city folding .
What goes around eh.
But there's a difference between getting a license and keeping one.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
I'm not aware of any mechanism whereby a license can be removed mid-way through its valid period (i.e. the season). So you could meet the criteria, get your license, and then fall into a situation where you no longer match the criteria but still continue to the end of your license/the season.
Maybe I need to be a bit clearer. For every member controlled club you can name thats gone to the wall, I'll name 5 traditional owner-shareholder clubs that have done the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezeikial
The history of the League is littered with Tom Coughlan's who for various reasons ran clubs into the ground.
I'm not aware that's the case with member owned clubs.
As for why thats the case, transparent democracy generally tends to give oxygen to potential problems earlier.
Slightly strange statement from the FAI (as if they would or should get involved in helping in such a situation): http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/soc...251572071.html
This would be the 2nd time that a Cork City FC will be wound up, the last time in the 1939/40 season, they were wound up and replaced immediately by a new club, Cork United FC which took on City's results at that point.