Joey O'Brien

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Qwerty

Mind boggling. The Stepehen Ireland fiasco wasn't really a huge surprise but Joey O'Brien!! unless he was asked leading questions and it was a set up job by the journo. But if it's true then it is a disgrace when players like McGeady & McCarthy will have to put with abuse in every domestic game for their decision to play for Ireland. I think I am going to shift codes completely to rugby, if the players don't why should we??

---

and if u quit supporting irish football because of scenarios like this , then u are just as fragile to the irish cause as they are

u are better off supporting rugby if thats ur attitude....no loss

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shanekerins

And as for 'Irish football fans should support Irish teams', with the greatest respect - who the f*ck are you to tell people who they can and can't support? This isn't the Beijing Olympics, nobody has the right to demand a person cheer for any particular team.

---

You're so right. I agree 100%, and I'll be supporting Italy when they come to Croker ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by mark12345

What's your take on all the North Africans playing for France - would they have won the World Cup and Euro 2000 without the likes of Gallas, Vieira, Henry, Trezeguet etc? What about England and all the Carribean players they have had over the years? Mehmet Scholl for Germany, Platini for France instead of Italy. There have been many many examples through the years of players playing (or not playing) for the land of their parents - think of all those we lost to England.
.

---

Gallas and Henry were born and bred in Paris

I want cases of evidence not unsubstantiated hearssay!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bohemian1890

Its more than the granny rule tbh.

Qatar have something like 4 South Americans playing for them and a few Africans who have no family connections with them,Japan have one(Alex).Spain have Senna. The reason behind this is when you spend X amount of years resident in a country (time depends on country in question and varies between 5 and 10 years for most) you can apply for citizenship of that country.

For example Arsenal keeper Almunia and Cudicini of Chelsea could apply for English citizenship and passport next year and possibly be selected for England. This is the National Law of the countries in question and nothing to do with football. It would go against the Court of Human Rights to deny those players to play for 'their' new country as they hold a passport for that country.

Stephen Reid played for England?????? WHEN and at what age? ,didn't get picked for a bit then decided well ill play for Ireland,IMO players like that should not be allowed to just switch. They cannot switch if they have played for senior team but you can switch until your 21st birthday (provided no senior cap) - FIFA Rules

Another reason you highlighted above,Jack Charlton gave leaflets to certain Irish players and asked them to stick it on the back of the dressing room door.

Never heard that story being quoted anywhere, by anyone, former player/coach or any player that saw such a leafelt.

Quote names and places where read and players who took up any offer from these apparent leaflets rather than making stuff up.

From reading many books about the era from different people at the time (Aldridge, Bonner, Cascarino, McGrath and Charlton himself) What he (Jack C) did do is ask players to find out of any lads at their clubs that had Irish heritage. EG went to see John Aldridge at Oxford and Aldridge said he would play for Irleand and then asked what about Ray Houghton he is Irish...next thing Ray said he would be delighted with a call up and he got one.

It went along the lines of"do you have an Irish granny,would you like to play for Ireland":othat is how he found a couple of players

Just a few reasons of why it has become a joke:(.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gustavo

Gallas and Henry were born and bred in Paris

---

'Born and bred'? What exactly does that mean?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shanekerins View Post
And as for 'Irish football fans should support Irish teams', with the greatest respect - who the f*ck are you to tell people who they can and can't support? .

---

Alright, now I can stand in the Cussack Stand and shout "Forza Italia!" for 90 odd minutes without a hint of irony. You have made me see that supporting a team based on your country or community is silly unless they are some premiership side. So applying that Oirish Soccer Fan mentality to it's ultimate logical conclusion I will be supporting Italy at Croker and not that second rate rubbish.

What's the point in supporting second rate teams just because they are Irish...right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bohemian1890

No that happened when the Granny rule came in.

---

I suppose I should stop going to Ireland games as I wasn't dropped on Irish soil. Another t'ick tw*t that missed out the history lesson on emigration.:rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Boh_So_Good

Alright, now I can stand in the Cussack Stand and shout "Forza Italia!" for 90 odd minutes without a hint of irony. You have made me see that supporting a team based on your country or community is silly unless they are some premiership side. So applying that Oirish Soccer Fan mentality to it's ultimate logical conclusion I will be supporting Italy at Croker and not that second rate rubbish.

What's the point in supporting second rate teams just because they are Irish...right?

---

great post BSG. Bet you dont get one decent reply.

Back to the original point of the thread: O’Brien should just knuckle down and get on with it. I can understand that he was frustrated at being overlooked in favour of Gibson. In my opinion, given our scarce resources in CM, he was the most obvious candidate to replace S. Reid, especially as Trap cited height as a factor. He’s a useful squad player to have because of his versatility but on the basis of what I’ve seen Garvan and O’Toole excite me far more as a midfield prospect. With these two coming through and Kevin Foley as right back O’Brien may not even be in the squad on merit soon anyway.

Some good man management is required in these situations. Brady should have a word with him.

I took offence to the “sitting in the stands like a fan” remark, thinking it was patronising.

I know Dean Kiely has retired himself once but contrast recent remarks about working with Trap and the potential to learn from him even at 37 was just too much to turn down, with O’Brien’s petulant rant.

On the Granny Rule being the herald of international mockery:
Alfredo Di Stefano - see point 2.
Irish Footballers
It wasn't a mockery then. What has made it a mockery now are a hunsdred small little things over the years:
Things like certain clubs behaving like they are bigger than their FAs, and the FAs of other countries, and advising players which country they should declare (e.g. Kevin Gallen), or regularly announcing players are unfit, when two or three days later they can play without any difficulty in the clubs next game;
Things like players being told they are gods, and paid accordingly;
Things like it being quite easy to earn 100 caps without ever reaching a World Cup or Continental Cup finals;
Things like football being a way of becoming an endorsement specialist and shagging galmour models, rather than something you do because it is in your heart.

Looking back at people like Paddy Mulligan or Dave Langan, or many others, they didn't earn shedloads and did it because they loved it, for club and for country. Dave Langan has had many difficulties in the recent past, while Paddy Mulligan is a security guard now - I do not think that the likes of Joey O'Brien forsees that as his future at the age of 60 odd, and I would not class him in the same calibre of Mr. Mulligan or Mr Langan. Granted he is only young, but even so. As far as I am concerned, Joey O'Brien, like a number before him, fails to concern me any more.

What does concern me is that in five years' time we'll have a whole brigade announcing that the current management regime are muppets for failing to bring back poor put-upon Joey and Stephen, and that they should all be sacked. Football fans memories seem to be no more than a season or two long - the absence our little pre-Maradonas will be seen to be the reason we have failed to be at least one notch higher than we are, and the push to bring them back will mask any longer term real inadequacies in either the playing squad or the way that football in Ireland has been run for a number of years.

here here oh blue one. great post.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by John83

I'm sure there's a statto about could pull up the details.

---

I'm even surer Bohemian1890 should do it, seeing as how he said it

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

I'm even surer Bohemian1890 should do it, seeing as how he said it

---

Of course he should provide additional detail related to a statement he made on a forum which has been confirmed by several other people. It's, like, a law, innit?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lopez

'Born and bred'? What exactly does that mean?

---

It's is a saying , It means they were born and grew up there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Boh_So_Good

Alright, now I can stand in the Cussack Stand and shout "Forza Italia!" for 90 odd minutes without a hint of irony. You have made me see that supporting a team based on your country or community is silly unless they are some premiership side (Where did I say that?). So applying that Oirish Soccer Fan mentality to it's ultimate logical conclusion I will be supporting Italy at Croker and not that second rate rubbish.

What's the point in supporting second rate teams just because they are Irish...right?(Again, I didn't say that).

---

Just wrote a lengthy and thorough response to this, and then deleted it because you're a waste of time. If you think supporting a LOI team makes you a better Ireland fan than me (someone who has spent the vast majority of his life outside of Ireland, but doesn't support a foreign team), good for you. If you think it gives you the right to tell people who they can and can't support 'full stop', more power to you. I'd rather have this discussion with someone with a more balanced and less patronising way of thinking, and thats the end of it as far as my contribution is concerned. Feel free to misquote me to your hearts content.

Anyway, if O'Brien has been accurately quoted, he should be left of of the squad until a full public apology is issued. Time for Trap to send a message, that he is the boss and if you don't like his way of thinking then get your head down, work hard and force your way into the side, or else you won't be considered. Prima donna footballers **** me off!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gustavo

It's is a saying , It means they were born and grew up there.

---

Yes I know what it supposed to mean, although it seems to emphasize conception and birth, rather than the growing up bit. But what makes Viera and Desailly less French because they weren't born there, than two other players whose parents are African? (I'll leave Henry and some of the others as they're from French possessions in the West Indies, and therefore, even the official line of the FN and Jean Marie Le Pen, is that they're French) They played for France and captained France, yet they are both (along with Trezeguet) from countries that weren't even former French colonies.

And growing up in France. What difference did that make to their identity? Yeah, I'm sure soon as they arrived they took an instant love of snails, frogs legs, and Maurice Chevalier films. :rolleyes: I don't think it's wrong to question how actually 'French' these people are (even if it is perhaps often racist) when the same question is asked of how 'Irish' someone is who has two Irish parents, but happened to be born outside Ireland (and that is what the 'granny rule' includes).

One more point: But who the f*ck is this Joey O'Brien?

Shane, it was obvious what you said that they misquoted you, they took something completely out of context and made it into a "EL" bashing response, don't worry, most of you us knew what you meant ;)

Lopez he is a good friend of the dub Gartside who plays for Bolton and is a bit arrogant like his fellow peers.

You can't always trust how these player interview things are slanted. Although O'Brien was quoted publicly on RTE, I would be okay with if he grew up a bit and sorted it out with Trap etc.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by paul_oshea

Shane, it was obvious what you said that they misquoted you, they took something completely out of context and made it into a "EL" bashing response, don't worry, most of you us knew what you meant ;)

---

Cheers Paul, I'll get that tenner to you later :p

Why cant we all just get along ???? :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lopez

And growing up in France. What difference did that make to their identity? Yeah, I'm sure soon as they arrived they took an instant love of snails, frogs legs, and Maurice Chevalier films.

---

They grew up in the French football culture. They are part of the French football culture. They represent French football.

Quote:

---

I don't think it's wrong to question how actually 'French' these people are (even if it is perhaps often racist) when the same question is asked of how 'Irish' someone is who has two Irish parents, but happened to be born outside Ireland (and that is what the 'granny rule' includes).

---

They didn't grow up in the Irish football culture. They are not part of the Irish football culture. They don't represent Irish football. When they retire they'll go back to coaching and spouting sh1t about the game in Britain, apart from the occasional detour to spout sh1t about the (British) game in Ireland.

Is it me but it seems to be the Irish players who were born and lived in this country who don't seem to want to play for Ireland.

Look at Steve Reid, Carsley and Kilbane guys who would jump on the first plane to Dublin to play for "there" country.

The Charlton era was the same these boys showed more pride in the Irish jersey then some of our clowns.

I remember reading Cascarino book and him on about going to world cup 1982 to support England yet when asked to play for Ireland he gave 100% and wasn't always sulking. I know he was by no means world class but commitment he did give and so can be said for the rest of the English born guys who wore the green.

I hope these guys realise its a honour to play for your country not a right.

Who cares? the way I see it Joey O'Brien being in or out of the team isn't gonna be the difference between us being in SA or not. Same goes for Stephen Manchester as somebody further up quite fittingly labelled him. He's a luxury player for Man City and has never put in a decent 90mins for Ireland but did score a couple of goals for us, somewhat covering up pretty much non existant performances otherwise. On assessment of his performances for City he basically hangs around half way waiting for the counter attack and has plenty of energy saved to get in the box. Good eye for goal no doubt but a luxury we cannot afford, in fact Andy Reid would give a far more workman like performance if given the chance.;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shanekerins

Just wrote a lengthy and thorough response to this, and then deleted it because you're a waste of time.

---

Oh come now, tell the truth. You could not stand having your double standards held up to your face for absolute truism they forced you to confront.

The gas thing is that I find it simply amazing that the same Oirish/Oirland Premiership Cult Lemmings think nothing of slagging off Joey O'Brien or Stephen Ireland for turning their backs on Irish soccer while at the same time these "Ireland" supporters walk into Croker with Liverpool, Celtic and Man U scarves.

You can write all the lenghty posts you want to me. I don't care as I like the rest of LOI supporters are the only true Irish soccer supporters in this country (same for the IL supporters up North). And we know it, and so do you lot and deep down inside you're not... and never will be as long as you indulge in nuroisis of following the league next door cos "the Irish one is ****e", while supporting the Ireland national team because "YOU'LL NEVER BEAT THE IRISH!!!! even when they are being ran off the pitch by San Marino"

Gullible Morons and Tragic Lemmings every last one of you.

Here is another fact for you; for over 20 years now, Linfield have be more of Irish soccer team than any of the ROI squads have every been in that same time frame.

Dust the Walkers Crisp Crumbs out of the crack in your arse and deal with that one O' devoted Irish soccer fan.:D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Boh_So_Good

Oh come now, tell the truth. You could not stand having your double standards held up to your face for absolute truism they forced you to confront.

The gas thing is that I find it simply amazing that the same Oirish/Oirland Premiership Cult Lemmings think nothing of slagging off Joey O'Brien or Stephen Ireland for turning their backs on Irish soccer while at the same time these "Ireland" supporters walk into Croker with Liverpool, Celtic and Man U scarves.

You can write all the lenghty posts you want to me. I don't care as I like the rest of LOI supporters are the only true Irish soccer supporters in this country (same for the IL supporters up North). And we know it, and so do you lot and deep down inside you're not... and never will be as long as you indulge in nuroisis of following the league next door cos "the Irish one is ****e", while supporting the Ireland national team because "YOU'LL NEVER BEAT THE IRISH!!!! even when they are being ran off the pitch by San Marino"

Gullible Morons and Tragic Lemmings every last one of you.

Here is another fact for you; for over 20 years now, Linfield have be more of Irish soccer team than any of the ROI squads have every been in that same time frame.

Dust the Walkers Crisp Crumbs out of the crack in your arse and deal with that one O' devoted Irish soccer fan.:D

---

WTF was that all about

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Boh_So_Good

I don't care as I like the rest of LOI supporters are the only true Irish soccer supporters in this country

---

No you are not.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hibernian

WTF was that all about

---

Not sure, I think he's got a little bit of sand in his vagina.

Tell you what mate, you buy me a season's worth of flights from England to Cork next season and I'll get myself a season ticket to my hometown club. I've already got the shirt and the flag I bought from the CCFC shop earlier this year to try and do my bit when the club were in financial trouble, so I should fit right in. No worries about the Celtic/Liverpool/Man U scarf, I don't actually have any of them...actually, come to think of it, I don't support any foreign sides! And you know what? Even if I did, it wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference. Crazy how when you make assumptions you end up with egg on your self-satisfied little face.

Let me know when my first flight leaves mate. If you care to lie down underneath the wheels at take-off you would make my day.

Edit - Does anyone know if this guy is actually for real? Beginning to think I may be the victim of a wind-up here...

Generally kids start following soccer at the ages 8-12 maybe and without knowing much about anything we start watching the English club matches with far more enthusiasm than that of our own League. Once you've been supporting a certain club for a number of yrs it isn't that easy just to turn it off, plus why the f**k should we, just because some pretentious idiot like yourself feels that we should. If I support Man U, Cork City, Liverpool or feckin Glasgow Rangers then that's my choice and i certainly don't feel any less Irish because some Dalymount dick thinks I should.

But my brother goes to every Cork City home game, a few away ones too, and is also a staunch Man United supporter. Surely this is impossible...have I been living in a dream?

No. Some people just talk crap.

As for Joey O'Brien; he may as well concentrate on his club career if he does not want to be a bench warmer. Unsurprisingly, that is where he seems to be spending most of his time at Bolton anyway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Boh_So_Good

Oh come now, tell the truth. You could not stand having your double standards held up to your face for absolute truism they forced you to confront.

The gas thing is that I find it simply amazing that the same Oirish/Oirland Premiership Cult Lemmings think nothing of slagging off Joey O'Brien or Stephen Ireland for turning their backs on Irish soccer while at the same time these "Ireland" supporters walk into Croker with Liverpool, Celtic and Man U scarves.

You can write all the lenghty posts you want to me. I don't care as I like the rest of LOI supporters are the only true Irish soccer supporters in this country (same for the IL supporters up North). And we know it, and so do you lot and deep down inside you're not... and never will be as long as you indulge in nuroisis of following the league next door cos "the Irish one is ****e", while supporting the Ireland national team because "YOU'LL NEVER BEAT THE IRISH!!!! even when they are being ran off the pitch by San Marino"

Gullible Morons and Tragic Lemmings every last one of you.

Here is another fact for you; for over 20 years now, Linfield have be more of Irish soccer team than any of the ROI squads have every been in that same time frame.

Dust the Walkers Crisp Crumbs out of the crack in your arse and deal with that one O' devoted Irish soccer fan.:D

---

I honestly think you are embarassing the league with a response like that. I love going to LOI games and enjoy supporting Bohs and see football week in week out and would encourage people to do so.

However if somebody is not living in Ireland and they were not born there it is very hard for them to support a League of Ireland team. Some of the most die hard Irish fans are 2nd Generation fans and I hope that does not sound patronising.

Your post makes so many generalisations and does not do your point any good. Arrogance and vitriol are never good in a debate and lessen your point even if you aspects of truth in it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BarelyLegal

Who cares? the way I see it Joey O'Brien being in or out of the team isn't gonna be the difference between us being in SA or not. Same goes for Stephen Manchester as somebody further up quite fittingly labelled him. He's a luxury player for Man City and has never put in a decent 90mins for Ireland but did score a couple of goals for us, somewhat covering up pretty much non existant performances otherwise. On assessment of his performances for City he basically hangs around half way waiting for the counter attack and has plenty of energy saved to get in the box. Good eye for goal no doubt but a luxury we cannot afford, in fact Andy Reid would give a far more workman like performance if given the chance.;)

---

To say that Ireland is a luxury we cant afford is an exercise in wishful thinking. I would suggest that Whelan, Gibson, Andrews et al are medoicrities that we cant afford. Ireland's work rate for City is outstanding. I suggest you watch him over 90 minutes and not just the highlights of his goals and killer passes. It's one thing saying that Ireland should not be welcomed back, but to argue that Whelan, Gibson and A.Reid are better players is ludicrous. I suppose that's why they are all warming the bench at their respective clubs whilst Ireland is winning plaudits from respected football journalists like Paddy Barclay week in week out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by third policeman

To say that Ireland is a luxury we cant afford is an exercise in wishful thinking. I would suggest that Whelan, Gibson, Andrews et al are medoicrities that we cant afford. Ireland's work rate for City is outstanding. I suggest you watch him over 90 minutes and not just the highlights of his goals and killer passes. It's one thing saying that Ireland should not be welcomed back, but to argue that Whelan, Gibson and A.Reid are better players is ludicrous. I suppose that's why they are all warming the bench at their respective clubs whilst Ireland is winning plaudits from respected football journalists like Paddy Barclay week in week out.

---

Reading your posts is like listening to a mate whose bird broke up with him ages ago but he still constantly goes on about her and the possibility of them getting back together.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by third policeman

To say that Ireland is a luxury we cant afford is an exercise in wishful thinking. I would suggest that Whelan, Gibson, Andrews et al are medoicrities that we cant afford. Ireland's work rate for City is outstanding. I suggest you watch him over 90 minutes and not just the highlights of his goals and killer passes. It's one thing saying that Ireland should not be welcomed back, but to argue that Whelan, Gibson and A.Reid are better players is ludicrous. I suppose that's why they are all warming the bench at their respective clubs whilst Ireland is winning plaudits from respected football journalists like Paddy Barclay week in week out.

---

Well, his work rate was always appalling when he was playing for us. Unless he comes back 100% committed, I wouldn't want him anywhere near the squad. He was an embarrassment in his last appearance for us.

I read somewhere that the Scottish FA had considered a lifetime ban for Kris Boyd for walking out recently and that would certainly sort out this problem once and for all. Suffice to say if we actually qualify for something the likes of Ireland and the O'Briens will be interested in playing again. As for Joey O'B, I hope he either comes out and clears up any misunderstanding, or is dropped from the squad. After all we managed with David O'Leary for a while and it didnt hurt us as much as much as it must have hurt him watching Euro 88.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lopez

I suppose I should stop going to Ireland games as I wasn't dropped on Irish soil. Another t'ick tw*t that missed out the history lesson on emigration.:rolleyes:

---

Well tw*t is a very English word,so maybe you should follow them??In Ireland we would call you a c*nt.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BarelyLegal

Generally kids start following soccer at the ages 8-12 maybe and without knowing much about anything we start watching the English club matches with far more enthusiasm than that of our own League. Once you've been supporting a certain club for a number of yrs it isn't that easy just to turn it off, plus why the f**k should we, just because some pretentious idiot like yourself feels that we should. If I support Man U, Cork City, Liverpool or feckin Glasgow Rangers then that's my choice and i certainly don't feel any less Irish because some Dalymount dick thinks I should.

---

Why should S.Ireland play for Ireland,or JOB just because some idiot like yourself feels he should??

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bohemian1890

Well tw*t is a very English word,so maybe you should follow them??In Ireland we would call you a c*nt.

---

Well c*nt is a German word, so maybe you should follow them??

FFS lads, I only made the comment that 'Irish people should support Irish teams' in response to the original poster's notion that 'Irish people should withdraw their support for teams who don't let players from small countries represent said country', or words to that effect.
You know the expression, 'Ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer'? It's hardly going to make any difference if a few people here stop buying Liverpool jersies because Rafa would rather Robbie stay at Melwood than play for us.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sheridan

They grew up in the French football culture. They are part of the French football culture. They represent French football.
They didn't grow up in the Irish football culture. They are not part of the Irish football culture. They don't represent Irish football. When they retire they'll go back to coaching and spouting sh1t about the game in Britain, apart from the occasional detour to spout sh1t about the (British) game in Ireland.

---

What a ridiculous post. Obviously all of the young Africans playing in the Premiership shouldn't play for their country as they don't represent their countries football culture - whatever the f*ck that is. Or even Fabregas, never played a senior game in Spain in his life - how can he be part of his countries "football culture". Last I heard you are representing your country when pulling on the green shirt, not the "football culture" of that country as dictated by LOI fascists.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Boh_So_Good

I don't care as I like the rest of LOI supporters are the only true Irish soccer supporters in this country (same for the IL supporters up North). And we know it, and so do you lot and deep down inside you're not...
Gullible Morons and Tragic Lemmings every last one of you.

---

I was born and raised in England to Irish parents and bear little if any affinity to any LOI club. This isn't particularly my choice, it is more of a result that I wasn't exposed to it in the same way with which I was exposed to English soccer teams, resulting in me supporting Nottingham Forest. Since I have been old enough to watch soccer, which is a considerable period of time I have always supported the Irish national side, I don't remember the last time I didn't watch any of their games (I would actually go to the live games if i wasn't stumping up unreal post-grad uni fees). Where do I, and others like me fit into your twisted logic?