Do they pay income tax on any of this?Quote:
Originally Posted by Stato
If they all share a car they each get the mileage (not that I totally object to this, as a sometime environmentalist I like to see car-pooling).
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Do they pay income tax on any of this?Quote:
Originally Posted by Stato
If they all share a car they each get the mileage (not that I totally object to this, as a sometime environmentalist I like to see car-pooling).
Before we all get carried away with another wave of referee bashing a few facts should be considered.
1. Mick Wallace should not have made the referees fees public. There is an agreed framework for Mr Wallace to follow if he has a grievance with this. As its general practice for clubs not to release the earnings of their players then the same respect should be accorded to referees.
2. All fees and expenses are set and agreed at the start of the season. All clubs are made aware of this agreement. Expense claims etc are subject to audit and approval by the FAI before they are paid to referees. In the FAI Cup/friendlies all fees and expenses are paid on the night.
3. Fans are generally not aware of the time and commitment involved in refereeing in the Eircom League. Increased requirements in the areas of fitness, diet, time off work, family commitments etc are not taken into consideration when discussing referee's fees. Aside from the day of the match, referees are training 4/5 days a week and are performing on a semi-professional basis. There are several fitness tests during the season to ensure all officials meet UEFA fitness standards.
4. In comparison to leagues of a similar size in Europe (not the big 5), the match fees paid to Eircom League referee's are significantly lower.
5. Refereeing is a pressurised job that not many are willing to take on. Add to that the levels of physical and verbal abuse that referee's are likely to encounter and one could argue that the fees are very modest indeed. When one considers the amount EL clubs are paying their players these days, referee's can hardly be blamed for bleeding clubs dry.
6. Referees are an easy target and its too easy to constantly criticise decisions and say they are not fit. Football is a game of opinions and the referee is likely to be a controversial participant when a critical decision is to be made. Human error is part of football (by both players and officials!), its always been part of the game and more than likely will be for a some time to come. Referee's do their utmost to ensure mistakes are not made.
So lay off the guys in black and give them a break. Ok, so some decisions infuriate you now and again but lets keep a balanced perspective...they're not responsible for all the worlds problems!!
I have no sympathy for refs, do your job and nothing will be said to you. If you are not capable of doing your job you will get abuse so i would say leave it then.
Not really, but neither would I have a problem with someone publishing the typical cost of a plumber.Quote:
Originally Posted by Battery Rover
Dubref makes some good points. Maybe Wexford Youths are a bit different given their amateur status, but most clubs around have more pressing financial worries than the cost of referees. Finally, I'd like to point out that the referee is likely costing less than the electricity to run the floodlights during the game.
good post!Quote:
Originally Posted by DubRef
yes, but often we have seen referees requiring the floodlights to be switched on even though the light is more than adequate!Quote:
Originally Posted by John83
I agreeQuote:
Originally Posted by DubRef
They're all too acutely aware of the absolute balls they make of a lot of people's (paid and unpaid) hard work, though.Quote:
3. Fans are generally not aware of the time and commitment involved in refereeing in the Eircom League.
So is the standard of refereeing, as European games prove every season.Quote:
4. In comparison to leagues of a similar size in Europe (not the big 5), the match fees paid to Eircom League referee's are significantly lower.
Clubs make a conscious and informed decision to pay players as they choose based on the player's perceived ability. They have to fork out for chancers like Tomney regardless of what crimes they perpetrate against the game.Quote:
When one considers the amount EL clubs are paying their players these days, referee's can hardly be blamed for bleeding clubs dry.
I agree. It's far too easy to say that about Irish referees, and that's the problem.Quote:
6. Referees are an easy target and its too easy to constantly criticise decisions and say they are not fit.
I believe that the fees for refs are a commercial agreement between FAI and Club and should not be put out to the public like any agreement of that kind.
Someone can correct me on that if its wrong.
Would you ever cop on?Quote:
Originally Posted by DubRef
Firstly can I ask you about your username ' DubRef' and ask if your opinion comes from a neutral position?
Why should this information not be made public? If it involves the everyday cost of running our league, then supporters should know where their entrance fee is being spent.
Read the first post by me here, I am not referring to the quality of refereees
After watching Bohs 2 home European games, I wouldn't agree with that sentiment. See Heary's red card as evidence. Maybe the less experienced refs are assigned to the Intertoto admittedly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheridan
Having seen our euro game, Im with you.Quote:
Originally Posted by misterk
I'm with DubRef on this one
Can I ask you about your username and ask if your opinion comes from a neutral position?Quote:
Originally Posted by oldyouth
Yes you did.Quote:
Originally Posted by oldyouth
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldyouth
Do you want it to be public how much every player, the backroom staff, the electricity, the ballboys.................how much all of them make? How much does it cost to produce your programme? Some of the information regarding the expenses of the club is also private information regarding individuals, and should be respected as such.Quote:
Originally Posted by oldyouth
It's up to each ref to declare his earnings to the Revenue each year and pay any tax due. Given that the Revenue have been keeping a very close eye on the clubs in recent times I've no doubt that the refs are paying tax on it.Quote:
Originally Posted by monutdfc
As far as I'm aware this is checked and, say you've four officials travelling in one car from Cork to Galway, only the driver gets the mileage.Quote:
Originally Posted by monutdfc
Just a couple of points I'd like to add:
The fees and expenses are not agreed with the clubs, they are agreed by the referees representatives and the FAI and are imposed on the clubs, the clubs have no say in their level whatsoever. As a result Mick Wallace has no framework that he can follow to air his grievance.Quote:
Originally Posted by DubRef
I'd love to know how that Armenian ref who reffed the Olimps v Pats match manages to pass these tests!Quote:
Originally Posted by DubRef
But referees know this is part of the job before they even take up refereeing. The abuse can be even greater at lower levels where the referees fees are smaller. I don't believe it's a job someone takes up for the money.Quote:
Originally Posted by DubRef
Between league, cup, friendlies, A league and U20 games it's possible that a club could pay anywhere from €15K to €20K a year on referees' fees. For clubs towards the lower end of the table that could represent the gate receipts from two or three home fixtures so it's not an insignificant amount, hence Mick Wallace's gripe.Quote:
Originally Posted by DubRef
Just because he was huge doesn't mean he wasn't fit. He easily kept the pace of the game and, IMO, was one of the better refs I've seen this yearQuote:
Originally Posted by Stato