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How much stronger can they be? Italy are Italy. They have better player than us, thats a given. I just think people are refuting that they are somehow a team which we couldn't possibly beat.
I do think people are under estimating their performance in Euro 2008. Against France they played welll, and were unlucky against Romania(as in luck was against them)
Toni is one of the world's premier strikers who is having a bad tournament.
The way some of you are writing him and his team off is ridiculous.
We shouldn't fear Italy but to completely write them off and say they don't have a talented squad or have any talent breaking through is wrong. They still have one of the most talented squads in Europe and considering they'll have a new manager in place for the Euros you can't completely judge them on this tournament. Remember, they went out at the group stages of Euro 2004 before going on to win the World Cup 2 years later.
We can beat them, but Italy will start the qualification campaign as one of the favourites to win the tournament itself.
Well I'll take the positive view that although Lippi will have have plenty of time to prepare them for qualification we will also be learning our new system under Trap. We never get hammered except in Cyprus:( and could easily get 2 draws or even one win one loss. I do agree we don't have much coming through but have any of you seen much of Keith Andrews at the MK Dons? At 27 I don't know and even if he gets a move and follow Ince to Blackburn is he up to it? I've seen a bit of Owen Garvan and believe he will play a vital role but is he too young at this level. Just wondering after reading the Italian players listed who are under 25 what do we have in comparison?
I'm not insulting anyone, I personally prefer the Serie A to the English Premier (and La Liga is better than both of them), but a well organised Irish team (and I believe we will be) have nothing to fear of an aging Italian team. The majority of those 'youngsters' mentioned previously are failing to live up to their potential (whens the last time someone thought Cassano was a world beater for instance), and a disciplined defence, marshalled by Dunne, should be able to handle Toni, Grosso (who I think is a superb player), Del Piero etc. Pirlo is the main danger to this team, and neutralising him will be the difference between getting points off Italy and failing to qualify in my eyesQuote:
Originally Posted by Ciaran
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Originally Posted by Ciaran
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Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
Are you trying to be ironic with that last post?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ciaran
Okay - let me put it another way - how many of our players would get into Italy's starting first-choice XI?Quote:
Originally Posted by Razors left peg
About 3 which is the same number even during the Charlton era I'd expect to get in to the Italian team.Quote:
Originally Posted by Emmet
Yes im sure everyone who has said a bad word about Italy or the Serie A obviously doesnt know a damn thing about it:rolleyes:. Serie A is strugglin at the moment, and there are few that can deny that. Their champions Inter were knocked out by the 4th best team in England, Roma to Man Utd and AC Milan to Arsenal. Up to a couple of years ago that would have been unthinkable. The quality in Serie A is not what it was, the Italian youth breaking through is not the quality it used to be. Of course they will be overwhelming favourites when we play them, but there have been many better Italian squads in the past 10 years, there is non reason why we cant be positive to a certain level.Quote:
This thread is hilarious. I like how people here diss Serie A and the Italian squad without knowing a damn thing about it.
Exactly. Too many people think 'Oh its Italy, we havent a hope in the world against them'. I hate this mentality. If we go with the right belief and the correct tactics we are capable of getting a result against them. Romania, a decent and capable team but no world beaters, cause the Italians quite a lot of problems when they picked up the courage to attack them rather than sitting back. There isn't a single team in the world that Ireland should be afraid of playing, or who i think Ireland wouldnt have a hope against, and certainly not this Italian squad.Quote:
it doesnt mean we have to be afraid of any team
If you dont have hope and fight what is the point in turning up.Fight to the death and hope for the best.Quote:
Originally Posted by carloz
I saw some of their games too. The first game after the world cup the lost in Livorno 2-0 to Croatia (friendly). Then they played Lithuania in Napoli (I think) and only drew 1-1. Then they lost 3-1 at the Stade de France (in truth it could have 5-1). The Italians, like any big team, can be beaten. Scotland nearly beat them away in Bari, and they only just beat the Faroe Islands 2-1 away in June last year. The Dutch just creamed them 3-0 and the Romanians had the lion's share of the game 2 weeks ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Razors left peg
We should be looking for at least 3 points off them in our games.
I could see the likes of Keane and Duff making the squad but they are not good enough to get into their starting XI. Given wouldn't get in ahead of Buffon ... I can't think of any of our current team who would get into Italy's first-choice side - who are your three?Quote:
Originally Posted by OwlsFan
I'm not saying that we should go into the matches expecting to lose - I'm saying that Italy are significantly better than we are and have significantly better players than we do. Reading some of the comments in this thread you'd think it was San Marino (a side we only just managed to beat don't forget) we were going to play. A little bit of perspective wouldn't go amiss here: they are the World Champions!!
In the last eight years, in competitive games, we've played Holland twice, Portugal twice, Germany three times, France twice and Spain once. In not one of those games have we been outclassed. Beaten, indeed, on only two occasions (Germany and France, both 1-0) - but we've always been competitive, and have never been on the end of thrashings. I've said it before - it's our form against the smaller teams that has let us down in previous campaigns.
Between 2000 and 2002, we went unbeaten in six competitive games against Holland, Portugal, Germany and Spain. We did that with limited players such as Harte, Carr, Staunton, Gary Kelly, Breen, Kinsella, Holland, Kilbane and McAteer playing key roles.
Back then, were coming up against far superior squads (on paper), and we matched them, because we were motivated, hungry, well-organised, hard-working and well-balanced. I firmly believe that, by next April, those qualities will have returned, and we'll be in good shape. Italy do have a far more high-profile and talented squad than us, and they remain overwhelming favourites, on current form, to top the group. To take any points from the Italians, we'll need a lot of luck, but I wouldn't write us off. I think our games will be tight. Just think of Wales in October 2002.
Very few but again that isnt the point. A very well organised team is greater than the sum of its parts, for instance, how many of the Romanian players would get in the Dutch team and yet they finished ahead of them in qualifying, the same with Croatia and England.We could even look to out own past, we qualified for the 2002 world cup beating a Dutch team that on paper looked frightening, we have beaten England,Italy,Spain,Portugal etc all of whom on paper looked out of our depth.Quote:
Originally Posted by Emmet
Im far from writing off Italy,as world champions they deserve alot of respect but that doesnt mean that year after year they are going to be the best team in the World.Sometimes a country will have a dip for a few years in the talent it produces.Ciaran listed off a number of players and while I have no doubt they are good players I dont think that they are of the same level as the players that won the World Cup 2 years ago.As has been said by someone else here there is often a tendancy to look at someone like Italy and instantly think that they are too good for us. I would prefer to look at it from the point that we have some decent players ourselves under the guidence of a world class manager and that we can punch above our weight because of it.... Christ we even managed to do ok against the Germans under Staunton and it looks like they are gonna make the Euro finals!
excellent post supreme feet , good points well made , you even have a doubter like me questioning my reasoning for my current gloom ! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Supreme feet
I agree with the above post, it makes an excellent point. One minor thing I would disagree with is placing Harte and Breen in the "limited" players section. I think both were excellent players and very much underrated. Breen could read the game like a book, and he rarely mis-timed a tackle. Ian Harte was a great player, not a world class defender, but so very good going forward. If he had the right player playing infront of him, one who could track back and cover him, he would offer so much going forward. He was a great set piece player, and this even overlapped into crossing ability when the ball was in active play as long as he had a bit of time. Time and again his set piece delivery made the difference for us. He was one of the best free kick takers of the modern era.
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Originally Posted by Ciaran
How many players can they play - 11
How many players will we have - 11
Somtimes having too many players to choose from can be a hinderance, and as posted out we have nothng to fear against the top teams it's the Georgia's we need to be afraid of, very afraid of.
Most of whom would walk into the team now ... I'm not saying some of the current squad don't have the potential to be players like those you've listed there - but at the moment we have a squad that is probably the worst Irish squad for nearly three decades.Quote:
Originally Posted by Supreme feet
The point is that their eleven players are a wee bit better at football than our eleven players :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenforever