Children's school books featuring gay characters

David Quinn made the best argument there could be for getting religion out of our schools. He's nothing but a homophobic bigot. The way the Catholic Fundamentalist tried to hide behind the schools Muslim children was disgusting. Maybe we shouldn't have school books with black characters because most of the population are white?

btw Gay couple's can have children. Obviously Lesbian couple's can give birth, and Gay men can adopt. Primary school is 100% the right age to start introducing gay characters to children.

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Originally Posted by pete

Far too much seems to be made of this. From what I heard the school & parents decided to do this so no one is being forced into anything.

Sure haven't half the cartoon cartoon characters of the 70s and 80s proven to be gay?

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Ernie and Bert from Sesame Street surely. :eek:

How is the gay guy going to be represented in the books ? Are they just going to get in more trouble for stereotyping a gay man.


ive no problem with it it prob a good idea to get kids used to the idea but I don’t think it will do a lot of good I think a lot of kids prejudices is learnt at home

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Originally Posted by anto1208

How is the gay guy going to be represented in the books ? Are they just going to get in more trouble for stereotyping a gay man.


ive no problem with it it prob a good idea to get kids used to the idea but I don’t think it will do a lot of good I think a lot of kids prejudices is learnt at home

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Anyone remember the Ann and Barry books?

Ann is in the park. Barry is in the shop buying some bread and some jam. "Hellooooo dahlings" says the man.

Doesn't that make Bosco a Swordsman of the highest order?

He practically lived in a box........................

......coats on the way.................. :o :o

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12.../Golliwogs.jpg

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Originally Posted by CameramanConka

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12.../Golliwogs.jpg

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Golliwogs have apparently been removed from kids books in recent years. I heard the whole sharing the same bed thing also removed from I think it was Postman Pat...

I'm a teacher and would be delighted if we had something like this(highly unlikely as it, like most schools, is a Catholic school).

I teach 3rd and 4th class and this is the age they need to be taught that differences are there and how to deal with them.

I regularly hear the kids using terms like gay in a derogatory way. They dont mean harm and are only copying what they hear but with more explanation and understanding they could avoid it.

Of course the first time they see a homosexual character they will react strangely. Probably make 'jokes' about it, and will have a lot of questions. But once these are dealt with appropriately it can only be to the benefit of the child.

It's better that they deal with these inevitable questions about people who are different than them, early and through characters than being thrown into a situation where they meet someone who is gay and have to try to deal with it then.

Educate together schools are really doing a fantastic job in trying to educate children in tolerance and understanding. I only wish all the majority of schools were the same

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Originally Posted by CameramanConka

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12.../Golliwogs.jpg

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Enid Blyton wrote a book like that? :eek:

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Originally Posted by gilberto_eire

Enid Blyton wrote a book like that? :eek:

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She wrote several stories about Golliwogs, not Gay Wogs- that one's a cover that's been edited.

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Originally Posted by GavinZac

She wrote several stories about Golliwogs, not Gay Wogs- that one's a cover that's been edited.

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Sorry i read it as ''Gay Golliwogs'' did'nt notice the edit at all, it just did'nt look out of place on the eye and i assumed Golli was there too!

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Originally Posted by pete

Golliwogs have apparently been removed from kids books in recent years. I heard the whole sharing the same bed thing also removed from I think it was Postman Pat...

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Think that was Noddy and Big Ears. I vaguely remember the likes of dialogue in the old Enid Blyton books. Stuff like 'I feel jolly gay', and stuff. She was fond of throwing in the golliwog stuff too...

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Originally Posted by Pauro 76

Think that was Noddy and Big Ears. I vaguely remember the likes of dialogue in the old Enid Blyton books. Stuff like 'I feel jolly gay', and stuff. She was fond of throwing in the golliwog stuff too...

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The golliwog stuff was genuine casual racism, I think, but gay really didn't have any connotations outside of happy when she was writing.

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Originally Posted by John83

The golliwog stuff was genuine casual racism, I think, but gay really didn't have any connotations outside of happy when she was writing.

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It was casual racism that was very much a product of the society she lived in, much like her portrayal of gypsies. It's often castigated, but on closer inspection her golliwog and gypsy characters weren't always the bad characters, as is often suggested by the anti-Blyton establishment. Her most famous character George from the Famous Five is very much an early portrayal of a strong feminist, and quite probably a lesbian, interestingly she's also probably the character most closely based on Blyton herself. I think suggestions of homosexuality in her characters was quite possibly deliberate, she was a very intelligent, if a touch crazy, person. Her biography makes for an interesting read. I'm a fan anyway. My dissertation may have been on the Famous Five. Yes I'm that sad. :(

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Originally Posted by passinginterest

It was casual racism that was very much a product of the society she lived in, much like her portrayal of gypsies. It's often castigated, but on closer inspection her golliwog and gypsy characters weren't always the bad characters, as is often suggested by the anti-Blyton establishment. Her most famous character George from the Famous Five is very much an early portrayal of a strong feminist, and quite probably a lesbian, interestingly she's also probably the character most closely based on Blyton herself. I think suggestions of homosexuality in her characters was quite possibly deliberate, she was a very intelligent, if a touch crazy, person. Her biography makes for an interesting read. I'm a fan anyway. My dissertation may have been on the Famous Five. Yes I'm that sad. :(

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It was a different world back then. When the Black and White Minstrel Show was huge and not many people were offended.

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Originally Posted by passinginterest

It was casual racism that was very much a product of the society she lived in, much like her portrayal of gypsies. It's often castigated, but on closer inspection her golliwog and gypsy characters weren't always the bad characters, as is often suggested by the anti-Blyton establishment.

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I think so too.

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Her most famous character George from the Famous Five is very much an early portrayal of a strong feminist, and quite probably a lesbian, interestingly she's also probably the character most closely based on Blyton herself.

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That's interesting. I haven't read much in the way of biography on Blyton herself.

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I think suggestions of homosexuality in her characters was quite possibly deliberate, she was a very intelligent, if a touch crazy, person.

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In the form of George, yes, I always assumed she was at least based on someone Blyton knew. I was referring only to the use of the word 'gay' in her books. Are there other Blyton characters whose sexuality is doubted? I don't recall the Secret Seven characters too well, or do you mean some other character? I haven't read any Blyton since I was a kid, and any connotations would have passed right over my head back then.

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My dissertation may have been on the Famous Five. Yes I'm that sad. :(

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She's one of the most widely read children's authors ever, and has remained popular for decades - I recall seeing somewhere that she's been translated as often as Shakespeare. I think that merits someone's attention. ;)

I was thinking along the lines of the Noddy and Big Ears sharing a bed thing. Intimate relationships between older gentlemen and younger boys is something that's quite a common theme in history. It may have been painted in an innocent light a lot of the time, and I'd imagine Blyton was looking at it this way, but it's something worth considering.

I'd definitely recommend having a look at her biography, Barbara Stoney is the author of the official one. Blyton had a very strange relationship with her own children, which Stoney only really touches on, she seemed to be jealous of them and spent very little time with them.

Was just googling around the subject, and found this excerpt from The Three Golliwogs:

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Once the three bold Golliwogs, Golly, Woggie, and ******, decided to go for a walk to Bumble-Bee Common. Golly wasn't quite ready so Woggie and ****** said they would start off without him, and Golly would catch them up as soon as he could. So off went Woggie and ******, arm-in-arm, singing merrily their favourite song - which, as you may guess, was Ten Little ****** Boys.

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Those asterisks are foot.ie's take on a word rhyming with 'digger'. That's spectacularly racist by modern standards.

EDIT: Oh, and Ten Little ******* is the name of a children's poem, sometimes set to music, which celebrates the deaths of ten Black children, one-by-one.

Veering wildly off topic at the moment, but anyway, it says an awful lot about the prevailing views at the time that a story like that ever got published.

It's probably not something we'd recommend as casual reading for our children today! It is, however, a useful social document that illustrates very well the fact that just because a belief is widely sociably acceptable today doesn't mean it's right, or that it will be OK in the future.

It just goes to show that society progresses and it'll probably seem bizarre in 50 years time that we were having a debate about something as normal as homosexual characters in children's books (by then it'll probably be sadomasochism or something!).

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Originally Posted by passinginterest

Veering wildly off topic at the moment, but anyway, it says an awful lot about the prevailing views at the time that a story like that ever got published.

It's probably not something we'd recommend as casual reading for our children today! It is, however, a useful social document that illustrates very well the fact that just because a belief is widely sociably acceptable today doesn't mean it's right, or that it will be OK in the future.

It just goes to show that society progresses and it'll probably seem bizarre in 50 years time that we were having a debate about something as normal as homosexual characters in children's books (by then it'll probably be sadomasochism or something!).

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Jaysis, that's a bit mad. Thankfully we've moved with the times, that's quite shocking! Even in the 70s, early 80s, stuff like 'Black and White Minstrels' was quite popular, Alf Garnett's views were acceptable and the like... Amazing how we've moved on and what passes for shocking now, will be relatively normal in a generation's time.