Stan's passion. And the pressure he is under

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Mick McCarthy's record at first wasnt great either but he improved and got us to the world cup and i think Stan needs time and he can do the same, just maybe not first time round

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I think this is a very relevant comparasion. By the end of his tenure, Mick McCarthy was a very decent manager but in his first tcampaign we were often a shambles reminiscent of Stan's early form - the only saving grace for McCarthy was a shockingly handy group which Ireland struggled to fisnish second in (think Romania won all but 1 of their games and drew with us in Dublin). Staunton didn't have such a luxury. It wasn't a good appointment but he's there now and hopefully we can build on the last few results.

(a) McCarthy had previous managerial experience and had done reasonably well. Staunton had nothing.
(b) McCarthy suffered no defeats like 5-2 in Cyprus or 4-0 against Holland.
(c) You could at least see, even from the start, that McCarthy's teams knew what they were trying to do. Of necessity, he had to blood a load of new players, but there was always a game plan. I honestly don't think that was the case in Cyprus, in San Marino or at home against Holland.

I dont think there was a game plan to Mc Carthys early teams. We went from 3 5 2 and also playing Keane at sweeper. We swapped around a few times. Mc Carthy learned on the job and Staunton is too. I did not agree with either appointment but I did agree with the Kerr one. I could turn out to be wrong on all fronts but at the time of the appointments I believe I was right.

3-5-2, sweeper, etc, was at least a plan. We were experimenting, trying things out. In the Stan games I mentioned, I don't think the players had a notion what they were doing.

ok we played 4 4 2 against Cyrus that does not mean we had a plan. Just cause we had a formation under Mc Carthy early on does not mean we had a plan. I thought Mc Carthy went on to learn on the job and we played some good football and by the end of it we had a solid 4 4 2 formation with plenty of balance but there is no doubt that we were pretty clueless early on with Ian Harte and centre back and Roy Keane as sweeper. I think there is a good few similarities between Staunton and Mc Carthy on this. Also I think the players liked Mc Carthy and they seem to like Staunton. I am not so sure they grew to like Kerr and as a result they played like that towards the end. However Kerr was a better tactician than either of them when he got the job.

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Originally Posted by Tuff Paddy

The first thing he did as manager was declare that we were building for the WC in 2010. Hardly smacks of ambition now does it?

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Look TP , whats done is done . stans foibles have been gone into on this board on enough occasions. now is the time to look forward. from previous posts i think we need 4 poins from this trip and i do not think we can get them. ideally beating the czechs or at worst drawing 2-2 with them , we will then need to beat the germans czechs and welsh , a massive order imo. but if we come back from the east with 4 points then other results could start going our way and obviate the need to beat both germany and wales. feck it if you cant be optimistic whats the point in being a football fan at all??

But my point is that, while we had players out of position and McCarthy certainly made mistakes (from which he learnt), I don't recall any of the clueless performances like those I mentioned.

It's not to do with errors, it's to do with the way the players play when they're out on the pitch. Under McCarthy, they looked like they'd met before.

Nah Macedonia away was pretty clueless and so was Iceland away too until Keane started playing. There were a few early friendlies also that were totally clueless also. Kerr never had us clueless but he did have us playing boring football with no passion.

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Originally Posted by NeilMcD

Nah Macedonia away was pretty clueless and so was Iceland away too until Keane started playing. There were a few early friendlies also that were totally clueless also. Kerr never had us clueless but he did have us playing boring football with no passion.

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kerr lost the dressing room , stan seems to have it , for how long remains to be seen

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Originally Posted by NeilMcD

oAlso I think the players liked Mc Carthy and they seem to like Staunton. I am not so sure they grew to like Kerr and as a result they played like that towards the end. However Kerr was a better tactician than either of them when he got the job.

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Hence this quote.

we will see in the next two games whether staunton has learned anything as a manager. two good performances where we look like we know what we are doing is what is needed.