Do you want Derry, Drogs and Pats to progress?

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There was something like 30,000 at the Shels Depor match in Landsdowne, how many did Shels get at their next league match? Certainly was nowhere near that because the bulk of it was el fans jumping on the bandwagon.

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wasnt at home at the time, but i knew quite a few lads who never attended any EL matches that went to this, and since haven't been to any EL games. It was the people who follow 'soccer' in Ireland that went to see this who dont actually attend EL games as much as EL fans jumping on the bandwagon...

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Originally Posted by superfrank

If we want to move on from being a small minded league, this kind of supporting whoever's doing the best in Europe oughta be gotten rid of.

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How in th ename of God is supporting Irish teams in Europe small minded?

People are very quick to trot out this allegation without ever bothering to show any link between the two.

Best of luck to all three teams. Even Drogheda. :)

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Originally Posted by superfrank

Do you think Glentoran fans would cheer on Linfield??

If we want to move on from being a small minded league, this kind of supporting whoever's doing the best in Europe oughta be gotten rid of.

There was something like 30,000 at the Shels Depor match in Landsdowne, how many did Shels get at their next league match? Certainly was nowhere near that because the bulk of it was el fans jumping on the bandwagon.

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Not sure about their next league match, but their next match was a up game against Derry and a miserly 900 odd turned up for that one. Just shows how great the Oireland Soccer Supporting public really are if you ask me. W@nkers the lot of them.

Be good to see all Irish teams progress north and south, Derrys run last year in the UEFA cup was fantastic for Irish football.
Was glad they got knocked out against PSG....I couldnt afford the group stages!! :D:D

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

How in th ename of God is supporting Irish teams in Europe small minded?

People are very quick to trot out this allegation without ever bothering to show any link between the two.

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All the big leagues have fierce rivalries, not always pretty, but it makes those leagues far more interesting to watch. Real-Barca, Inter-AC-Juve, Roma-Lazio, Ajax-Feyenoord-PSV, Rangers-Celtic....I can go on forever. These clubs all have really devoted fans who don't give two craps about any other team if they do well in Europe or whatever. It's something we should aspire to if we want to be taken seriously as a football league.

Imo, it's as if we're accepting the way our league is by just going off and supporting any ol' team that happens to have a chance of progressing, just so we can say "Been there, got the t-shirt". So what if one team gets though? If it's not your team, why support them? It's called rivalry. You can see the way we think about each other just by reading the forums. Yet when European season rolls around, we're all buddies cheering on whoever. It's pathetic. We might as well not support any teams and just put forward an el XI for every European game and then we can all support them. Imo, the idea of supporting whoever devalues the fan's reputations and the league will never progress. If you want one common team to support, support the national side.

But by supporting Pats Derry and Drogs I am supporting my own team. Because the better they do the better itl be for us in Europe(please God) next year....surely you can understand that.

Fair enough as a Bray fan you have no reason to support them but I certainly do.

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Originally Posted by superfrank

All the big leagues have fierce rivalries, not always pretty, but it makes those leagues far more interesting to watch. Real-Barca, Inter-AC-Juve, Roma-Lazio, Ajax-Feyenoord-PSV, Rangers-Celtic....I can go on forever. These clubs all have really devoted fans who don't give two craps about any other team if they do well in Europe or whatever. It's something we should aspire to if we want to be taken seriously as a football league.

Imo, it's as if we're accepting the way our league is by just going off and supporting any ol' team that happens to have a chance of progressing, just so we can say "Been there, got the t-shirt". So what if one team gets though? If it's not your team, why support them? It's called rivalry. You can see the way we think about each other just by reading the forums. Yet when European season rolls around, we're all buddies cheering on whoever. It's pathetic. We might as well not support any teams and just put forward an el XI for every European game and then we can all support them. Imo, the idea of supporting whoever devalues the fan's reputations and the league will never progress. If you want one common team to support, support the national side.

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There are many things wrong with our domestic game but I don't think this rates amongst the top 100.

Come up to the Harps Derry game and you'll see all the rivalry you need, ditto at Rovers v Bohs and I'm sure the Munster derby this week will be good.

You've referenced countries above which all share one thing, the overwhelming majority of their football fans support their domestic teams.

I don't care too much about what happens to the other sides (and I have my own views on coefficient obsessives) but I do have an interest in a strong domestic League and I believe regularly performing well in Europe, whilst by no means the be-all and end-all, is one thing that can help the profile of the League.

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Originally Posted by Dodge

Oh and WaR, the league is a one horse race and a 4 way race for 2nd place...

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Dodge, word of advice, don't get drawn into horse-racing analogies with WAR. ;)

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Originally Posted by micls

But by supporting Pats Derry and Drogs I am supporting my own team. Because the better they do the better itl be for us in Europe(please God) next year....surely you can understand that.

Fair enough as a Bray fan you have no reason to support them but I certainly do.

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I understand why you feel that way. Bray have been in Europe before and they could easily be back but I don't expect any other tem in our league to do us any favours. It would be nice to have an "easier" draw but it really doesn't matter who we'd play. And I'd want Bray to be doing well in Europe for Bray alone. I would rather Bray were playing a European match with the usual fans than have the ground swelled with el fans who are cheering us on cos it'll benefit them.

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Originally Posted by gufcfan

It does the profile of the league good. Remember Shels against Depor. I certainly wasnt shouting for Depor!

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I was. In fact I was ****ting bricks until Depor scored their second

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

You've referenced countries above which all share one thing, the overwhelming majority of their football fans support their domestic teams.

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I mentioned the IL as well, a league we are suppossedly better than but like I said I doubt you'd get any Glentoran fans cheering on Linfield/.

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

I don't care too much about what happens to the other sides (and I have my own views on coefficient obsessives) but I do have an interest in a strong domestic League and I believe regularly performing well in Europe, whilst by no means the be-all and end-all, is one thing that can help the profile of the League.

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Yes it does but I'm only going to gout and support an el team in Europe when it's Bray. I don't care about any other teams.

hope all 3 go through tbh. good for LOI if all can advance.

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Originally Posted by superfrank

I understand why you feel that way. Bray have been in Europe before and they could easily be back but I don't expect any other tem in our league to do us any favours. It would be nice to have an "easier" draw but it really doesn't matter who we'd play. And I'd want Bray to be doing well in Europe for Bray alone. I would rather Bray were playing a European match with the usual fans than have the ground swelled with el fans who are cheering us on cos it'll benefit them.

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It doesnt really matter who ye play? Is that cos you dont expect to progress either way?

An easier draw=progression to next round=more money for club and co-efficients for next year.....hopefully culminating in eventually reaching the group stages of Uefa and even more money for the club.

And il take the 20euro of anyone who wants to give it to us. EL clubs always need money

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Originally Posted by micls

It doesnt really matter who ye play? Is that cos you dont expect to progress either way?

An easier draw=progression to next round=more money for club and co-efficients for next year.....hopefully culminating in eventually reaching the group stages of Uefa and even more money for the club.

And il take the 20euro of anyone who wants to give it to us. EL clubs always need money

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It really doesn't matter who Bray were to play. There all football teams. And in all honesty if we're knocked out earlier than at least we can focus on the league/cup which imo is more important.

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Originally Posted by superfrank

All the big leagues have fierce rivalries, not always pretty, but it makes those leagues far more interesting to watch. Real-Barca, Inter-AC-Juve, Roma-Lazio, Ajax-Feyenoord-PSV, Rangers-Celtic....I can go on forever. These clubs all have really devoted fans who don't give two craps about any other team if they do well in Europe or whatever. It's something we should aspire to if we want to be taken seriously as a football league.

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See, that's what I see as small minded - thinking we should do things exactly the same as other leagues purely because they do it.

Do you really think more people are going to come to UCD games if I want Drogheda to get humiliated by a Sammarinese team? You've made absolutely no attempt to connect your two points.

And for what it's worth, when we beat Cork in the Cup as a First Division side theee years ago, I actually enjoyed it more because they'd been in the InterToto Cup Third Round the previous weekend.

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Do you really think more people are going to come to UCD games if I want Drogheda to get humiliated by a Sammarinese team? You've made absolutely no attempt to connect your two points.

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I didn't say that and I honestly don't believe that.

You say fierce rivalries are necessary if we're to be taken seriously as a league. Taken seriously by whom?

If it's by other leagues, I don't care what they think of us. The only other option is the barstoolers here, who we want to come to our games, hence my point.

"Taken seriously" is another point trotted out by people who never actually stop to think about what they're saying, I find.

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Originally Posted by superfrank

It really doesn't matter who Bray were to play. There all football teams. And in all honesty if we're knocked out earlier than at least we can focus on the league/cup which imo is more important.

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honestly, its not. the european club cups are (arguably) the pinnacle of world football. when you find yourself 135 minutes away from facing AC Milian, you'll understand.

the league is terribly important, and more so than europe at the moment - because realistically, we cannot achieve the next step in europe just yet. however, when a set up is available that has the potential to reach a group stages, it will be far more important than the league. reaching UEFA/CL group stages, if repeatable as well as being the money spinner, will be the turning point for the irish public's interest, at least that is my prediction.

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

You say fierce rivalries are necessary if we're to be taken seriously as a league. Taken seriously by whom?

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Fans of el clubs. I mean we all know the way posters go on here about other clubs and at el matches. Yet we're then ready to go off and support these teams when they play in Europe. WTF? :confused:

heres a generalisation but reading these last few threads about thsi general area/topic it seems to be the majority of Dublin - based - ( and environs ;) ) EL fans that dont want other teams to do well.....why is that?

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It really doesn't matter who Bray were to play. There all football teams. And in all honesty if we're knocked out earlier than at least we can focus on the league/cup which imo is more important.

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you say small minded-ness. to be that is small mindedness I mean surely you should be lookign for bigger and better things, and not be happy in your own stye, by doing well and conquering Europe that is certainly not being small-minded, completely the oppossite I feel.

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the league is terribly important, and more so than europe at the moment - best realistically, we cannot achieve the next step in europe just yet. however, when a set up is available that has the potential to reach a group stages, it will be far more important than the league. reaching UEFA/CL group stages, if repeatable as well as being the money spinner, will be the turning point for the irish public's interest, at least that is my prediction.

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This I feel, is a very valid assertion. The only thing I can see coming against you is the more money available to teams in other countries at the same level as Ireland, not even money but the teams "getting better" on a level relative to EL teams progressing ( on and off the field ) and "getting better".

But one thing is for certain, if EL teams got to group stages and faired decent it would definitely 110% increase attendances at games ( begining with European games ) because they would sit up and take notice, especially if they were playing against English teams, or more established and well known European teams - when playing in europe obviouslly :).