Looking ahead - Wales

I actually think Slovakia are a better side than Wales. I watched Wales v Slovakia and the slovaks destroyed them. They really took them to pieces.

On us against the welsh, all being fit and well we should get the points. It is going to be difficult. The Croke Park factor will actually work more against us than the welsh. It is a new setting for our lads and there will be a lot of OTT expectancy on their shoulders. It is just another away ground for Wales and any noise or atmosphere generated by us will have no effect on pro-footballers.

no it wont have an effect on the opposition, but it should have for our lads.

EalingGreen biased as ever. Davies instead of who? Ireland, Carsley, A Reid, S Reid? You smoking the crack or shootin the muck? Gabbidon? He is sh*te. Bellamy is no better than Keane and neither on current form are as good as Doyle. Both Keane and Bellamy blow hot and cold at different times.

We have way better players than Wales. We also have way better players than San Marino. We could have had the Brazilian first team playing for us last night and we still would have only scrapped a win. The whole Irish setup stinks, the manager is a dunce, the FAI are totally inept, the coaching staff don't have a clue and the players don't give a sh*t. The talent isn't the problem. It's your team the North that suffer in this regard.

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Originally Posted by youngirish

EalingGreen biased as ever. Davies instead of who? Ireland, Carsley, A Reid, S Reid? You smoking the crack or shootin the muck? Gabbidon? He is sh*te. Bellamy is no better than Keane and neither on current form are as good as Doyle. Both Keane and Bellamy blow hot and cold at different times.

We have way better players than Wales. We also have way better players than San Marino. We could have had the Brazilian first team playing for us last night and we still would have only scrapped a win. The whole Irish setup stinks, the manager is a dunce, the FAI are totally inept, the coaching staff don't have a clue and the players don't give a sh*t. The talent isn't the peoblem. It's your team the North that suffer in this regard.

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This is what I originally posted:
"Imo, Gabbidon, Bale, Giggs, Davies and Bellamy would get into a team picked from the two squads. (And if available, I'd have Koumas in, as well, though probably in place of Davies).
Consequently, I think the two teams are evenly matched. I think you'll do well to get a draw in Cardiff, though should hope (just) to beat them in Dublin.
I think a great deal rests on how motivated the teams are on the day.
As such, now that Toshack looks to be setting his own "stamp" on the team by getting rid of players he doesn't like, such as Savage, the Welsh players may have more belief in their manager's selection and tactics than the Irish do in Staunton.
That said, I think the Croker Factor will give you a huge boost.
A close call all round, I'd say"

Since I am not a supporter of either team, I think I might claim to be less biased than you (I have never had any great fondness for the Taffs, btw).

And whilst I agree with your overall analysis of the problems which the ROI is currently facing, when things are so bad as they presently appear, I don't think you can avoid questioning the calibre of the players.
For example, Duff was outstanding when he was at Blackburn, with the prospects of developing into a truly world class player. This was why Chelsea shelled out so much money for him. That said, they also spent similar money on Robben and Wright-Phillips. Of these three similar players, only Robben has continued to progress (or "trained on", as they say in horseracing).
Which is not to say that Duff has become a bad player, or would not get into a combined ROI/Wales team; he can still go on to be a very good servant to his country, just without ever quite hitting the heights he was formerly thought capable of.

Anyhow, it doesn't really matter what either of us thinks about the respective merits of each team on paper; as ever, it's what happens out on the pitch that counts.

In the light of last night's debacle, your best (only?) bet against Wales may be if your players are so desperate to avoid further humiliation in front of 80,000+ fans at Croker, that they'll somehow fight their way to a result.

As the ROI performance against the Czechs showed, you can't rule that out, but you don't want to be depending on the "Embarrassment Card" every match (imo), otherwise, players will start to seek the easier way out i.e. suddenly developing mysterious injuries the weekend before a midweek international, which miraculously heal by the following weekend.

P.S. We're Northern Ireland (NI), not "the North" and we're not suffering too badly in any department these days, either!

great time for ealinggreen to have posted the comments the last few days, and after last nights game, he has been completely justified.

what is their to look forward too? playing in one of the best stadiums in europe built up by an amateur organisation, played by amateurs who play their heart out for their county and get nothing in return, to watch over-paid muppets ( some who fall over and look for penalties at any given opportunity )who dont give 2 fcuks about the privilige they have to play for their country and talk sh1te about 3 points, results, lets get a "result", didnt get beat.....


minnows 1 muppets 2

Duff was one of Chelsea's best players in his first season. The 2nd season (Mourinho's first) he was fantastic too. Mourinho said he was their best player. Since then though it's been downhill. Just pointing out that it wasn't the move to Chelsea that suddenly changed him.

It's "the north" to most of us btw whether some people like it or not. ;)

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Originally Posted by eirebhoy

It's "the north" to most of us btw whether some people like it or not. ;)

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Aye, but you must surely understand why we're so keen not to be mistaken by anyone for you lot...:cool:

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

Aye, but you must surely understand why we're so keen not to be mistaken by anyone for you lot...:cool:

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A disaster for us is a 2-1 away win in a game we dominated. A disaster for NI is 40 games without a goal and 15 without a point as in the Sammy McElroy era. There's the difference.

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Originally Posted by paul_oshea

great time for ealinggreen to have posted the comments the last few days, and after last nights game, he has been completely justified.

what is their to look forward too? playing in one of the best stadiums in europe built up by an amateur organisation, played by amateurs who play their heart out for their county and get nothing in return, to watch over-paid muppets ( some who fall over and look for penalties at any given opportunity )who dont give 2 fcuks about the privilige they have to play for their country and talk sh1te about 3 points, results, lets get a "result", didnt get beat.....


minnows 1 muppets 2

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On an aside is anyone else perterbed by the increasing use of the word "muppet" in Irish society , its a word that annoys me immensely for some reason.

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Originally Posted by gustavo

On an aside is anyone else perterbed by the increasing use of the word "muppet" in Irish society , its a word that annoys me immensely for some reason.

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Muppet.

Bart: Dad, what's a Muppet?
Homer: Well, it's not quite a mop, not quite a puppet, but man... (laughs, then pauses) So, to answer you question, I don't know.

i am perturbed, not perterbed gustavo.

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Originally Posted by paul_oshea

i am perturbed, not perterbed gustavo.

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Ah right fair enough presumably the players give 2 fcuks about the privilege rather than the privilige

Gabbidon is in no way rubbish.I've seen him mark Del Piero out of a match.

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Originally Posted by youngirish

A disaster for us is a 2-1 away win in a game we dominated. A disaster for NI is 40 games without a goal and 15 without a point as in the Sammy McElroy era. There's the difference.

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Good point, well made.

Except it was 13 games without a goal.

And we got a draw in four of those games - vs Spain, Ukraine (twice) and, ahem, Cyprus.

So it was never more than four consecutive games without a point.

And it's "McIlroy".

Anyhow, whether the ROI is in shallower doo-doo, deeper doo-doo, or just about the same doo-doo as we were then, there is still one key difference: McIlroy resigned at the end of our Disaster to take up another job, whereas Stan shows no sign of being offered one, even if he was of a mind to go elsewhere.

Apart from that, though, it was still a good post. :rolleyes:

P.S. I've just thought of another difference: Lawrie Sanchez :)

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

P.S. I've just thought of another difference: Lawrie Sanchez :)

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Unfortunately as stated earlier I don't think the Republic's problems start and end with Staunton though he is a major factor. I would swap Lawrie Sanchez for Staunton in a split second and I reckon he could do well but only with a complete restructuring of the organisation around him.

I've had a bad vibe about the Welsh game for weeks - so last nights horror show has added to the imagined nightmare ahead.

Cruel Sporting Gods (and Delaney, Stan et all) - Damn you to Hell!!!

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Originally Posted by youngirish

Unfortunately as stated earlier I don't think the Republic's problems start and end with Staunton though he is a major factor. I would swap Lawrie Sanchez for Staunton in a split second and I reckon he could do well but only with a complete restructuring of the organisation around him.

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There is no way LS would even consider taking over the ROI. Think about it, the best he could ever hope for would be to take over a chronically under-performing team, turn it around, then set it on its way to over-performing. Which is fine, were it not that it's hardly guaranteed and even if he did, people would merely say "So what?" i.e. it's been done before. By him.
And in any case, he's made it quite clear he sees his future in club management, such that he'll leave NI when his contract expires at the end of the Euro Qualifiers (or the finals, if he gets us there!).
Of course, he has said he thinks he could combine a club job with NI on a part-time basis, but even if the club concerned were to agree (v.unlikely), I can't ever see a p-t manager being acceptable to the FAI.

Anyhow, that's not your biggest problem: your biggest problem will be replacing Staunton with somebody capable. No-one with a decent CV is going to want to touch it and anyone with a bit of sense will want to wait until things really have hit rock-bottom, in order to extinguish all unrealistic expectations, so that the only way for any new guy is up.
Unless, of course, you appoint someone who is either short of alternatives (O'Leary?), for which there is usually a reason, or take a chance on somebody who is eager but unproven. (Actually, scrub that last one, since that's what Staunton was...)

Worse still, if finding a replacement for Stan is your biggest problem, it's not actually your immediate problem: i.e. getting rid of him first.
As I see it, there's no way Delaney will sack him, since he's too convenient a "sandbag" to protect him (JD) from the muck and bullets aimed in both their directions. Plus it would cost a fortune in compensation, compensation which will be sorely needed to attract a new guy. Above all, if Stan were sacked, attention would immediately move to the guy who appointed him in the first place...

Therefore, he'll have to resign. Clearly, he's not going to want to do that, since he's a proud man and he won't want to forego a big pay-out, especially since his reputation is getting shredded so severely, he'll find it hard to get a decent alternative job.

Which leads to a further problem. If he can stagger on getting the odd half-decent result (Czech, Germany etc), then you could be stuck with him for another year or more. Alternatively, if the next few results are more like Cyprus or San Marino, then the pressure will become unbearable, and he'll have to resign.

Neither option is palatable, since the former would only delay the start of the repairs needed and the latter would deepen the extent of it.

But worse, much worse than any of that, is that even once you've got rid of Stan and appointed someone in his place, his successor can only hope to do a good job despite the circumstances he finds himself in, not because of them. That is because, as you rightly point out, many of the problems are not really to do with the senior team management, even if they (the problems) eventually end up making the manager's job harder.

A good appointment will only allow the Blazers to kid themselves everything is really OK and a bad appointment, well, you really don't need another one of those.

Now I daresay anyone still reading will ask, "What the feck business is it of yours what's happening and what does you know about it, anyway?" The first question is fair enough, but I only offer my opinion from a feeling that I've seen this situation before.
You see, the ROI under Stan are exactly where NI were under Sammy Mc.
and we only got out of that through pure luck.
First, Stockport offered to take Sammy off our hands (he's managing Morecambe in the Conference now, btw) and second, the clear favourite for the job was Jimmy Nicholl (now Assistant Manager at Aberdeen).
However, Jimmy Nic turned it down because the money wasn't enough (the second time he'd done that!), which left Lawrie as "Hobson's Choice".

Still, if the "Luck of the Irish" worked once for us, maybe it can do the same for you...;)

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

There is no way LS would even consider taking over the ROI.

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Someone with a name like Sanchez could setlle in well with us "Wee Mexicans".

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Originally Posted by youngirish

EalingGreen biased as ever. Davies instead of who? Ireland, Carsley, A Reid, S Reid? You smoking the crack or shootin the muck? Gabbidon? He is sh*te. Bellamy is no better than Keane and neither on current form are as good as Doyle. Both Keane and Bellamy blow hot and cold at different times.

We have way better players than Wales. We also have way better players than San Marino. We could have had the Brazilian first team playing for us last night and we still would have only scrapped a win. The whole Irish setup stinks, the manager is a dunce, the FAI are totally inept, the coaching staff don't have a clue and the players don't give a sh*t. The talent isn't the problem. It's your team the North that suffer in this regard.

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thats not true
for me Gabidon is an ace player
Bellamy can score goals, and Giggs is Giggs
i think Wales might embaress us in Croker