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I never claimed to have such a photographic memory. I assess players over what they show in games as a whole. Which leads me to conclude that O'Brien is a limited player.Quote:
Originally posted by The Money Man
Obviously Shed End you can put me right with a litany of other mistakes he made because you seem to remember the six games with crystal clarity.
Murphy Out Now!!!
No matter what standard some players play at they don't always have what it takes for international football.
O'Brien is getting good exposure to quality football but just assuming he should be a first choice centre back on that basis probably isn't the best decision.
Experience can could for a lot at the top level as shown by Stauntons performances in the last year - he was terrible in the preceeding year but turned it around.
Have to agree with ya there. Just going on what level a guy plays at is a really misguided and ill-informed way of assessing his overall worth/importance etc, etc.Quote:
Originally posted by pete
O'Brien is getting good exposure to quality football but just assuming he should be a first choice centre back on that basis probably isn't the best decision.
Murphy Out Now!!!
I agree that we can't assume international greatness from exposure to quality at club level. We have all seen good club performers flop on the bigger stage. That said, after the debacles of Russia and Switzerland, I think O'Brien deserves a go ahead of the two men on duty on those occassions.Quote:
Originally posted by pete
No matter what standard some players play at they don't always have what it takes for international football.
O'Brien is getting good exposure to quality football but just assuming he should be a first choice centre back on that basis probably isn't the best decision.
Hey, don't forget John O'Shea. He didn't play in either of those games. Look at the reviews he gets every week when he plays with United (not that I'd EVER support them), he's SURELY worth a shot.Quote:
Originally posted by The Money Man
That said, after the debacles of Russia and Switzerland, I think O'Brien deserves a go ahead of the two men on duty on those occassions.
Murphy Out Now!!!
I haven't forgotten O'Shea Shed End. He's in my selected back four. I refer you back to my original posting on this thread.Quote:
Originally posted by Shed End John
Hey, don't forget John O'Shea.
Noted. But, O'Brien is too limited a player to have next to a talent like O'Shea. Poor bugger would end up doing two jobs just like O'Briens partner at Newcastle.Quote:
Originally posted by The Money Man
I haven't forgotten O'Shea Shed End. He's in my selected back four. I refer you back to my original posting on this thread.
Murphy Out Now!!!
I wouldn't have considered Nico the Greek to be good enough to carry himself never mind anybody else.Quote:
Originally posted by Shed End John
Noted. But, O'Brien is too limited a player to have next to a talent like O'Shea. Poor bugger would end up doing two jobs just like O'Briens partner at Newcastle.
Murphy Out Now!!!
My back four would also be Carr - O'Brien - O'Shea - Finnan
About O'Brien: I was at Newcastle - Juventus (I was visiting a friend, so I was at the game purely as a neutral) and O'Brien was fantastic. He contained Del Piero no problem. He also does a lot of running that you don't see on the cameras, closing down angles and thinking ahead, while guiding the young Titus Bramble. He was quite easily the man of the match in that game. If anyone is carrying anyone in the NUFC defence, then O'Brien is carrying that eejit Dabizas.
The biggest problem at Newcastle is that they don't have a Keane/Gerrard/Vieira/Dacourt type player who can win the ball and distribute it properly, holding on to possession. The Newcastle midfielders lose the the ball too much. The defence is under too much pressure all the time. This was evident in the last quarter of the match against Juventus, and in the second half against Feynoord.
O'Brien also plays in the same defence as Shay Given, so it would make 100% sense to play them together at international level as well, seeing that the biggest problem at international level is getting the team to gel.
What about Dunne. He seems to have sorted himself out and is playing well for Man City.
I reckon the back four should be
Finnan Dunne OShea Carr
I think that back 4 will the first choice for years to come.
I would say that the jury needs to stay out a bit longer on Dunne!
Vindication at last. Now we have a first hand view of O'Brien at Champions League level. I have pointed out all along that O'Brien only made one significant mistake in the entire first phase. Despite the fact that nobody can cite any other mistake, they seem happy enough to dismiss his contribution to Newcastle's progress. Newcastle wont get past phase two but six more games at that level will only further O'Briens experience amonst the best of what Europe has to offer.Quote:
Originally posted by brine2
My back four would also be Carr - O'Brien - O'Shea - Finnan
O'Brien was fantastic. He contained Del Piero no problem.
O'Brien also plays in the same defence as Shay Given, so it would make 100% sense to play them together at international level
Sure that O'Brien 'chap' isn't even irish. ;)
that doesn´t appear to bother the FAI or most of the muppets who think they´re football fans in this country.Quote:
Originally posted by pete
Sure that O'Brien 'chap' isn't even irish. ;)
[SIZE=1]p.s. Pete, I know you weren´t being serious, just chosing to ignore it [/SIZE] :)
With a name like O'Brien, he's hardly Bangladeshi!Quote:
Originally posted by pete
Sure that O'Brien 'chap' isn't even irish. ;)
Why not,Quote:
Originally posted by The Money Man
With a name like O'Brien, he's hardly Bangladeshi!
Andrew Jitendra O'Brien, anyone?? ;)
His father could have been a docker from Clonmel. and his mother a curry chef from Dhaka....:D:D
He must've got his nose from his mothers side then - I understand that Clonmel noses are petite and perfectly formed.Quote:
Originally posted by oddboy
Why not,
Andrew Jitendra O'Brien, anyone?? ;)
His father could have been a docker from Clonmel. and his mother a curry chef from Dhaka....:D:D
You're right, Dunne has sorted himself out and IS playing really well for Man City, but, there's a catch. Dunne is very much a horses for courses player. He will invariably play a blinder against teams who through design or panic (Holland September 2001) resort to putting high balls into the box. Dunne will on the other hand struggle against teams with quick forwards who'll keep the ball on the deck.Quote:
Originally posted by colster
What about Dunne. He seems to have sorted himself out and is playing well for Man City.
I reckon the back four should be
Finnan Dunne OShea Carr
I think that back 4 will the first choice for years to come.
Murphy Out Now!!!
Thats bang on. There are certainly occassions on which Dunne could do a job for us. He is a one trick pony though. He would suit fine against sides who try to bang the door down but could be exposed against sides who try to pick the lock.Quote:
Originally posted by Shed End John
Dunne will on the other hand struggle against teams with quick forwards who'll keep the ball on the deck.
Totally agree. although idid say Finnan should be right mid in another thread. Actually, Finnans more consistent than any of our wealth of right backs so maybe he should be the one to get his natural spot.Quote:
Originally posted by colster
Finnan Dunne OShea Carr
I think that back 4 will the first choice for years to come.