Portugal '04 - Can we qualify?

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21/11/2002, 10:11 AM
Shed End John

Quote:

Originally posted by The Money Man
All of that said, we really shouldn't be comtemplating the possibility of runners-up spot.
So who could we get? Well none of the following are currently winning their group - Czech Rep., England, Italy, Denmark, Sweden. So these are all in the frame. But so are Israel, Scotland, Latvia and Belgium. Hope springs eternal!

I agree that, against all odds it must be said, we should still be trying to win the group. After all, a certain Mr Keane wouldn't have given up in the face of such a dire situation, so why change that?
If quality shines through, which invariably it does, the likes of Italy, England etc will book automatic spots in Euro 2004. So I say bring on the Scots!:)

Murphy Out Now!!!
21/11/2002, 11:15 AM
pete

Switzerland have already dropped 2 points in Albania & are very unlikely to win in Russia - most probably get beaten so 2md place in the group is very much on for the irish team.

Theres a lot of points to be played for yet.
21/11/2002, 11:40 AM
The Money Man

Quote:

Originally posted by Shed End John

If quality shines through, which invariably it does, the likes of Italy, England etc will book automatic spots in Euro 2004. So I say bring on the Scots!:)

On the evidence of last night I think everybody would fancy being drawn against the Scots.

I also agree about quality shining through during the period of a campaign but I fail to see how this is relevant to England.
21/11/2002, 11:46 AM
Shed End John

Quote:

Originally posted by The Money Man

I also agree about quality shining through during the period of a campaign but I fail to see how this is relevant to England.

Well, Ingerlund are in a group where the opposition, to put it kindly, aren't exactly world class. Besides, with some of the luck they've had so far and the willingness of teams to lie down to them because they're England, I reckon they'll grab 1st place and an automatic invitation to the party.

Murphy Out Now!!!
21/11/2002, 12:01 PM
The Money Man

Quote:

Originally posted by Shed End John

Well, Ingerlund are in a group where the opposition, to put it kindly, aren't exactly world class.

Does Turkey's FIFA ranking of 8th not suggest that they are a reasonably competent outfit. After all, they got to a World Cup semi-final. They haven't dropped a point in the group yet unlike England who couldn't even put Macedonia away.
21/11/2002, 1:58 PM
pete

Quote:

Originally posted by The Money Man
Does Turkey's FIFA ranking of 8th not suggest that they are a reasonably competent outfit. After all, they got to a World Cup semi-final. They haven't dropped a point in the group yet unlike England who couldn't even put Macedonia away.

Exactely, England considering the resources available to them are very poor. Mr Eriksson is a complete spoofer who somehow has seemed to get away with playing hoofball as bad as the Graham Taylor years.

England have already dropped 2 points which means if Turkey can match the remaining english results against the minnows they just need to match england in their head to head games.

Turkeys World Cup semi final appearance was no fluke as they been improving steadily & I wouldn't even fancy england for a point in Istanbul.
21/11/2002, 2:11 PM
Shed End John

Quote:

Originally posted by The Money Man

Does Turkey's FIFA ranking of 8th not suggest that they are a reasonably competent outfit.

As you say, it suggests it, but no more. Turkey will have to prove this time that they are not as spineless as past Turkish teams by actually standing up to be counted and getting results when the pressure is on. It is more than possible for England to beat them home AND away which I can see happening.

Murphy Out Now!!!
21/11/2002, 2:57 PM
Schumi

I don't think this is a particularly good English team. Their qualifying group perfromances have been pretty poor. I'd fancy Turkey to top the group.
21/11/2002, 3:13 PM
Shed End John

Quote:

Originally posted by Schumi
I don't think this is a particularly good English team. Their qualifying group perfromances have been pretty poor. I'd fancy Turkey to top the group.

Maybe, but it's a hell of alot more than a remote possibility that England could sneak top spot. Btw, it doesn't mean that I actually want them to. I'd prefer to see Euro 2004 without them in it at all.

Murphy Out Now!!!
21/11/2002, 3:24 PM
crc

Quote:

Originally posted by The Money Man
(Switzerland) After all, they only managed a 1-1 draw away to Albania - hardly inspiring stuff.

Did anyone see Albania against England and Germany in the WC2002 qualifiers? They're not a bad side and shouldn't be dismissed, they're not the same team that we beat twice on our way to USA94.
21/11/2002, 3:33 PM
The Money Man

Quote:

Originally posted by crc

Did anyone see Albania against England and Germany in the WC2002 qualifiers? They're not a bad side and shouldn't be dismissed

The way that we have started the qualifying campaign, nobody can be dismissed. It is true to say that they offered far more than cannon fodder to both England and Germany last time around. But lets face it, both England and Germany were poor in qualifying for the WC. Some of their respective performances against Albania, Greece and Finland were pathetic.
21/11/2002, 3:36 PM
Shed End John

Quote:

Originally posted by The Money Man

The way that we have started the qualifying campaign, nobody can be dismissed. It

True enough. However, my hope is that with a new manager in place the team will be eager to impress, get back the incentive and will to win that's clearly missing and knock these teams over like we used to and are still capable of doing.

Murphy Out Now!!!
21/11/2002, 3:38 PM
The Money Man

Quote:

Originally posted by Shed End John

Maybe, but it's a hell of alot more than a remote possibility that England could sneak top spot.

Given that England have already dropped points to Macedonia, they would in all probability have to win in Turkey to top the group. England and English club sides have poor records in Turkey. Its certainly not the kind of place you'd like to go needing a win. We all remember the receptions received by United and Leeds in Turkey in the recent past.
21/11/2002, 3:41 PM
The Money Man

Quote:

Originally posted by Shed End John

knock these teams over like we used to and are still capable of doing.

Murphy Out Now!!!

Absolutely. There is no doubt that we have the necessary resources available to pick up twelve points in our next four outings against Georgia and Albania. Sure Duffer could clobber them by himself.
21/11/2002, 3:43 PM
Shed End John

Quote:

Originally posted by The Money Man

England and English club sides have poor records in Turkey. Its certainly not the kind of place you'd like to go needing a win. We all remember the receptions received by United and Leeds in Turkey in the recent past.

That can change though, going solely on their record, who would you have expected to win the Dutch game at Lansdowne last year?
True, the clubs got bad receptions and England will, but, I still wouldn't underestimate their ability to go to Turkey and win.

Murphy Out Now!!!
21/11/2002, 4:02 PM
The Money Man

Quote:

Originally posted by Shed End John

True, the clubs got bad receptions and England will, but, I still wouldn't underestimate their ability to go to Turkey and win.

Murphy Out Now!!!

I don't know what ability you're referring to. They have a number of good individuals but they have any number of problems. They haven't sorted the pony-tail issue between the sticks. They are very limited down their left side and have very few options on the horizon. They also have injury and form issues in the central midfield.
21/11/2002, 4:10 PM
Shed End John

Quote:

Originally posted by The Money Man

but they have any number of problems. They haven't sorted the pony-tail issue between the sticks. They are very limited down their left side and have very few options on the horizon. They also have injury and form issues in the central midfield.

True, but, like everyone else they have until March to sort it. Expect to see a different England come next spring. Besides, at this point in time they've got a much better chance of grabbing top spot in their group than we do in ours.

Murphy Out Now!!!
21/11/2002, 4:21 PM
The Money Man

Quote:

Originally posted by Shed End John

they've got a much better chance of grabbing top spot in their group than we do in ours.

I never suggested that we would win our group. I think we could given the lack of qualiy of the opposition but we've left ourselves a mountain to climb.

Regardless, new England or not in March, I can't see them picking up all three points in Turkey. Therefore I don't believe that they'll clinch top spot.
21/11/2002, 4:31 PM
Shed End John

Quote:

Originally posted by The Money Man

I never suggested that we would win our group. I think we could given the lack of qualiy of the opposition but we've left ourselves a mountain to climb.
Regardless, new England or not in March, I can't see them picking up all three points in Turkey. Therefore I don't believe that they'll clinch top spot.

True, we have given ourselves a mountain to climb, but, as you've implied you never know.
If Turkey's now legendary capacity for self-destruction, just like Spain, kicks in Ingerlund mightn't have to win in Turkey, a draw might do them. Besides, if Ingerlund could win their home game with Turkey, that would put the pressure back on the Turks.

Murphy Out Now!!!
21/11/2002, 5:26 PM
The Money Man

Quote:

Originally posted by Shed End John

Turkey's now legendary capacity for self-destruction

Turkey have qualified for Euro 96, Euro 2000 and World Cup 2002 in the last six years. That's not really the record of a team 'legendary' for self-destruction in qualifying campaigns.

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