Irish Cup Final Pics..

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Originally Posted by glentoranfan

Thanks for that comment. I appreciated it a lot.

David, I know of you from ILFs and you seem decent enough, but how is that Derry City "trash"? It is widely acknowledged Linfield have a junior Rangers image. Regardless of whether Linfield manufactured this image to get support or not, there can be no doubt it does.

I am reluctant to say more, as I don't want to make enemies, start a political debate and it will look like sour grapes after a cup final defeat for us, but I will stick my neck out.

With regards to the Orange Order flag, I am not fussed about people's political views; they are entitled to them as I am mine, however, at the same time I don't feel it is appropiate material for a football match for a number of reasons. Firstly, one could argue it has nothing to do with football, secondly, whether we like it or not, this island has got history. Because your human rights say you could walk down the Falls road with a Rangers top on doesn't mean you can get away with it. Thirdly, again, it just shows the Linfield support have not changed. The flag does not offend me, I don't care but it shows almost how tribal and insecure certain people are.

Again, I would just say to Linfield move on. Leave all that stuff behind. The country has moved on, the team has moved on, now the fans need to move on. I am not saying don't have political views, but there is no call to flaunt them. Everybody knows East Belfast is a strongly protestant/unionist/loyalist area but look at the respect the Glens have got for just being about the football.

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What do you base these junior Rangers allegations on? Because we wear the same colours? We wear the same colours as Portsmouth, we wear the same colours as the French national team yet I do not hear any such ludicrous accusations of being mini Pompey or mini France. Yes a sizeable percentage of our support also support Rangers, much like Glentoran I would say.

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Originally Posted by Speranza

I think the difference in the two clubs is that Glentoran have an ability to attract fans from its hinterland of East Belfast while Linfield rely on the junior Rangers image to increase their support base?

I have a lot of time for Glentoran FC. Their fans have a pride in the area they originate and to a lesser extent their culture without being sectarian or offensive

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I don't that is so much of a difference, actually. Both clubs have support well outside their hinterland, partly because they're the big two and also reflecting people with family links to the clubs moving to suburban towns and further afield.

Most Glens and Blues fans (like most at all IL clubs) are neither sectarian nor offensive. But the big two's offenders are as bad as each other, ditto those from other clubs.

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Originally Posted by David

What do you base these junior Rangers allegations on? Because we wear the same colours? We wear the same colours as Portsmouth, we wear the same colours as the French national team yet I do not hear any such ludicrous accusations of being mini Pompey or mini France. Yes a sizeable percentage of our support also support Rangers, much like Glentoran I would say.

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You don't have to base it on colours worn. People can hear the songs and chants Linfield supporters sing and some of the flags that are brought to the ground. To say Linfield are not a junior Rangers I think would be denial.

How many Glenmen and woman follow Rangers? Well, I don't know, but of course there are some who I am sure do, however, even so, that does not feature in their Glentoran support. We have our own songs, chants etc and I think that is one of the key differences between Glentoran FC and Linfield FC.

I agree, however, with what you say about Irish League clubs. Cliftonville bring tricolours and what have you to their matches, and again they have to move away from that too.

I have not a problem with people carrying flags, but Northern Ireland is an exception to the rule (as are some other countries) because of political strife. Again, just because you have the right to do something does not mean you can safely/appropriately do it.

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Originally Posted by glentoranfan

You don't have to base it on colours worn. People can hear the songs and chants Linfield supporters sing and some of the flags that are brought to the ground. To say Linfield are not a junior Rangers I think would be denial.

How many Glenmen and woman follow Rangers? Well, I don't know, but of course there are some who I am sure do, however, even so, that does not feature in their Glentoran support. We have our own songs, chants etc and I think that is one of the key differences between Glentoran FC and Linfield FC.

I agree, however, with what you say about Irish League clubs. Cliftonville bring tricolours and what have you to their matches, and again they have to move away from that as too.

I have not a problem with people carrying flags, but Northern Ireland is an exception to the rule (as are some other countries) because of political strife. Again, just because you have the right to do something does not mean you can safely/appropriately do it.

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I haven't heard a Rangers song being sang at Windsor in years. I have heard songs that Rangers sing adopted for Linfield. Likewise though I have heard a song that Southampton sing that we adopt to our own words so are we a mini Southampton. You need to wise up, there are loads of football songs that are sang by loads of clubs with the words changed to adopt to your own particular team but sure its just another stick to beat Linfield with even though every club does this. Are Derry City a mini Liverpool as both have their own versions of Fields of Athenry, this could go on forever.

David - I don't for one second believe you're so niave as to not know that, rightly or wrongly, Linfield are seen as the Irish equivalent to Rangers.

As for your assertion that because certain flags etc not illegal there therefore can be no issue with them being flown at a football match - the issue is more one of appropriateness, acceptability and intent, rather than illegality. The BNP are not an illegal organisation, for example, but I doubt you'd find Bradford or Blackburn fans defending the use of their imagery at football matches.

But doubtless you'll burrow your head just that little deeper into ther sand and resort to your stock retort of 'typical Derry nonsense'. You're kidding no-one but yourself here.

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Originally Posted by David

I haven't heard a Rangers song being sang at Windsor in years.

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God Save the Queen ? Rule Britannia ? The Billy Boys ? The Sash ? Not songs about Rangers - but all songs that you'll almost uniquely hear frequently at Ranger's games.

Do you wear ear-muffs to home games or something....?

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Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

There was some labour-party NI fella with a posh accent on The Politics Show last night, banging on about how there wasn't a hint of sectarianism at the game, and congratulating the IFA for cleaning-up NI football ! :eek:

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To be fair the IFA have made great strides in its fight against sectarianism, I have no time for the IFA usually but on this and Michael Boyd in particular They deserve credit. dont group NI football as a whole. Its not perfect but we are getting there.

FS lads,linfield has a problem with sectarian songs being sung at games,now every 1 knows that its only a few and not 1000s,most bluemen hate it i for 1 hate it when sectarians chants are sung,the windsor roar etc and linfield have been working to eridicate it and should get the credit they deserve,i just hate when glentoran fans use this to score points against linfield,wise up!

'Glentoran have their own songs chants etc' you joking? glentoran have the worst fans i've ever seen,big crowds yes,but atmosphere? you lot are boring and I'm sure most teams who played you lot in the setanta would agree.

Going off topic here but the second last pic is the best of the lot, fair play !! ;)

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Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

God Save the Queen ? Rule Britannia ? The Billy Boys ? The Sash ? Not songs about Rangers - but all songs that you'll almost uniquely hear frequently at Ranger's games.

Do you wear ear-muffs to home games or something....?

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So if a song is sang by Rangers supporters that makes it a Rangers song? Very strange logic there. I repeat I have not heard a Rangers song at Windsor in tyears.

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Originally Posted by David

What do you base these junior Rangers allegations on? Because we wear the same colours? We wear the same colours as Portsmouth, we wear the same colours as the French national team yet I do not hear any such ludicrous accusations of being mini Pompey or mini France. Yes a sizeable percentage of our support also support Rangers, much like Glentoran I would say.

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Why then the 'Blues Brothers' badges, scarves and flags.???

Just like Shamrock Rovers would be Ireland's version of Glasgow Celtic, I think it's hard to take you serious David if you attempt to deny that Linfield are Ireland's version of Glasgow Rangers.

As for the Orange Order flag, well to me it's just stupid at a match.
I just cannot imagine flying the Popes flag or the Bishops colors at a match, in fact I wouldn't know what they look like.

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Originally Posted by Krstic

Why then the 'Blues Brothers' badges, scarves and flags.???

Just like Shamrock Rovers would be Ireland's version of Glasgow Celtic, I think it's hard to take you serious David if you attempt to deny that Linfield are Ireland's version of Glasgow Rangers.

As for the Orange Order flag, well to me it's just stupid at a match.
I just cannot imagine flying the Popes flag or the Bishops colors at a match, in fact I wouldn't know what they look like.

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But that is your choice. Why do so many people on here want to be dictatorial about what people can and cannot do at a football match? What makes you the high and mighty that can decide what is right or wrong for another club. I have said umpteem times I will back you all the way when complaining about sectarian songs like the Billy Boys and indeed would have backed those complaining if (as was initially alleged on here) there had been a paramilitary flag in our support but if people want to fly the flag of a Christian legal organisation then that is their choice and who the feck is anyone on here (including me) to tell them that they cannot do it.

As for the Rangers allegation, I have accepted totally that their is a sizeable number in our support that would also support Rangers and I daresay there is a sizeable number of Derry fans who support Celtic but what does that prove? Are you a mini Celtic? There are many Linfield supporters who have no interest in Scottish football whatsoever and if you read ILF about the Linfield Rangers game this is very apparent. We are a club with a proud history of our own that do not need to rely on any other club (or indeed any MP's to call in favours to get us out of a mess and in doing so neglecting another club in his native city).

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Originally Posted by David

or indeed any MP's to call in favours to get us out of a mess and in doing so neglecting another club in his native city).

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What a sad vicious jibe. So lets get this straight, by helping one person you are by default neglecting another? What a backward way of looking at things but if you want to continue down that line, Derry City Council recently granted Institute a sizeable grant while we still wait on news regarding our crumbling stadium. Please don't attempt to show my city as a parochial/divided one alike your own David when the facts show otherwise.

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but if people want to fly the flag of a Christian legal organisation then that is their choice and who the feck is anyone on here (including me) to tell them that they cannot do it

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Indeed, my only question is why???
Why the need for this flag, that has nothing to do with football???

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I daresay there is a sizeable number of Derry fans who support Celtic but what does that prove? Are you a mini Celtic?

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No, but we don't wear green and white, sing Celtic songs (Follow Follow) nor are we celebrated in any 'Blues Brother' way

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that do not need to rely on any other club (or indeed any MP's to call in favours to get us out of a mess and in doing so neglecting another club in his native city).

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No David you depend on the IFA for that!!!

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Originally Posted by David

But that is your choice. Why do so many people on here want to be dictatorial about what people can and cannot do at a football match? What makes you the high and mighty that can decide what is right or wrong for another club. I have said umpteem times I will back you all the way when complaining about sectarian songs like the Billy Boys and indeed would have backed those complaining if (as was initially alleged on here) there had been a paramilitary flag in our support but if people want to fly the flag of a Christian legal organisation then that is their choice and who the feck is anyone on here (including me) to tell them that they cannot do it.

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Would you find issue with anyone displaying far right paraphernalia at a Linfield game ? Groups like the National Front and BNP are legal political/cultural organisations. Or does your supposed laissez-faire nature stop when it comes to legal organisations who are anything other than anti-Catholic ?

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Originally Posted by David

So if a song is sang by Rangers supporters that makes it a Rangers song? Very strange logic there. I repeat I have not heard a Rangers song at Windsor in tyears.

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Frankly - yes ! If a sung is sung excluively at football games by fans of a particular club, then it is a song of that club - regardless of whetehr it began life in that way or not.

'I'm forever blowing bubbles' is a West Ham song, for example - but I doubt its author Jaan Kenbrovin had ever even heard of West Ham United.

'You'll never Walk Alone' is clearly a Liverpool anthem - even though it is occassionally sung by fans of other clubs, and began life and remains primarily a christian anthem.

Likewise with GSTQ, Rule Britannia, The Sash and Billy Boys. At club level you will only hear 2 groups of fans with a penchant for singing this frequently: Rangers and Linfield. Grow up and stop pretending otherwise. You're making yourself look such an idiot.....

Ive no time for sectarianism in football, but I cant see how stopping the singing of songs(as long as not sectarian) is going to help. I hear the fields of athenry sang alot by many different teams does this mean that all these teams even if they change lyrics want to just be a mini version of Celtic.

I think linfield as a club and many others should encourage the signing of personal songs of their own, but it would be wrong to just label Linfield out, as clubs throughout the world have songs that others prefer not to hear.

people will only be offended if they want.

When i go to matches Im not offended if I hear the fields of Athenry or if I hear Rule Brittania. both songs that I dont feel represent me as a person at all. but still not offensive.

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Originally Posted by Speranza

What a sad vicious jibe. So lets get this straight, by helping one person you are by default neglecting another? What a backward way of looking at things but if you want to continue down that line, Derry City Council recently granted Institute a sizeable grant while we still wait on news regarding our crumbling stadium. Please don't attempt to show my city as a parochial/divided one alike your own David when the facts show otherwise.

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Londonderry a divided city? Never seeing as it is only safe for one community to cross the bridge into the city by all accounts and where Protestants are constantly under attack if news bulletins and people who I know are to be believed. How could anyone possibly call your city divided? Take your self righteousness and work it right up yer bangle.

Should Mr Hume not have tried to do work for both the senior clubs in his community instead of getting numerous high profile friendlies for just one of them to bail them out of the mess they had got themselves into. Not sure if you have ever been to the Riverside but I have news for you, Old Trafford it ain't.

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Originally Posted by Dassa

Ive no time for sectarianism in football, but I cant see how stopping the singing of songs(as long as not sectarian) is going to help. I hear the fields of athenry sang alot by many different teams does this mean that all these teams even if they change lyrics want to just be a mini version of Celtic.

I think linfield as a club and many others should encourage the signing of personal songs of their own, but it would be wrong to just label Linfield out, as clubs throughout the world have songs that others prefer not to hear.

people will only be offended if they want.

When i go to matches Im not offended if I hear the fields of Athenry or if I hear Rule Brittania. both songs that I dont feel represent me as a person at all. but still not offensive.

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Exactly. My preference would be for these songs not to be sung at Linfield games and I have stated that many times. However I do not feel I have a right to judge people who disagree with that as others on here are doing.

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Originally Posted by David

Londonderry a divided city? Never seeing as it is only safe for one community to cross the bridge into the city by all accounts and where Protestants are constantly under attack if news bulletins and people who I know are to be believed. How could anyone possibly call your city divided? Take your self righteousness and work it right up yer bangle.

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Don't know where Londonderry is but your generalisations about the place are ridiculous.

The Riverside certainly isn't OT but it is a stadium which is suitable for Stute. It matches their attendances and is a modern ground despite it being small. The Brandywell is a disgrace for a team playing UEFA cup football and the council are happy to let it stay in disrepair.