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I saw on the news the other day that Freddy Flintstone (or whatever his name is) was given the freedom of his home town. I asked my missus was that Cape Town, Jo'burg or Harare? :D (Yeah, yeah, I know it was somewhere up north, but I had a point)Quote:
Originally Posted by Hither green
Voting going pretty much as expected . LOI fans against it, those who don't foolow a club in ireland for it.
Well, i'm an eL fan far more than the national team but accepting all arguments for more recognition of eL players i'd still vote the first option even if it wasQuote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
"have your family raped and qualify for the World Cup".
I think the existing rules are fair in that we've never had a 2nd gen playing who didn't want to be playing. Do people forget how good world cups are?
Glad I'm not related to you! :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Risteard
Did you mean Retard when you created your name and not Risteard?...but seriously, you gotta be having a laughQuote:
Originally Posted by Risteard
is it possible to follow an EL club without being a fan of the league?
As I said in another thread, if it's good enough for Poland and Russia to play 'naturalised' Nigerians and for Portugal, Tunisia and Middle Eastern Countries to play 'naturalised' Brazilians -none of whom have blood ties to their 'FIFA' Country, then we should not get so hung up about someone who has an Irish Grandparent.
Probably not ideal, but that's the way it is in International soccer these days.
:(
Can we make a leap and say, at the moment (56% v's 54%), the majority (no matter the magin) put their country before clubs in their country?:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
poland and Russia havent got a policy of relying on it. and those nigerians actually live and play in poland and russia. so its not the same thing at all, is it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shelsman
Well if, by "nearly all", you mean one, then yes.:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Hither green
Pietersen has an English mother and Geraint Jones has two Welsh parents so I think most people are willing to allow for 2nd generation nationality at least. I'll give you Andrew Strauss (although he has been living in England since he was 7). Or does that make him "more English" than someone with one parent from there? Depends what way you want to look at it I suppose.
Not to say that there haven't been dubious cases in the past but I think rugby (particularly Scotland and Wales) is one of the worst offenders in this regard. In some cases grandparents were found out not to even be from the countries involved. And three years residency is all you need to qualify. I heard a story about an Englishman who tried to declare for Wales because he spent 3 years with a Welsh club. Only problem was he was still living in England the whole time! Also New Zealand have been shameless in giving out scholarships to any promising Pacific Islander in order to claim the best for the All-Blacks. The equivalent would be the England FA automatically claiming all Irish schoolboys who join English clubs. :mad:
F**k the granny rule, we don't need any of the players being suggested enough IMO to go back to the days whereby half the Irish team were British. It made a bit of a nonsense of all our great achievements under Jack when everyone was aware that the majority of the players involved weren't even Irish. In recent years at least we've had the situation were most of our players were Irish and we put in our best performances in any major championships in 2002 with those mainly Irish players (We were s**te in 1994, Holland just laughed at us and boring as f**k in 1990).
If ever the granny rule was going to be implemented it should have been done 2-3 years ago when we had a shortage of talent on the horizon. It may even have helped us qualify for the European Championships and the World Cup. Now, however, we've enough young talent coming through and that should be given the chance instead of sticking with older, less committed, England rejects.
If your father and/or mother are Irish and you're born and raised abroad then I'd say you are at least partially Irish and if you're committed to playing for Ireland from day 1 then by all means ply your trade for us. I'd be happy to have such players. If only your granny is Irish I don't think that makes anyone Irish (in the slighest) so I'd prefer those players to steer clear.
You're right: It's not the same thing: The players the FAI seek have blood of the country they are representing. Example: the geezer who went to Portsmouth via Panathinaikos didn't hang around too much in Poland, but in your eyes he's far worthier of citizenship than the grandson of an Irish emigrant who married a foreigner. And did either of these countries have so much of their population pushed out through emigration (70 million of some sort of Irish descent in the world compared with 5 million on the island)? Even at the height of East Gemany haemorrhaging people in 1989, Ireland was still losing more people per head.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roverstillidie
The only thing the same is that all these players are career enhancers. Personally I wouldn't turn down a Nigerian who was passing through Ireland either if he becomes entitled to citizenship. Don't care if he got one of those dodgy deals that Albert set up for the Arab with his cat food factory in the nineties. If it's lawful, then do it. It's just that with a 'Ius sanguinis' approach one can always argue that the connection above everything else is a genealogical one which I'm afraid carries far more respect in gaining citizenship throughout the world than residency.
Nice to see that happening now, because that wasn't the case in the 80s. I mean that's like having the Irish compromise rule side made up of Aussies. Personally they can have the side packed full of martians resident in Surrey, just don't start lecturing other countries about who they pick.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry The Saint
lopez, if you get off your high horse for a minuite and actually read what people are saying we might be able to have an informed debate.
no-one so far has suggested that genuine diaspora be blocked from representing ireland.
merely that staunton openly admitting he will try and find non-irish players who are technically eligible but dont know it is a regressive step and a very short-termist view.
olisadebe is a polish citizen by virtue of nationalisation. clinton morrison is a chancer. when you can spot the difference, you might be able to approach this rationally.
I'd say that 54% put their country ahead of their clubs in other countres..Quote:
Originally Posted by Tired&Emotional
I don't see this as a club versus country issue as few eL players will get in the squad let alone the team in either scenario. Just look back all the crap non-irish players who got a cap or two & wouldn't it be better than an irish kid who played for all those under age teams got that senior cap?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tired&Emotional
How can you say 56% V54 % surely it should be 46 % V54% or 56% V44% . Otherwise it adds up to 110% and we have enough of that in football talk to be honest.
Typo, obviously: was at 56/44 at the time!!
But the 110% thing - you're not wrong there!! ;)
Supposing ...just supposing there was a Santa ...and you could get a present off him -but in order to for him to get to you his sleigh would have to run over the Easter Bunny ...
would it be worth it? well would it. I'll add a poll.
Was a bit tongue-in-cheek tbh but yes you are right.Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
There have been some crap players who have not been born here that have worn the Green Jersey!
That argument has run its course, for now - we agree there are basically two opinions on this and we are roughly split down the middle.
Generally speaking though if one accepts that the game is at higher level across the water (thats why there is a long tradition of Irish players heading over there to ply their trade with, arguably, the best/better) then it is only natural that the selection process will start there. It becomes more difficult to PROPERLY dedicate time to two countries - we'll see if Stans promise on this will bear fruit...
Personally I hope he does cap some eL players but whether they will good enough themselves to claim and keep a place for Internationals is another thing (bearing in mind what I have said above already, 1st/2nd line)
There are at least three threads on the subject and certain posters (not you) have been against anyone without an Irish accent from getting picked. It's their opinion of course. Who am I to argue if they think a dog born in a stable is a horse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roverstillidie
I'd agree with that view to a certain extent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roverstillidie
They're both chancers. Except Olisadebe probably needed a citizenship ceremony to go through complete with oath of allegience etc. while Morrisson needed a cheque for £35 for a Foreign Births Certificate. No country imposes such restrictions (generation difference notwithstanding) on whom it sees as descendents of its people. That might make Olisadebe more Polish than Morrison is Irish in your view but not mine, nor indeed it seems either government.Quote:
Originally Posted by Roverstillidie