France V Republic of Ireland - Thursday, 7th September 2023 - Euro 2024 Qualifier

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Originally Posted by backstothewall

Regardless of all he has done, calling a guy up from League 2 to face 2 the best sides in the world is just embarrassing. McClean simply should not be there.

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This is the straw that breaks the camel’s back for me. I wanted Kenny to succeed because what fan doesn’t want a successful manager? But the slack cut for Covid and some bad luck hasn’t led to anything like the pretty modest standards we expect – competence, competitiveness, being able to play a bit. And calling up a fourth tier player in a continuation of blind loyalty is beyond the pale. It’s unnecessary and indefensible.

Crosby, Connolly, at least, is playing, and playing OK, two divisions higher and 11 or 12 years younger.

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Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

French squad confirmed

Dear lord

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We’ll stuff ‘em!!

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Originally Posted by Eminence Grise

And calling up a fourth tier player in a continuation of blind loyalty is beyond the pale. It’s unnecessary and indefensible

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He called Manning back in, despite the guy having better plans the last time we gathered & O'Dowda is out injured. Doherty out. Coleman out.Someone has to fill the gaps unless we stick a scarecrow at LB / LWB v France and Holland. Am I missing anyone ?

McNamara and Lyons I suppose, but I think they're both right-sided players, not left?

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

McNamara and Lyons I suppose, but I think they're both right-sided players, not left?

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Right sided mostly far as I know.
It's a disaster having to pick a D4 player on his way down, I'm not happy about it in case I'm misunderstood. But if it's a choice between a D4 player who you know exactly what you'll get from who's been in these type games before & seeing how a newbie gets on - in these two games & these circumstances, well I can see why he called it the way he did.

Lyons has actually been playing on the left this season for Blackpool and think he played a bit there last season. Played quite a bit on the left for Shamrock Rovers and might have featured there for the U21s.

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Originally Posted by JR89

Lyons has actually been playing on the left this season for Blackpool and think he played a bit there last season. Played quite a bit on the left for Shamrock Rovers and might have featured there for the U21s.

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Would you put him in this squad ?

Manning, meh, and Stevens, also meh – but crucially both play in McClean’s position and are playing two divisions higher. There’s a handful of other former internationals playing in League 2: no matter what crisis of cover in a position they’ve never been considered for a call-up, and with good reason – they’re not playing at the right level. I’m not saying they were ever as good as McClean at his best – but McClean isn’t as good as his best these days either.


Doherty and Coleman are both right-sided, so not an entirely like for like comparison. You can argue that both can play in McClean’s position, but that ignores the fact the McClean himself is a former winger who can play LWB, but never was one to begin with, much less a particularly good one, and his conversion to the role allowed Kenny keep him too long in the squad.


Good managers make brave decisions. A tactical tweak. A fresh call-up. Calling up McClean is poor management. The devil you know isn't always the best option That’s my tuppence worth.

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Originally Posted by CraftyToePoke

He called Manning back in, despite the guy having better plans the last time we gathered & O'Dowda is out injured. Doherty out. Coleman out.Someone has to fill the gaps unless we stick a scarecrow at LB / LWB v France and Holland. Am I missing anyone ?

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Why, when you've already got two specialist left wingbacks available and named in the squad, in Manning and Stevens, do we also need an ageing, limited, League Two, converted winger in there as well? Only two right wingbacks have been named, after all, and one of those is suspended for one of the games.

There's asolutely no need to resort to League Two players. Or scarecrows.

In any case, Ebosele can cover both sides.

It only serves to act as a ready-made excuse when we're out of the running for qualification with several games to go, yet again.

'Sure what do you expect? It's not Kenny's fault - we had a League Two player out there on the pitch last night'.

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Originally Posted by CraftyToePoke

Right sided mostly far as I know.
It's a disaster having to pick a D4 player on his way down, I'm not happy about it in case I'm misunderstood. But if it's a choice between a D4 player who you know exactly what you'll get from who's been in these type games before & seeing how a newbie gets on - in these two games & these circumstances, well I can see why he called it the way he did.

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I suppose Scales is the another option - has played left wing-back and been in the squad on that basis before, but I think is more at home at centre-back and afaik was playing at centre-back for Aberdeen last year and for Celtic last week.

I'm inclined to agree with you on McClean though. He hasn't suddenly become a worse player because he's dropped two divisions (to a pretty well-funded team), but against that the more he plays there (and he's only played once so far), the less sharp he's surely likely to be for these games. I can't see how his involvement lasts beyond this campaign. Probably same goes for Coleman if we're honest. And then we're back to the same question of who's left...

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Originally Posted by CraftyToePoke

Would you put him in this squad ?

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Nope. I like the lad and hope he pushes on in the next couple of years but wouldn't have him in the squad atm. Don't think we'll get a play off, so starting from New Zealand in November we should have at a minimum five friendlies and I'd be looking to try out new blood such as Lyons and co in the WB positions or FB positions if we've a new manager by then and he reverts back to four in defence.

Isn’t Hendrick being named under the same auspices as Parrott not being named?

There's nobody better out there who is fit and wasn't called up. Probably the thing that strikes me though is that there are three left sided defenders in there. Kenny hinted in the press conference that McClean isn't fully fit, which is why there are three for that position. Which suggests that one of Manning or Stevens is only in because McClean is not fully fit and wouldn't have been picked otherwise.

Looking at the squad as a whole, it's good that Manning Duffy, Manning, Stevens and Festy have been called up. Their recalls are merited and their presence strengthens the squad.

It's also good, in a way, to see that Omobamidele and Parrott haven't been called up again just because they have been in the past. If they want to get back in, they'll have to earn the opportunity.

Kenny has made the right calls in these instances, I think, and deserves credit.

Including McClean is baffling. He didn't become a bad player over night - short of catastrophic injury, no player does - but his career has been in decline for several years, and has now reached the point where he's playing at too low a level to be worthy of inclusion. And, in any event, I just don't see how he can be fit.

Calling up Hendrick seems strange, unless Kenny's been informed that he's on the verge of a move. Surely he can't be ready to start any of the games, having been frozen out at Newcastle. So why select him?

Connolly being in surprises me, given that Rosenior has said he still isn't fit enough to play more than 30 minutes. I guess Kenny has concluded that he'd be a useful option of the bench if we're in a situation where we're desperate for a goal. But I think he'd have been better served staying at his club and working on his fitness.

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Originally Posted by Trequartista20

Looking at the squad as a whole, it's good that Manning Duffy, Manning, Stevens and Festy have been called up. Their recalls are merited and their presence strengthens the squad.

It's also good, in a way, to see that Omobamidele and Parrott haven't been called up again just because they have been in the past. If they want to get back in, they'll have to earn the opportunity.

Kenny has made the right calls in these instances, I think, and deserves credit.

Including McClean is baffling. He didn't become a bad player over night - short of catastrophic injury, no player does - but his career has been in decline for several years, and has now reached the point where he's playing at too low a level to be worthy of inclusion. And, in any event, I just don't see how he can be fit.

Calling up Hendrick seems strange, unless Kenny's been informed that he's on the verge of a move. [B[Surely he can't be ready to start any of the games, having been frozen out at Newcastle. So why select him?

Connolly being in surprises me, given that Rosenior has said he still isn't fit enough to play more than 30 minutes. I guess Kenny has concluded that he'd be a useful option of the bench if we're in a situation where we're desperate for a goal. But I think he'd have been better served staying at his club and working on his fitness.

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Well he won't be starting any games and likely will get a few minutes off the bench if even that. So far this campaign he's only played 5mins against Gibraltar. In the three friendlies between the NLs and qualifiers he played 8mins against Norway, 24mins against Malta, and 8mins against Latvia.

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Originally Posted by backstothewall

Regardless of all he has done, calling a guy up from League 2 to face 2 the best sides in the world is just embarrassing. McClean simply should not be there.

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And....Hendrick and McGrath deemed to be better than Smozdics? Doesn't make the slightest bit of sense

I suppose the question with Hendrick is - if you're not picking him, what central midfielder who has played regularly in the position this season are you replacing him with? Because I'm not seeing anyone that fits that description who plays at a decent level. Szmodics is an attacking midfielder/forward, Sykes is a wide player. Taylor hasn't been playing. Looking further down the divisions the next candidate would be Hourihane but I think there might be a widespread meltdown among Irish supporters if he was brought back. But we might be one injury away from it right now...and Smallbone's fitness for next week is questionable as things stand.

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Originally Posted by Trequartista20

Looking at the squad as a whole, it's good that Manning Duffy, Manning, Stevens and Festy have been called up. Their recalls are merited and their presence strengthens the squad.

It's also good, in a way, to see that Omobamidele and Parrott haven't been called up again just because they have been in the past. If they want to get back in, they'll have to earn the opportunity.

Kenny has made the right calls in these instances, I think, and deserves credit.

Including McClean is baffling. He didn't become a bad player over night - short of catastrophic injury, no player does - but his career has been in decline for several years, and has now reached the point where he's playing at too low a level to be worthy of inclusion. And, in any event, I just don't see how he can be fit.

Calling up Hendrick seems strange, unless Kenny's been informed that he's on the verge of a move. Surely he can't be ready to start any of the games, having been frozen out at Newcastle. So why select him?

Connolly being in surprises me, given that Rosenior has said he still isn't fit enough to play more than 30 minutes. I guess Kenny has concluded that he'd be a useful option of the bench if we're in a situation where we're desperate for a goal. But I think he'd have been better served staying at his club and working on his fitness.

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On the whole, I kind of agree with you about McClean. I just dont know who takes that position instead of him. On one hand, if you have comfort, with COD and Doc out, in having a set of Manning, Festy and Stevens in there to cover the left - what else do you need? On the other hand, does McClean perform more of a team bonding, senior player, quasi-captain role in the absence of Coleman and there is some benefit to that in Kenny's mind? (McClean is well liked among the players to be fair).

There is no-one that stands out as missing at his expense.

If McClean starts, or even sees game time, all bets are off...

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Originally Posted by Eirambler

I suppose the question with Hendrick is - if you're not picking him, what central midfielder who has played regularly in the position this season are you replacing him with? Because I'm not seeing anyone that fits that description who plays at a decent level. Szmodics is an attacking midfielder/forward, Sykes is a wide player. Taylor hasn't been playing. Looking further down the divisions the next candidate would be Hourihane but I think there might be a widespread meltdown among Irish supporters if he was brought back. But we might be one injury away from it right now...and Smallbone's fitness for next week is questionable as things stand.

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The genuine options as a deep midfielder to replace him were: Hodge (injured), Connell (injured), Coventry (not playing), Kilkenny (not playing). Otherwise, you're talking about LOI (Git Forrester perhaps?)

Makes total sense to me that Hendrick is still being picked in that context.

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Originally Posted by Trequartista20

It only serves to act as a ready-made excuse when we're out of the running for qualification with several games to go, yet again.

'Sure what do you expect? It's not Kenny's fault - we had a League Two player out there on the pitch last night'.

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You were quoting me when your post took this bit of a meander when I have not said anything that could be remotely construed or indeed misconstrued in this way.

Neither has anybody else on the thread.

These hoardes of in chorus Kennyite voices are entirely in your head & maybe you shouldn't let them get in there so easily.

If & when we do get two good beatings it'll be more to do with our midfield, in as much as we don't have one in terms of the level we are inconvenienced by having to play at. Maybe Kenny will take those ones with him & the new guy will bring some better ones, ones we'd all prefer. Because until we have some of those, we're kinda stuck where we are, broadly speaking.

Unless we go back to bypassing midfield again. Because that was a great watch.