It was bound to happen...

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Originally Posted by -lamb-

1) there are only 16 senior teams in northern ireland - the 16 in the premier league. that's it. very roughly that's 1 per 100,000 people. you think that's too many?

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To be honest - 1 club per 100,000 of population does feel a bit high for Norn Ireland - especially given that it's about 1 in 60,000 for the Belfast region (even with Crus relegated). Also - looking at other leagues nearby, the figures are :

ENGLAND : 1 in 435,000 (in a country absolutely obsessed with football)
ROI : 1 in 181,000
SCOTLAND : 1 IN 120,000.

And I don't accept this notion of only 16 senior clubs in the north. It's not that simple, given promotion and relegation. Are Crusaders, Carrick, Bangor and Ballyclare all honestly and magically no longer 'senior' clubs since they got relegated ? Were Glenavon magically non-senior, then magically senior again when the same club went up and down in a short period of time ?Maybe technically 'yes' as that is the semantics of being relegated in the IL, but they are still the same clubs that have been around in the senior league for years. Describing the Daily Mirror Irish League First Division as 'intermediate' is just like changing the English First Division into the English Premiership - its just semantics. At least a third of the IL First has played in the IL Premier at some stage in the recent past.

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Originally Posted by -lamb-

2) i know you're being light hearted here, but why should we? i have no particular issue with it other than for me saturday at 3pm is the best and traditional time for football.
in all seriousness, where else would amateur football take precedence over senior football?

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And in all seriousness, where else would the religious strictures of a minority of the population (particularly in a society scarred by decades of cultural-religious strife) take precedence over senior football ? Maybe in non-Western nations like Israel or Saudi Arabia - but in 21st Century Europe..... ? :confused: :p

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Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

And in all seriousness, where else would the religious strictures of a minority of the population (particularly in a society scarred by decades of cultural-religious strife) take precedence over senior football ? Maybe in non-Western nations like Israel or Saudi Arabia - but in 21st Century Europe..... ? :confused: :p

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don't get me wrong, i totally agree that the rule is archaic (even the recent proposal to change wasn't about forcing teams to play on a sunday but giving them an option if all agreed. there's also internal IFA politics going on here to do with a lack of will on some parts to relinquish control and an attitude of "if i can't win i'll bring them all down with me"), BUT at the same time the vast majority of fans still want matches on saturday afternoons and my point was, since that is the case, why should a senior team have to even consider moving their games to suit amateur football organisers? it makes little sense. i know there would be some logistical problems regarding pitch availability but realistically the only result is lost gates for their senior team and denial of the amateur players (and whatever family that goes to watch) their chance to support their local senior team.

Lamb and dcfcsteve - This is a really interesting debate. The structure in England below the '92' (Premier League, Championship, League One and League Two).

It used to be that these were the only professional teams in England (i.e. paid for full 52 weeks a year) and that some league below that were considered semi professional (i.e. paid from August to May roughly).

However, the National Conference, which is below League Two is nearly all full time professional now and even some of the Conference North and South teams below it are starting to go that way! How the clubs can afford this is beyond me - it's chasing the (near) impossible dream with overnight success!

Below this we have the Northern Premier, Southern and Isthmian Leagues who all have a Premier Division and either one or two regional Division One's. These are all semi-professional, paying from the top maybe £500GBP per week down to about £50GBP per week!

Below this is the Non League 'Step Five' League's, many whose clubs' players are paid, so they are semi-professional. There are 15 of these leagues, shortly to be reduced to 12 as there is likely to be a new 'Midland Premier and Division One' at NL Steps Three and Four, so many clubs to be promoted and less leagues below!

Most of the Step Five leagues have a lower division at Step Six and generally, here ends the 'Senior' divisions in the Southern half of England. In the Northern/Midland half, Senior goes right down to Step Seven (county leagues). It's a real mess as it's County FAs who decide 'senior' or 'intermediate' status! Some leagues have senior and intermediate clubs in the same division!

Scotland is equally stupid. You have Scottish Premier, Scottish League One to Three. Then there is Highland, East Of Scotland and South Of Scotland Leagues who are senior. Most other areas of the country have 'junior' clubs, who are in terms of support, grounds etc, bigger than some SL clubs!

I don't see anything wrong with the IFL having more than one division, indeed I think there are more positives in having more clubs under the umbrella of one identifiable league rather than lots with differing standards as in England and Scotland.

Although Wales is frowned upon by some in England, at least their 'pyramid' is taking shape, although the boat could be rocked if they go for summer football. The Welsh Premier League couldn't do it in isolation and lower down there isn't the support.

I would like to see more clubs in the League Of Ireland. Maybe two extras to make 2 x 12 club divisions. Mullingar and Newbridge anybody?

Your thoughts....

The IFA ban on sunday football is apparently illegal under Uefa & Fifa rules. I think i read the British government will withhold funding unless changed too.

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Originally Posted by -lamb-

for me saturday at 3pm is the best and traditional time for football.

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Only in the UK.

We thankfully have no tradition of, nor demand for, playing league games at 3pm on Saturdays in the Republic. Saturday games are always played in the evening here, like in the rest of Europe. :) Sadly however, the FAI insist that we should play home International games at 3pm on Saturdays, out of kilter with when most other countries play. :rolleyes: :(

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Originally Posted by pete

The IFA ban on sunday football is apparently illegal under Uefa & Fifa rules. I think i read the British government will withhold funding unless changed too.

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hence it's important to note the part i placed in brackets.-
(...there's also internal IFA politics going on here to do with a lack of will on some parts to relinquish control and an attitude of "if i can't win i'll bring them all down with me")

mypost - "Only in the UK.

We thankfully have no tradition of, nor demand for, playing league games at 3pm on Saturdays in the Republic."

you say that like its a problem...not for the majority of supporters who want to watch football in the uk though.
each to their own on that count (including arranging sunday games if they wish). my only problem with it is the clash with amateur league games.