B International 1990 v England

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04/04/2012, 10:10 AM
Drumcondra 69er

Quote:

Originally Posted by gastric

I think you're missing the point that Geysir and I are making. Granted Beglin did play on with some success, but at what cost? As Geysir pointed out he is still in pain nearly twenty years on. Was extending his career worth it? That's the essence of our argument.

As regards Paisley, while he wasn't manager at the time he still had an an insight into what was happening around the club and would have had an interest in his last signing as manager. What he said about Beglin was more out of concern for him, rather than a criticism of him.

Maybe I am, the impression Geysir's post gave me was that Pasiley wanted Beglin to stay and try and recover at Liverpool whereas yours was that Paisley wanted him to retire? Plenty of footballers suffer from pain following retirement due to injuries suffered, most of them have no regrets though. Having met Beglin and seen quotes about his time at Leeds he'd fall into that category. My own knees are crocked due to cartlidge issues and I never got beyond AUL!
04/04/2012, 3:20 PM
the bear

knees are like target signs in the aul
04/04/2012, 9:07 PM
geysir

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er

Maybe I am, the impression Geysir's post gave me was that Pasiley wanted Beglin to stay and try and recover at Liverpool whereas yours was that Paisley wanted him to retire?

Nah, Liverpool were not interested in keeping Beglin as a player, if Paisley said what's attributed to him here, then it was out of concern for Beglin.

We could have had a very decent team at Euro88 if both Lawrenson and Beglin were not forced into premature retirement, not to mention Brady.
04/04/2012, 9:07 PM
Paddy Garcia

The odd things here is that Irwin was just about the best full back playing in England at the time - yet failed to make the Irish 1st team squad. I recall at the time that this was a big oversight by jack.
04/04/2012, 9:32 PM
Junior

Irwin was with Oldham in the old second division at the time, not disputing what you say but who were the fullbacks that went in the squad, without checking I am presuming it was Hughton, Morris, who else?

EDIT: wiki is your friend. John Anderson is the only other defender I see in the squad and I know nothin about him (+ McCarthy, Moran and McGrath - Midfielder come CB I guess at the time).
04/04/2012, 11:25 PM
EastTerracer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junior

Irwin was with Oldham in the old second division at the time, not disputing what you say but who were the fullbacks that went in the squad, without checking I am presuming it was Hughton, Morris, who else?

EDIT: wiki is your friend. John Anderson is the only other defender I see in the squad and I know nothin about him (+ McCarthy, Moran and McGrath - Midfielder come CB I guess at the time).

John Anderson was a good player for Newcastle United and he benefited from the fact that Jack knew him from his own short spell as manager at St James Park.

Born and bred in Dublin so he wasn't one of the diaspora who Jack specialised in seeking out.
05/04/2012, 8:33 AM
jbyrne

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junior

Irwin was with Oldham in the old second division at the time, not disputing what you say but who were the fullbacks that went in the squad, without checking I am presuming it was Hughton, Morris, who else?

Irwin was quoted around that time that his move to Man utd was more important to him than getting into the Italy 90 squad. I know he went on to represent us excellently afterwards but a disappointing thing for him to have said
05/04/2012, 9:24 AM
the bear

Quote:

Originally Posted by EastTerracer

John Anderson was a good player for Newcastle United and he benefited from the fact that Jack knew him from his own short spell as manager at St James Park.

Born and bred in Dublin so he wasn't one of the diaspora who Jack specialised in seeking out.

went on to have a good career as the referee on gladiators
05/04/2012, 7:41 PM
Paddy Garcia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junior

Irwin was with Oldham in the old second division at the time, not disputing what you say but who were the fullbacks that went in the squad, without checking I am presuming it was Hughton, Morris, who else?

EDIT: wiki is your friend. John Anderson is the only other defender I see in the squad and I know nothin about him (+ McCarthy, Moran and McGrath - Midfielder come CB I guess at the time).

And Irwin was in a different class to Morris - hence the move by Man U - Fergie spotted him before Jack.
05/04/2012, 9:04 PM
Charlie Darwin

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbyrne

Irwin was quoted around that time that his move to Man utd was more important to him than getting into the Italy 90 squad. I know he went on to represent us excellently afterwards but a disappointing thing for him to have said

Surely it wasn't his decision to make? He probably meant that he wasn't playing at the highest level yet and you can't really be expecting to make a World Cup squad ahead of more senior players unless you are. I'd imagine it'd be the same if you asked James McClean today whether he expects to be in the Euro squad - he'll say his first priority is keeping his place at Sunderland.
05/04/2012, 10:08 PM
bennocelt

From what I can remember (albeit i was young!) Irwin was a class act even when he was with Oldham but Jack like Trap today wasn't one for changing a solid squad and the only issue pre-1990 was Waddock. <br><br>
07/04/2012, 5:42 PM
Drumcondra 69er

Quote:

Originally Posted by bennocelt

From what I can remember (albeit i was young!) Irwin was a class act even when he was with Oldham but Jack like Trap today wasn't one for changing a solid squad and the only issue pre-1990 was Waddock. <br><br>

He was but he'd been playing in the 2nd tier and had had to rebuild his career afate being wrongly let go by Leeds along with Terry Phelan. WC 90 was too early for him imo...
09/04/2012, 2:12 PM
Paddy Garcia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er

He was but he'd been playing in the 2nd tier and had had to rebuild his career afate being wrongly let go by Leeds along with Terry Phelan. WC 90 was too early for him imo...

Don't agree with you there.

He was not too early for Man U - & he was a first teamer from Aug. Fergie would not have invested in Morris (nothing against Morris - great servant) - but the difference in class was obvious even then, although Irwin was in the 2nd tier.
09/04/2012, 2:31 PM
Drumcondra 69er

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia

Don't agree with you there.

He was not too early for Man U - & he was a first teamer from Aug. Fergie would not have invested in Morris (nothing against Morris - great servant) - but the difference in class was obvious even then, although Irwin was in the 2nd tier.

He'd come good that season during Oldham's run to the cup semi, it was the first season he'd shown anything since his early days at Leeds. We'd already qualified by the time he hit form and the likes of Morris were playing at a higher standard week in week out. It would have been a very big call to bring him in as a rookie and start him albeit that Jack had done something similar in 88 with Morris himself.

And I dunno about Fergie's investments back then, he bought Mal Donaghy and Mike Phelan! :)

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