All-Ireland representative team survey

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Originally Posted by French Toasht

In fairness you don't see any of the Orange Order flags that we saw recently at the ROI V NI game or the sectarian chanting by the NI fans in the tunnel during the NI v Scotland game at rugby matches

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I don't think this is as siginficant as you suggest. I can't remember the last time before May that I saw OO flags at a NI game. One of the most promiment rugby fans from NI- ex MP Ken Maginnis- is a prominent member of the Royal Black Preceptory (more eccentric variant of the Order).

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Its well known the football attracts an element that I doubt have much of an interest in football

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I take your broad point that the bad temper at rugby union matches is usually confined on-pitch. Does RU not attract plenty of event junkies to game at Lansdowne?

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As regards NI players who'd start for us, I'd only take Davis and Evans, but I doubt Davis would get a look in in Trap's system. Brunt is good but not better than Duff

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Brunt's better than Duff now, if not Duff's peak. You can't really mix real and notional team selections though, can you? If Trap's granny had balls, etc.

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I gather there was great support in the 80s when they were in WCs etc

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Certainly was. Community relations were a lot worse than now (225 'political' murders in 1981/82, 118 in 1985/86), but of course our team was better. That may sound trite, but 343 murders obviously outrank some mad coaches/ lazy journalists/ splenetic fans ranting on the internet as an irritant.
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And as Danny eluded to in his article, it will only have served to make young nationalists more entrenched in their desire to play for Ireland/not represent NI

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Some young nationalists, I daresay. Others will act differently. This will blow over eventually, don't ye think?

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Originally Posted by Stuttgart 88

That's a bit rich, when you still refer to "the South"

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It's not in the least "rich"- I'm not suggesting the South's (which is what many people in NI, not just unionists, call it] team be abolished, as he's effectively proposing for NI's.

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just because you believe we have a de facto all-Ireland team, doesn't mean that CR can't wish for an authentic one

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Naughty. That there's a de facto all-Ireland team is self-evident, not just a whim of mine. It has fans and players from all over Ireland (and beyond), always has. If CR doesn't think that "authentic", that's his affair, but if he drones on about ending an NI team, do you seriously expect NI fans not to answer him?

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I'm not sure there are any simpletons who think there could be 22 players in an AI team. You didn't do your argument any favours by putting in such a facile point

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Er, it was a gag not meant to be taken literally: no need to be so po-faced. I'll put it slightly differently: there are indeed plenty of simpletons about who think adding two or three players from one mediocre football team to another would make the resulting new team not just marginally but massively better, pretty much by definition. They're all over the internet and phone-ins.

i) Yes
ii) No
iii) Yes
iv) Yes

Even though I recently found out how to do it, I'm still not too adept at multi-quoting so I'll avoid doing it.

Yes, I think there are "event junkie" types at the rugby, as well as a good solid core.

wrt, the "South" (sic), just beacuse many people in NI call it that, doesn't make it right. I'm not too fussed but when you respond like you did to CR, it invites a similar response in my opinion.

Anyone here calling for a AI team would not be calling for NI's team (or ours) to be abolished, but rather for two teams to be merged. It may not have the same appeal to either set of supporters, but it would still be (officially, if not emotionally) representative of each.

Point taken about the literal gag, and agreed.

I really like Brunt btw. Duff is never fit anyway!

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Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Anyone here calling for a AI team would not be calling for NI's team (or ours) to be abolished, but rather for two teams to be merged. It may not have the same appeal to either set of supporters, but it would still be (officially, if not emotionally) representative of each

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Sorry, I don't buy that. Pretty much everybody calling for a AI team (beyond the one that already exists) quite clearly see it as

a) playing (almost) all home games in Dublin

b) retaining flags, emblems etc. of the current RoI team

c) this being formally recognised by UEFA (so that, for example, it wouldn't have to start the next tournament in seeding pot six)...

Not interested.

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I really like Brunt btw. Duff is never fit anyway!

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I can't see Brunt starring in the CL, t obe honest. Very skilful at English Championship or even lower-mid EPL level, but he's one-footed and one-paced.

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Originally Posted by French Toasht

A question for the ROI fans. Do you support NI? (when they are not playing us obviously). I gather there was great support in the 80s when they were in WCs etc. I would always have wished them the best of luck and particularly during the Stan era, when our campaign was effectively over before it started, I always looked to the NI result first after our own and their exploits against Spain etc. But to be honest the recent acrimony they have caused, the pathetic petition, the blogs, the boycotts, and just Nigel Worthington in general have really made it hard to back them. And as Danny alluded to in his article, it will only have served to make young nationalists more entrenched in their desire to play for Ireland/not represent NI.

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Personally, I wouldn't say I ever supported them, although I might have looked out for the odd result with a sort of 'local rivalry' type of interest, maybe akin to how I'd look out for an England result here and there or something, although I can't say I'd have been overly bothered one way or the other whether they won or lost. Naturally, I was impressed - maybe even made slightly jealous - by their scalps of Spain and England, but supporting them would never have crossed my mind. I just don't identify with what they represent.

Certainly, the whole eligibility saga hasn't helped matters since and, if anything, has left a sour taste in my mouth. If the IFA's 'Football for All' campaign was an attempt to convince nationalists that the IFA broadly understood them, making such a fuss over the whole eligibility thing has knocked that back a few steps. We have since seen the IFA's PR department enter what you might call panic mode, sending Worthington off to St. Columb's College in Derry - Darron Gibson's former school - under instruction to refer to his team as "the North of Ireland". I have little sympathy for the current situation within which the IFA finds itself.

Edit: I'm not really old enough to remember what it might have been like prior to our qualification for Euro '88 and whether greater FAI success had the effect of winning over nationalist opinion that had previously favoured the IFA, but I'm not aware of my father ever having had a soft spot for the IFA team. He is more of a GAA man, mind. One thing he did do, though, was pretty much play 'Joxer Goes to Stuttgart' on repeat in the car any time he was taking us young ones out for a drive.

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Originally Posted by Gather round

41% voted for a united Ireland in May this year. That's 18% behind. Not happening anytime soon.

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Not much of a swing is needed.
Are you referring to The NI assembly elections?
Nationalist 40% Unionist 45% Alliance 7.5%
Alliance are known to give preference votes to Nationalists in the elections.


I'd go for sometime around 2020 for the first referendum on Irish unity and the second or third referendum 2025 - 2030 to clinch it after earnest negotiations.

So
i) Would you like to see an All-Ireland representative football team? Yes
ii) Do you think it will happen in the next 10 years? No
iii) Should players born in the north be allowed play in the FAI team? Yes

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Originally Posted by geysir

I'd go for sometime around 2020 for the first referendum on Irish unity and the second or third referendum 2025 - 2030 to clinch it after earnest negotiations.

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From what I understand, a second referendum would have to be at least seven years later, as per the terms of the Good Friday Agreement.

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Originally Posted by Danny Invincible

I just don't identify with what they represent

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Fair enough, I'm pretty much the same from the other side.

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If the IFA's 'Football for All' campaign was an attempt to convince nationalists that the IFA broadly understood them, making such a fuss over the whole eligibility thing has knocked that back a few steps

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I think it was mainly an effort to be more welcoming generally, rather than a specific targetting of nationalist RoI fans. But you're right, whatever it was it's been set back.

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Originally Posted by Geysir

Not much of a swing is needed

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Only 9%. So unless you're imagining a massive influx of new nationalist voters, or unionists getting fed up and migrating/ abstaining/ declaring for Mad Mart and his mates, it ain't going to happen anytime soon.

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Are you referring to The NI assembly elections?

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Indeed. Very up to date, and the STV system makes 'tactical' voting a bit more sophisticated.

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Alliance are known to give preference votes to Nationalists in the elections

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Aye, they give transfers to unionists too. And of course they are much stronger in mainly unionist areas (suburban Belfast, basically) than west of the Bann. They aren't going to deliver you a united Ireland.You're still a long way behind.

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I'd go for sometime around 2020 for the first referendum on Irish unity and the second or third referendum 2025 - 2030 to clinch it after earnest negotiations

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Every election in NI is effectively a border poll; the nationalist share actually fell this year. The years you mention are just pipe-dreams, are they not?

All this is 'pie-in-the sky', if not his immense girth, as our deluded rotund friend claimed, "I no longer support the North (as we're sh*t)" on at least 5-10 occasions to watch some team :rolleyes: called Ireland in their last game in Liege....

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

All this is 'pie-in-the sky', if not his immense girth, as our deluded rotund friend claimed, "I no longer support the North (as we're sh*t)" on at least 5-10 occasions to watch some team :rolleyes: called Ireland in their last game in Liege....

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Maybe I'm missing something, but did yourself and GR attend the game together in Liege? GR did say he was attending with a regular poster here. The idea of that would amuse me very much. :)

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Originally Posted by bennocelt

Its a billion times different to those other sports in terms of types of fans and methods of support:(

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Is the reason you may this statement that politics and history have alinged themselves with Northern Irish football? If so, I agree and this remains the biggest stumbling block to any idea of an all Ireland team. Personally, there are a lot of positives in the idea, but it will never occur in my lifetime.

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Originally Posted by gastric

Is the reason you may this statement that politics and history have alinged themselves with Northern Irish football? If so, I agree and this remains the biggest stumbling block to any idea of an all Ireland team. Personally, there are a lot of positives in the idea, but it will never occur in my lifetime.

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Well I was coming at it from a class thing, but I guess its the same thing anyway.

Virtually the same conversation is going on in like 3 threads. :)
It always ends up coming down to one issue...

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Originally Posted by bennocelt

Well I was coming at it from a class thing, but I guess its the same thing anyway.

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Just on sport and being Irish, I have an interest in rugby and happily will watch Ulster anytime. The same with Rory McIllroy. I am not the slightest interested in golf, but I have found myself watching the US Open. I happily accept he is Northern Irish, and yet I feel an affinity with him as he comes from the same island as me. I don't feel any sense of politics in these sports and yet I am sure there is. In regards to the NI football team, they might as well be from outer Mongolia such is my lack of identity or feeling of affinity with them. I take more interest in the Faroes Islands due to Kerr's role there. It is pretty sad that politics, history and I hate the term, class, can create such feelings of indifference.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

Maybe I'm missing something, but did yourself and GR attend the game together in Liege? GR did say he was attending with a regular poster here. The idea of that would amuse me very much. :)

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Glad to help. The lunch date I mentioned before the game was with GSpain, but Messrs Ardee and Lopez also made a late decision to join the party. Enjoyable midweek break ;)

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Originally Posted by Gastric

It is pretty sad that politics, history and I hate the term, class, can create such feelings of indifference

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I don't see why, indifference isn't a bad thing. Even as a big sports fan you can't be interested in everything. Like you, I've no interest in golf, but found myself looking forward to the news this morning to see if McIlroy was still setting the pace. If he was just an also-ran I wouldn't have.

Of course all the matches would be played in Dublin. That's where our national team plays. Why would we play any matches in Belfast? We rarely play outside of Dublin.

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Originally Posted by Colbert Report

Of course all the matches would be played in Dublin. That's where our national team plays. Why would we play any matches in Belfast? We rarely play outside of Dublin

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Well at least you're honest, if absurdly unrealistic. It's a takeover, not a merger, eh?

But of course it doesn't matter whether you stick to Dublin, move round the country or play the odd game on an ice rink up-country of Saskatoon. We ain't interested in joining your football team.

PS you do realise that you've played two recent home games in Limerick, as well as others organised by the FAI in England?

i) Would you like to see an All-Ireland representative football team?

It already exists. :)

ii) Do you think it will happen in the next 10 years?

See previous answer.

iii) Should players born in the north be allowed play in the FAI team?

Of course.

iv) Would an All-Ireland team increase the chance of major tournament qualification?

See answer for question 1.

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Originally Posted by Gather round

We ain't interested in joining your football team.

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Erm, we know your 'view' *, so why keep repeating it??
It won't be down to any of us, but the political machinations of FIFA.

* Despite the usual numerous contradictions & hypocrisy in the incessant replies.

And to answer the original questions, here's to a resounding Yes to all four....

i) Would you like to see an All-Ireland representative football team?

There is one - anyone born on the island of Ireland can play for the FAI team, if they wish. Those players from Northern Ireland (or otherwise eligible to play for Northern Ireland) who choose not to play for the FAI teams, instead choosing to play for the IFA teams, should have their choice respected and upheld.

ii) Do you think it will happen in the next 10 years?

Not applicable.

iii) Should players born in the north be allowed play in the FAI team?

Not applicable.

iv) Would an All-Ireland team increase the chance of major tournament qualification?

Nort applicable.