Central Contracts

i think the draft is essential to my "vision" (sorry) but could easily be done in the form of the FAI academy graduates or academy affiliated players/clubs being eligible for the League draft thus allowing those "nurseries" who purely want to opt out - and selfishly protect their own interests - that opportunity. It would keep so many of the good players in the game here longer and would be immensely beneficial to league clubs if it was done properly. Again, i dont think it would ever happen. And would require a huge level of commercial commitment from the FAI and others to make the prospect of joining Mervue on draft an attractive one.

Centralised contracts dont necessarily require a draft system if you think about it though. But the effect of just centralised contracts is that the FAI administers the contracts instead of the club. Not sure if there are any other benefits...!

Just some thoughts.

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Originally Posted by peadar1987

Is there a way it could be done without a draft?

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Maybe there could be a system where clubs seek to sign a player but the FAI handles contract negotiation, signs them, then sends the player to the club.

But it would depend on what extend this 'central contracts' premise was implemented. I can't see a way in which you could have central contracts but clubs could retain any kind of autonomy in playing budgets. Essentially the FAI would be signing the players and distributing them. Without a draft, whatever distribution they make would face accusations of bias.

Also the whole thing is clearly a total brain melt...

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Originally Posted by SkStu

Centralised contracts dont necessarily require a draft system if you think about it though. But the effect of just centralised contracts is that the FAI administers the contracts instead of the club. Not sure if there are any other benefits...!

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If the FAI were administering these central contracts, how would they distribute players without a draft? If clubs came to them and said "I want to sign player x", the FAI can sign them and then give to the club...but what if five LOI clubs want to sign the same player. It'll then just come down to who can afford him. And isn't that just the same as it is now, just with a more FAI input/looking over shoulders?

yep - thats exactly the point i was trying to make!

The idea of a centre of excellence where the players are centraly conracted to the FAI but essentially "loaned" out to clubs by way of a draft system seems sensible for emerging talent;
The FAI get to control the coaching and development of the players which in turn shold have a profoundly positive impact un underage sides.
The Clubs get the benefit of a players whose talents & wages may have previously been out of reach.
The players get the best of both worlds in the sense that they get competitive football from the clubs but proper development from the FAI.

The only plus for more established players being on a central contract is that you avoid a bohs situation. You would think that the FAI would be keen to avoid that but essentially they would be the ones carrying all the risk. I can't see that ever happening unless there's a platinum one type ground zero proposal from an independent organisation.

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Originally Posted by SkStu

yep - thats exactly the point i was trying to make!

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Oh right on then...draft talk iz confuzion.

To make the system, with a draft and central contracts, would mean that a) there would be one league, b) all players are signed over to the centralised body, c) a feeder league system would have to be in effect. A draft would actually help remove the stress placed on clubs to maintain teams for licencing etc. The draft would be quite straightforward. Players have 2 years of eligibility (17 and 18 years old) for the main draft. They register and then the bottom club from the previous season gets the pick of the best player, the final pick in the first round goes to the previous seasons champions. Clubs, of course, can trade picks, though with a salary cap in place no club can go ott. So if it was Shelbourne finishing bottom of the pile (just supposing) then it means they get the first pick. If they don't want to pick him up, they can trade their first pick to the previous seasons champions, let's say Dundalk, and they pay Shels xeuros and/or a draft pick and/or a current player.

Players will go for it to a degree, though it means the removal of "bonuses". It would lift the burden off clubs and they would be free to concentrate on affordable policies and with a good regulatory system there would be fewer explosions of clubs.

Ultimately it would mean young players in Ireland have a chance to go into a draft to play for a local league club, get paid securely and their own development club gets a set fee (plus sell on). In addition there would be a supplementary draft for undrafted players or players who've come back from the UK or who didn't take part initially, so that they have a second chance.

Each club is only responsible for an under-18 and 20 side - as it stands how many clubs under-age set ups actually connect with the senior section?

Peadar, a not for profit can run it, though a commercial entity is better, mainly because they can then trade properly and carry commercial clout. I still think the FAI and clubs would hate it, they'd be so afraid of what could happen and that they'd be on a more even playing field.

Oh, one addition would be a superleague - AAA minor - could be set up just under the LOI where farm teams could play, clubs like Phoenix etc would be loaned players as well as having their usual contingent of players.

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Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton

Maybe there could be a system where clubs seek to sign a player but the FAI handles contract negotiation, signs them, then sends the player to the club.

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In addition to the problems you mention, you're assuming the FAI have and use proper financial info. It's been shown time and again just how easy it is to pull the wool over the FAI's eyes with regards to predicted crowds and income, or agreements to pay players.

Also, are central contracts used anywhere in Europe, for example? Or is it just the US, Australia and those kind of franchise leagues? If we're looking at the exception rather than the norm, there should be a good reason for diverging (and not just "The current system isn't working")

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

In addition to the problems you mention, you're assuming the FAI have and use proper financial info. It's been shown time and again just how easy it is to pull the wool over the FAI's eyes with regards to predicted crowds and income, or agreements to pay players.

Also, are central contracts used anywhere in Europe, for example? Or is it just the US, Australia and those kind of franchise leagues? If we're looking at the exception rather than the norm, there should be a good reason for diverging (and not just "The current system isn't working")

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In football now, in other sports yes. They word because the clubs want them to and they're worked in such a way to suit the more European mentality - links with local authority, member owned (partially) clubs and corporate responsibility.

What would be the reason for change? That's a better question to ask that a discussion on it.

Corporate responsibility
Financial security and responsibility
Healthier environment for investment and sponsorship
Better development ladder for young players
Security of payment for players and staff
Commitment to improvement of facilities (ok, open to question)
Focused promotion and marketing
Better/separate negotiation body for media rights
Salary Cap

There are lots more I'm sure, but as a start they are some. I would also say concentration on education of young players - via scholarships etc.

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Originally Posted by Spudulika

In football no, in other sports yes.

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What sports? The only kind of central contracting system I know of is in rugby, but it's a different idea than what''s being discussed here. Do the European basketball or handball leagues do this?

If it was ever going to work in the LOI, it would have to be done without a draft, I think. Like the thread I posted on affiliating junior clubs to the LOI, you'd need the support of the junior clubs to do it. And I can't see any junior clubs going for having their best players poached by the LOI.

Also, the best player at underage level is hardly likely to want to go to Fanad United or Carlow, especially if they're from Tralee.

I'm sure there's some way of organising it so that the clubs can sign the players they want, but without the recklessness that would come if they felt they weren't spending their own money.

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Originally Posted by peadar1987

If it was ever going to work in the LOI, it would have to be done without a draft, I think. Like the thread I posted on affiliating junior clubs to the LOI, you'd need the support of the junior clubs to do it. And I can't see any junior clubs going for having their best players poached by the LOI..

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no, i think it could easily be done with a draft as i have outlined above. The clubs or players in the clubs can choose to affiliate with the FAI and the FAI runs the academy. Each year 100 players are accepted from affiliated clubs and graduate from the academy at 17/18 and are drafted by LOI clubs. As part of this, each club can have an education deal with local 3rd level institutions to ensure that players receive an education to fall back on as well as pro or semi pro football.

Again, i know it is all idealistic but it is not beyond the realms of possibility.

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Originally Posted by peadar1987

Also, the best player at underage level is hardly likely to want to go to Fanad United or Carlow, especially if they're from Tralee..

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this, in my opinion, would be the biggest problem. Hence the need for significant commercial incentives/investment and/or attractive education schemes.

The league is too small for a draft system to work. Take an 18-year-old from Dublin who gets drafted to Finn Harps, several hours travel away from his family and friends for a wage of €150 a week. How does this make any sense for him to take the contract? It's fine for big sports where the clubs will be offering big wages where it's worth moving halfway across the country but there's not enough money in the LOI.

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Originally Posted by Schumi

The league is too small for a draft system to work. Take an 18-year-old from Dublin who gets drafted to Finn Harps, several hours travel away from his family and friends for a wage of €150 a week. How does this make any sense for him to take the contract? It's fine for big sports where the clubs will be offering big wages where it's worth moving halfway across the country but there's not enough money in the LOI.

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Whinging little bugger should be proud to get the opportunity.

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Originally Posted by Mr A

Whinging little bugger should be proud to get the opportunity.

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Yeah, but imagine an 18-year-old from Donegal town who gets drafted to Waterford, several hours travel away from his family and friends for a wage of €150 a week. How does this make any sense for him to take the contract? Terrible, right?

Of course. Screwing over people to benefit the Harps is fine and morally justifiable, but otherwise it shouldn't happen and is a bloody outrage.

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Originally Posted by Mr A

Whinging little bugger should be proud to get the opportunity.

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Sorry Harps was a bad example, anyone'd be happy to play for them for free. I should have said Derry.

Simple option is to make the league Dublin only.

Below that we can have an A pyrimid for the country teams, with the winner fo the Pyrimid playing off in the Aviva with the last team in the in the League to see who gets to play in the Dublin Super League. 18 year players from outside Dublin can all live in the one big dorm room. RTE can do a fly on the wall reality show called, "young, dumb and full of fancy footballing tricks"

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Originally Posted by Dodge

Simple option is to make the league Dublin only.

Below that we can have an A pyrimid for the country teams, with the winner fo the Pyrimid playing off in the Aviva with the last team in the in the League to see who gets to play in the Dublin Super League. 18 year players from outside Dublin can all live in the one big dorm room. RTE can do a fly on the wall reality show called, "young, dumb and full of fancy footballing tricks"

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Not a bad idea. Might even work if UCD can sign Justin Bieber.

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Originally Posted by John83

Not a bad idea. Might even work if UCD can sign Justin Bieber.

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Doubt he's much of a footballer. I heard he had syphilis as well.