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Empty rhetoric then? I know it's an aspiration of the party but it gets a bit tiresome given it's so oft-repeated yet lacks any substance whatsoever. It only winds up NI fans too. Not sure why the operation of other sports on the island should be relevant to how football operates either. The FAI are their own independent organisation and I'm content to support them on a 'de facto' all-island basis.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
I hear you, but think about it. They're hardly going to say different.
Though other sports are very relevant, as it shows it is possible. Given the many faults of the IFA & FAI they're hardly beyond reproach either.
It's their rank hypocrisy that grates.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
Fierce promotors of choice in the eligibility dispute, creating a de facto all Ireland team.
But wish to deny choice to those players and supporters who do not want to play for, or support, the south's team - and who consider the trapping of the 26 County State to be alien to them.
It's only possible in other sports because their rules permit it though.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
Have both associations even been consulted? Another consideration that would have to be taken into account is, which team would this new single one succeed? It's a thorny one. I'm guessing you're assuming any new team would succeed the current Ireland team, thus rendering NI formally defunct and their records a matter of history just like those of East Germany, Saarland, North Vietnam and South Yemen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
I know that PSF have had meetings with the IFA - I'm sure the IFA are well aware of PSF's thoughts about a singular team.
It's a totally pointless viewpoint - there is a team for Nationalists/Republicans throughout
the island to support. They should show some respect to those who choose to have nothing to do with it.
In common with many Northern Ireland supporters, if there is no Northern Ireland International team to support, then there is no International team for us to support.
If we weren't around, I'd perhaps welcome an all UK team at that point - I would feel some sort of affinity to it.
To my mind, Kearns effectively put the singular Ireland team thing to bed - if there was ever political unity, then there might be a singular team...but not before.
At that point, I would think that a number of players from a Unionist background would make it known to FIFA that they wanted to be eligible for/represent one of British Associations, based on their British Citizenship (guaranteed, whatever the constitutional position is in future, by the GFA) - that would require an amendment to Statutes, obviously.
(Hypothetically)That would be an interesting one, most logical viewpoint would be for them to have a choice of British Associations, like Maik Taylor had at the time. (chances are, that far in the future, Scotland would be independent). Of course they'd still have the choice to represent ROI/Ireland, whatever it's called at that point. I imagine some players from a Unionist background would opt to play for Ireland, possibly for a career choice, i.e not good enough for the England team, but couldn't see Wales making an international tournament. All hypothetical and unlikely to happen anytime soon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Hehe, any idea how they go?Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Do SF really believe it's a starter or have the IFA never told them that even if the association wished for it, FIFA might have something to say about it.Quote:
I'm sure the IFA are well aware of PSF's thoughts about a singular team.
Agree with your other points. Not only is it ignorant, but it's needlessly provocative.
Just as a matter of interest, are you aware of many, or any, NI fans from a Donegal/Laggan district Ulster-Scots, Protestant or traditional-unionist background? I recall a Donegal Protestant on the local Highland Radio once dismissing quite heatedly the notion of him ever applying for an Irish passport as he didn't identify as Irish, or, at least, didn't identify with the sense of Irishness channelled through the Irish state. He was quite evidently more than happy to live without one as it didn't appear he qualified to possess any other. I'm also aware of at least one DUP politician, Maurice Devenney, who was born and raised in Manorcunningham in Donegal. Perhaps there are other unionist politicians in NI with Donegal roots, but I'd imagine he'd feel similarly to the aforementioned man on the radio with regard to his identity, identifying culturally with Britishness/the British sense of Irishness and NI rather than with the Irish state and its sense of national identity. I went to primary school with some Protestants from around the St. Johnston/Carrigans area of Donegal who would have supported Rangers, NI and even England, if I remember correctly, despite having been born and bred south of the border. Then there's 'fhtb' ('Finn Harps True Blue'?), one of the mods on OWC, who's a pretty avid NI fan despite, I assume, his Donegal roots.Quote:
At that point, I would think that a number of players from a Unionist background would make it known to FIFA that they wanted to be eligible for/represent one of British Associations, based on their British Citizenship (guaranteed, whatever the constitutional position is in future, by the GFA) - that would require an amendment to Statutes, obviously.
Not saying there's anything at all wrong with any of this; I just find it quite interesting from a purely cultural or sociological perspective. They're kind of like a mirror image of the nationalist community in NI, similar in the sense of having been "caught on the wrong side of the border", if you will, except on the opposite side.
Anyway, say, it happened that a Donegal-born footballer from this community (with Donegal-born parents/grandparents who had never lived in NI) or even someone you might know from this community was talented enough to play international football for the FAI, is it likely they'd reject any potential call-up? I imagine 'fhtb' would, for one; he's always come across as hostile in the extreme towards the FAI. And as a unionist yourself, have you any thoughts on this community's identity and their ineligibility to represent the IFA despite their identification with NI? Do you think means should be provided by which they could represent the team they support?
'Mon Danny, you know that's not a reason...Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
:rolleyes:
Not sure what exactly the meetings have been about, but I think they have been cordial.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
The Minister for Sport in Northern Ireland is, of course, is a member of PSF.
In recent months, we've had PSF members in the Directors Box at Windsor Park on at least 3 occasions, I think.
The Sports Minister at a Northern Ireland game.
The Deputy First Minister at the Linfield v Derry City game.
The Lord Mayor of Belfast at the recent Linfield v Crusaders Irish Cup Final.
I'm fully aware of the small Unionist community from Donegal - I believe there are a few of them who come to Northern Ireland matches regularly, including FHTB. They even have a Donegal NISC banner which is regularly on display at our matches.
Basil McCrea, who in recent times stood for leadership of the Ulster Unionist Party, is a Donegal man.
There was a small Unionist political party in Donegal up to the late 90's - the Donegal Progressive Party.
Given a choice, I would guess that the Unionists of Donegal would rather play for the IFA than the FAI - but, as you know, they couldn't even if they wanted to as they mostly don't have British Citizenship. I don't see anyway around that - even if they were to acquire British Citizenship, the extra criteria would kick in for eligibility which would preclude them.
Regarding support for England, they are the first choice for many "Loyalists" in Northern Ireland. Seeing England kits in Loyalist areas is not uncommon.
'PSF'??
Or is this going to produce even more witless innuendo about pennies dropping and the like...
Interesting. I hadn't been aware of such an outfit. Did they seek for Donegal/Ireland to rejoin the UK or just look out for Protestant interests in Donegal?Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
I remember Holland were another favoured team. Maybe something to do with the King Billy link.
Progress on "Provos", I suppose...Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
Willie Hay is 100% Dun Na nGall. Mary Hamilton born and raised at least partly there. Quite a number of the Derry Unionist Bloc have Donegal roots AFAIK.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
They opposed a United Ireland.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
The DUP guy, Devenney, you mentioned was a member.
The Donegal Unionists felt a great sense of betrayal when they were left behind with partition.
18,000 Donegal men had signed the Ulster Covenant.
Just came across this in relation to Hay's problems in obtaining British citizenship: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/ne...-16020943.htmlQuote:
Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton
Hmm, they weren't the only ones...Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
One team for each community? Very simplistic and convenient. I will continue to argue that the IFA needs to to become more representative of both communities, for two reasons, as it should be representative of all who live there, and if it is to have any future success. In saying this, in no way am I suggesting that I believe a United Ireland will solves the problems that exist. I also support individual choice as CAS allows.Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Simply for the intended benefit of unionists in NI?Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Are you going to offer any suggestions whatsoever as to how you think they might go about that?Quote:
Originally Posted by gastric
Do you think that big numbers of nationalists/republicans might be persuaded to support Northern Ireland over the South?
I don't know the substance of their policies.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
I think you might be just a bit late on this one...Quote:
Originally Posted by gastric
:rolleyes:
Not if certain people on the other side can't even get the name of the country right...Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Clearly some have a very odd perception of geography.
And after BS complimenting you and all.