If the club goes bust, the honchos lose any hold on the lease.
That can't be the plan surely?
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If the club goes bust, the honchos lose any hold on the lease.
That can't be the plan surely?
Its an interesting and perhaps unique conundrum as if the away team dont take to the pitch the picket is essentially null and void but do you then cross the picket and hope bray cant muster 11 together in order to make the picket valid. Im sure the PFAI will give the cork players all the information regarding what crossing or not crossing it would mean to help them make a decision.Quote:
Originally Posted by marinobohs
That'll teach them not to mess around
No Irn Bru and no Ronaldo
So Limerick are in the Irn-Bru Cup - until they too have sanctions against them, I guess.
I think that's reasonable from the FAI. What else could they do? There's no money for a fine, a points deduction is irrelevant, as is automatic relegation. The FAI's hands are tied to an extend by how ****ed up the league is.
Leaves scope for additional sanctions as and when required.
The owners don't care about any sporting sanctions, and the FAI can't impose any non-sporting ones. I suppose the only benefit is that it serves as an example to those owners who might actually care about their clubs as opposed to the land the stadium is built on.
It is difficult to know how to punish the club. You could kick them out of the FAI cup but then there’s a chance they could get a bit of gate money and it could help the players and staff. Maybe the FAI can withhold any gate receipts they do get to ensure it goes to those that need it.
"Bray has been removed also from participating in the 2018-19 IRN-BRU Scottish Challenge Cup."
https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2018...-unpaid-wages/
That'll teach them. Fücking jokeshop.
The irony, of course, is that if the FAI invested in the league (as they need to), and gave proper prize money, then it'd be very easy to penalise the club.
€100k prize money for finishing last? Your fine is €25k. A sizeable slap on the wrist, but the club still has some cash coming in.
But the FAI give the clubs nothing, so they've nothing to take away.
How do teams get selected for entry to that competition?Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
If you got nutin you got nutin to lose as someone once said
Top two sides in the previous league season who didn't get into Europe and who have managed to pay their players since.Quote:
Originally Posted by osarusan
Europe!! :cool:
Slightly off topic, but I see there's two English Conference teams being invited to the Irn Bru Cup this year.
Starting to be a very interesting competition.
I wonder would they join the Airtricity League instead?Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
sure rangers and celtic are mad on for leaving the SPL. Weve got options.....oh weve got optionsQuote:
Originally Posted by Ezeikial
My personal view would be for Bray to remain in the league and see out the season with youth players or whatever it takes, then they should be removed from LOI for at least 5 years until they have their house in order and new owners / admin group who have an interest in football can be trusted to start again from the FD.
If this was any other league, they would probably be expelled immediately and all points expunged, this would increase Dundalk's lead over Cork from 4 to 6 points, but as I indicated at the start, this is not something I would like to see happen.
If that ever came to play, the FAI should pick up the tab and pay their wages from the period it was unpaid from, I don't put up with this argument thats it all the FAI's fault, clubs also have a role to play, but the FAI are behind the licensing committee, so they should take the hit in this case.
The statement the FAI released though would imply they are happy to let this situation limp along for weeks.
I think it indicates that they have no choice but to let it limp along.Quote:
Originally Posted by oriel
I don't know what the protocol is on points being expunged etc, but that would be no way for a league to be won or lost. I would expect that any outcome that gives extra points that should be resisted by the club, and I would expect that supporters should encourage and support this attitude if it came to it - although that might be naive on my part!Quote:
Originally Posted by oriel
Remaining games will probably be given as walkovers rather then all results expunged.
If Bray are removed from the division, the fairest thing is to wipe the results. The puts all teams on a even position vis a vis a side that had to withdraw.
On one hand the sanctions seem laughable, on the other I'm not sure what else the FAI could do that's meaningful within current rules. A points deduction is like stealing a bald man's comb, but why not allow them to sign players on amateur terms to replace free agent pros and see out the season? And is there any reason why revenue from the Irn Bru couldn't be ringfenced for players' wages? It seems daft to remove any revenue stream from a club that needs, well, revenue.
If there's anything in this it's that it shows - yet again - that we're long past time there needs to be an overhaul of the rules so that bad directors face personal consequences.
- Automatic reporting of suspected infringements to the Director of Corporate Enforcement, Gardaí, Revenue etc where relevant.
- Minimum length bans from any football-related activity for directors who bring clubs to these situations.
- Application for personal judgements for any financial liabilities.
- Hefty fines for directors rather than clubs for maladministration.
- Appointment of independent directors on crisis boards for a minimum period, with all subsequent directors having to pass a meaninful fit and proper test.
I've said much of this here before, but if the prospect of losing your business and family home was a consequence of deliberate or negligent mismanagement, it would make some of the chancers who flit around the league think twice before swaggering in like a bloody bunch of pirates.
So sorry to see any club suffer like this, feel bad for the genuine fans of any club in trouble.
Could the FAI not immediately revoke the current license of Bray and appoint an interim board which would see the season out?
It could galvanise what is left of the club's support and maybe encourage back those volunteers the club dispensed with in recent years. Those that have the club at heart.
As eminence said there needs to be consequences for maladministration by directors but then again with what passes for corporate governance in this country I won't hold my breath.
What support?? Part of the reason they are in this is precisely that they have no support. Couple of hundred people at games. Wont be any real loss to the league next year.
Who would that be? LoI directors don't exactly grow on trees.Quote:
Originally Posted by Comic Book Guy
And how would that help the players get paid?
Well, maybe the problem is some LoI directors in the first case. There are lots of good people, no doubt, but there also well-intentioned but ineffectual volunteers and wilful saboteurs. There are plenty of directors nationwide who could bring a lot of experience and a fresh perspective to the league. They don't have to be former club directors. The Institute of Directors has up on 3,000 members. Every LEO, third-level campus incubator, management consultancy, accounting, legal, PR and marketing firm, etc has experienced people. You need finance, governance, local community, football and a chairperson: accountant, lawyer, club member/fans group, former player/football administrator, AN Other. To be honest, in a crisis, finance, governance and a chair would do. And maybe a board charged with operating in the clubs' interest might actually run it properly, without siphoning off income or making a land grab? You know, put players and creditors first, a bit like a receivership attempts to trade out of crisis, or prepare for sale as a going concern.
Very hard to get people to volunteer for a role as a director in a company with limited or no resources.
Any club that defaults on wages should have to deposit a minimum of 4 months wages with the FAI before being allowed to enter the league the next season.
That isn't impossible as theoretically if a club went fully amateur there would be no wages so the emphasis would be on the club to find the money up front or accept they need to lower the budget to whatever they can raise.
If they default again the FAI can step in but if that has to happen then its points deduction and exclusion from the league for a minimum of 3 years, plus the directors cant be involved for a minimum of 5 years again.
I know its not perfect but something has to change.
The FAI will probably now come out with some even more stringent criteria for next year as they wont want to risk this happening again.
It mightn't help straight away but an interim group coupled with the realisation that the existing board have been removed might mean a bounce in the gates. See the season out and then encourage a supporters run group to take over the club.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
The LOI is the last place to look for new directors.
I think the precedent (Monaghan) saw all results expunged but who knows ?Quote:
Originally Posted by sbgawa
Difficult to see how the FAI could do much more than the (non)sanctions imposed but perhaps a lowering of the admin/registration charge with monies put aside to form a fund for future cases should be considered (somewhat like the uninsured drivers fund) ? this might encourage other clubs to be less understanding of this messing and would at least provide some income continuance for players in the future. Obviously clubs acting the maggot would increase future premiums so it might 'encourage' clubs to police a bit better. somebody has to take control and Fran ain't the man !
Dundalk have dropped 2 points to Bray but Cork have dropped none.
Dundalk would go six points clear with 1 less game to play in the season....game set and match if it isn't already.
BTW I agree with you RE walkovers for remaining games but I think results were expunged in case of Monaghan. not sure if there is a definite rule on it.Quote:
Originally Posted by sbgawa
100% agree. So many people that I've suggested similar to have always found reasons why this shouldn't be done but something has to change.Quote:
Originally Posted by sbgawa
A bounce in gate receipts would be just a drop in the ocean.Quote:
Originally Posted by Comic Book Guy
Let's say it costs 250k/annum to run a fully amateur LoI club. Let's then say same again for wages - 500k. That's 40k+ a month before you start looking at paying off any old debts.
An extra 200 people a game twice a month is 4k. On top of what - 10k/month they're currently taking in? It's nothing.
Didn't Bray do this though? Don't know if it was four months' worth, but a figure of 100k is mentioned here.Quote:
Originally Posted by sbgawa
Don't mean to come across as excusing Bray or the FAI here, but the realities are that our league is such a basket case that it's actually hard to punish anyone. Especially when we need every club we can get just to make up the numbers.
Russell steps down as manager at Bray.
https://braywanderersfc.ie/martin-ru...wn-as-manager/
"The website is temporarily unable to service your request as it exceeded resource limit. Please try again later."
What's that mean?
Martin Russell – Statement
Due to the constraints and unrealistic circumstances that have unfolded in recent times at Bray Wanderers FC, it is with deep regret that I have made the decision to resign as manager.
I would like to thank all the staff, supporters and players for their efforts whilst at the club. It has been a trying time for everyone concerned and highlights once again the lack of a proper football industry that we can all aspire to.
I would like to express my heartfelt gratitude to Gerry Mulvey, the club’s chairman who, like myself, staff, players and supporters, is as much a victim of the sorry state of affairs that we find ourselves in.
Gerry has always been honest with me, but unfortunately promises made to him have constantly been reneged on and, despite his tireless efforts, he has been unable to find enough support throughout the business world and the FAI in order to bring matters to a viable resolution.
I believe Gerry has always wanted something beneficial for football to come out of his involvement with Bray Wanderers FC and its participation in the Airtricity League.
With a variety of agendas and uncooperative and restrictive measures taken, the role of managing and concentrating on winning football matches has left me at this point.
I really hope that the great game we all love and follow does manage to find a better way but, at this moment in time, it’s impossible for me to be a manager in the current environment.
Martin Russell
I'd say the website gets more traffic than Bray paid for.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
Didn't realise that was even a thing.
Why are the current owners even sticking around ? Are they still living in the cloud cuckoo land that the council will put them in charge of developing the Carlisle grounds ? I wonder at this stage do they just want to bust the club as that plan hasn't worked out .
Did Mulvey hold a gun to Russell's head when he wrote that statement?Quote:
Originally Posted by ToberonaTornado