Really? I read that he could be available for the Germany game.
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Really? I read that he could be available for the Germany game.
It's unlikely he will be cleared that quickly. It took Shane Duffy six months to get clearance, McClean something similar.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
Well I think that's something we can all agree on.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
Balls.ie stated that "a fast track passport would mean that Noble could be ready to make his debut against World Champions Germany": http://balls.ie/football/west-ham-pl...-ireland-call/Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
From where they got their info, I'm not sure, as the Daily Mail piece mentioned nothing about a "fast-track passport". Balls.ie also don't appear to have considered the administrative side of things, as in FIFA approving any request to switch. The length of time that process takes can very, but it can take a few weeks at the very least, as far as I know.
Edit: Or months, in some cases, as Charlie points out. I'm not really sure if there's any strict time-frame, although, if memory serves me correctly, there was at least suspicion that Shane Duffy's switch was delayed as the Kearns case was ongoing at the time - FIFA may not have been processing IFA-FAI switches for a spell - even though Duffy's father is from Donegal anyway. I'm sure there are further details on this way back in the eligibility thread somewhere, but I'd need to get that confirmed.
I remember there being talk when McClean was switching that the process also required IFA action (in terms of handing over documents to FIFA or something) so they might have been lumbering on the matter, but I don't know how true that was. I don't imagine an association would be allowed to hold up a player who wishes to effect his right to switch association once.
The word on the street: http://balls.ie/football/audio-think...ireland-setup/
Is that first guy English or Irish?
Of course, prior to 2004 (or 2009 for over-21s), it wasn't possible for capped youth (and friendly?) internationals to switch association at all, so we never had to consider the prospect of, say, former England youth internationals who had tied their colours to a mast, so to speak, switching to us. You could never cynically say of those players like Townsend declaring for us, "Well, look, he played for England under-age and now he's switching to us late on because his senior England plans never materialised, so we're clearly a back-up plan." Media coverage was also less saturated and all-encompassing then. There was no social media. There were no internet forums with every little detail and utterance by individuals concerned recorded, analysed, archived and easily accessed. Supporters might not have been all that aware of who was actually eligible until the players concerned had decided to get their citizenship documents in order or were first called into a squad, so there probably wasn't all this "will he or won't he?" speculation (for months or years) surrounding or in the lead-up to declarations. Would there even have been a true gut test under those limited circumstances? I can't say with certainty that this was the case but I just sense things would have been a little different then due to the limited spread of information. Maybe some of the older posters could clarify what the situation was like. We just have a lot more information available now by which we can critically judge players and their perceived motives.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
McCarthy's grandad story was slightly embellished by the media. His Donegal grandfather had always said he would have loved it if James went on to play for Ireland and he was indeed a big influence on James, but there was no promise made to him on his death-bed: http://greenscene.me/2011/01/trapatt...thy-in-quotes/Quote:
Originally Posted by cfdh_edmundo
Quote:
Originally Posted by James McCarthy in 2007
In relation to Noble, it's hard to see how he might have made the decision to play for England throughout youth level "under duress". He's always been very open about his ambition to play for England at senior level. I'm not so sure he has ever felt particularly Irish. Did he, in fact, deny that he felt Irish at one point? That's not necessarily to say that he isn't Irish. He fulfills the legal criteria, after all.Quote:
Originally Posted by James McCarthy in 2008
Edit: Or am I confusing Noble with Kevin Nolan as regards not feeling particularly Irish?
I think we should be tolerant of all creeds, colours and orientations. Now if he was to shift them all, I'd be asking questions.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeLorean
Source is reddit, so take it with a pinch of salt:
Quote:
Cork Citycolmshan1990 3 points 31 minutes ago No thank you.
I attended an U21 European Championship qualifier between Ireland and England at Turner's Cross in 2007, Noble captained England to a 3-0 win, scoring twice (and that was quite a good England side, other players included Milner, Hart and Walcott).
Both times after scoring he ran to the Irish fans (the first goal to the section where I was sat, in the family section) and screamed abuse along the lines "Take that, you fenian *******s."
Not the most offensive thing I've ever ever heard, but clearly not a player who wants to give his all for the green shirt or the Irish fans.
I remember that game. Randolph had a shocker. Garvan and Meyler were really good and we were unlucky to lose, let alone 3-0. I think Stokes was there too. I absolutely doubt the authenticity of that comment.
Crosby called. He wants to know what's so offensive about "you fenian chappers" anyway.
Why would anyone lie about something like that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
You're right, nobody says anything silly or untrue on the internet. Silly me.
Seriously, I think the comment sounds far fetched. Why would Noble even consider calling someone a Fenian so and so? If true it'd make him out as someone with a deep rooted dislike of the Irish, Not someone who'd play football for us even as a last resort. Instead, it sounds like some Provo nutter has been let loose on the internet.
Do you think it sounds credible?
I still remember how worried i was that bernie would chose Scotland. Please god dont let noble bring jamie O hara or kevin Nolan on boardQuote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
Too late for those two clowns...
And with Stutts on this one, am seeing some Hammers at a do tomorrow, will ask them if they think it's likely...
Nolan isn't eligible - he looked into it but it turned out he was a generation out - and, as it happens, O'Hara was released by Wolves today so is a free agent. His career steadily declined and I can't believe he's 27 now. Injuries didn't help. I wonder does he regret not having declared for us years ago when he was receiving rave reviews.Quote:
Originally Posted by liamoo11
If he's lying, it's some Walter Mitty stuff. The poster didn't even sound like he had a vendetta against English born players/Mark Noble. He just relayed an anecdote and said he would rather not have him on board. He even said it wasn't the most offensive thing he's ever heard.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Nobody knows if it's true. I wouldn't be surprised if it is. It is a lot more culturally acceptable in England to make derogatory remarks about the Irish and excuse it as sledging or banter than it would be any other nationality/skin color.
I have seen some shocking stuff said about James McClean, John O'Shea and Seamus Coleman on English football forums that no-one bats an eyelid too.
For some reason, I can't envision Carlos Cuellar being called a dago or Emmanuele Giaccherini being called a wop but call the Irish whatever you like and it will just be excused as banter.
I do find it especially interesting how you allocate the benefit of the doubt in certain situations.
I didn't say I think it happened. I said I wouldn't be surprised if it did. I don't understand what would motivate someone to post something like that if there wasn't an element of truth in it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
More than one person is bound to have heard it if it did happen. Someone should post something about it on a Cork City forum.
http://anditscomethroughhere.blogspo...ur-granny.html
Here are my two cents, in blog form. As always, any feedback, comments or critique would be welcomed.
Excused by whom? Other mindless racist minority idiots on the internet?Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
What have you seen and where?
second-last paragraph rings true. A bit harsh on Meyler.Quote:
Originally Posted by Supreme feet
As for the doldrums, I think we can turn a corner pretty quickly if things fall the right way, and without Mark Noble. The darkest hour is before the dawn.
Compete in midfield, avoid careless giveaways at the back, take chances. It's not that big an ask.
I'd be surprised if it did happen. It's only the type of thing a chippy loyalist nut job would have said. I don't know much about Noble but I haven't heard anything about him that suggests he's a politically aware anti-nationalist. I also suspect that if true this would have come to light before now. It may have preceded the twitter era but other forms of social media existed back then.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
I'd prefer we didn't pursue him but I still instinctively think that story lacks credibility. I've seen the poisonous squaddy claptrap aimed at McClean on Twitter, but again, I'd be surprised if that was Noble's mindset. I can't imagine the Troubles or anything related ever bothered him much either way. It's not like he was Ian Durrant.
Thanks for the feedback Stutts. I hope your optimism is founded, and I hope Meyler proves me wrong. He has impressed me at times - especially in the Italy game - but I've seen him play very poorly too, and I wouldn't say he's a natural ball-player like Hendrick is. I see him as being a slightly more abrasive version of Keith Andrews.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
I think it's harsh to describe Meyler as a kicker. He looks content to just be involved rather than to make things happen. You can argue that after his injuries he's still feeling his way into things but at some point very soon I want to see more from him. I can level the same criticism at McCarthy and Gibson. At the early stage of their careers they felt it was best not to look bad rather than to look particularly good, even though both had the talent to do more. O'Neill said as much about McCarthy last week.
I don't know whether Meyler has it. He's what I call an "adhesive" rather than an "accretive" player. I think Hendrick has more to offer and has more latent capacity, if you know what I mean.
I think Meyler is a more cultured player than he gets credit for, and his athleticism means he's the type of player who can make things happen when the pace is slow, as it frequently is with Ireland. I noticed Fletcher displaying much the same quality for United last week - by no means the player you'd base a team around, but a guy who will pick up the slack where other people aren't pulling their weight.
Linked it on Facebook for you so should get a few more hits.Quote:
Originally Posted by Supreme feet
As for Meyler, more bad than good, my Mackem pals weren't overly impressed. Noble a marginal improvement IMO.
I'd say we haven't had an 'accretive' central midfielder since Steven Reid - someone who demands the ball and positively directs the play, taking command of the midfield area. Andy Reid showed that same ability against Germany in 2007, I'd love to see him start against Georgia alongside McCarthy in the deep-lying midfield role - he's looking remarkably fit these days.
It is time for the lads - McCarthy, Gibson and Meyler - to really kick on. If we start with one up front, Hoolahan in the hole, and full-backs given licence to get forward, they have no excuse to play within themselves.
If, in the case of his eventual availability, Noble doesn't take responsibility straight away and boss the midfield, he should be immediately hooked and forever discarded!
And thanks AB. Much appreciated.
The Cork story is a blatant obvious crock of dung, that's why it's funny, that sort of thing passes for humour in Cork, at least it raised a smile on me.
I've never seen Noble play in a game, therefore I haven't got a clue about his style or ability or have a notion about his attitude to Ireland.
When a mature Paul Green came in for those friendlies, I was immediately very impressed with his attitude and character. He (questions of football ability aside) was a credit to the team.Whether he had a 5% or 25% or 30% or 50% bloodline to his irishness was irrelevant.. I'll keep an open mind on Noble, we should trust the manager in these matters until we see/hear the player for ourselves.
TOWK, I really don't understand your opinions, So far on here, you have claimed Noble and West Ham are crap, that Stephen Quinn is as good as Noble, while you are not happy with Duffy's supposed move to Blackburn. You seem to put many Irish [players on pedestals, and anyone who doesn't meet your limited and myopic view of nationality is to be dismissed. The facts are Noble is an experienced, quality player who was the club's best player last season. Quinn is a good player, but really has not shown enough consistency over the years to be deemed comparable to Noble. Hopefully, he can continue to improve and in time take Noble's place in an Irish squad. On Duffy why are you underwhelmed? He has had limited experience, is potentially a great player, but is not as good as Stone at the moment who has a lot more experience than Duffy. These are realities and running down Noble while talking up both Quinn and Duffy lacks objectivity and is incorrect. While I do feel a bit uneasy about the likes of Noble declaring, if it means we qualify for a Euro or WC, I really can overcome these feelings quite easily! I will repeat what I said earlier in the thread, how many of you watched Algeria and scoffed at all their French born players? As an Irish fan I love watching underdogs play well and hopefully we can soon emulate their success.
To be fair, I think a fully fit Quinn is better than Noble.
Penn State is the underdog in Dubs Gastric. You can root for them.
A very well -written and objective article which I think would reflect the views of the majority of posters on here. However, I think McGoldrick would be an asset now. I really believe he can compliment Long well in attack as he is quick, hardworking and determined, the type of player I love to watch!Quote:
Originally Posted by Supreme feet
Good stuff, although I'll nit-pick if you insist. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Supreme feet
Not a major issue really, but didn't Trap name extended provisional squads too before whittling them down?Quote:
Such an inclusive strategy should ensure that every player is aware that they are in the manager's thoughts. There will be no crude alienation of talent - a welcome contrast from the previous regime.
I sense there to be an insinuation there with which I don't quite agree. McCarthy and McGeady have always identified very strongly with a sense of Irishness. Growing up, their families were steeped in Irish culture. Whilst McCarthy did say he might have represented Scotland had they been quicker to him, that's not to say we were a back-up plan because no offer was forthcoming. We were at least an equal option, if not a preferred one, rather than a possible secondary one, as might be the case with England-born players with Irish grandparent(s). Likewise, there's no reason to assume McGeady would have preferred to have played for Scotland either. I recall seeing home video footage of him kicking a ball around as a wee bairn in an Ireland jersey and if he'd have preferred to have played for Scotland he could always have chosen to switch. They'd have been delighted to have him. Scotland would also have been delighted to have McCarthy had he been willing to switch.Quote:
Even in the modern day, it is naive to think that the likes of McCarthy, McGeady, Pilkington and Westwood would have declared for Ireland had they been approached first by their native associations.
You can say that again!Quote:
However, I think we all want to see this new Irish team, under O'Neill, not just getting results, but playing with a character that Irish fans and public can get behind and identify with - a team of players who truly value playing football for their country. We want to see a team that plays with the kind of intensity, pace and aggression that we saw from O'Neill's Celtic team in the big European nights.
Thanks.Quote:
However, I think we all want to see this new Irish team, under O'Neill, not just getting results, but playing with a character that Irish fans and public can get behind and identify with - a team of players who truly value playing football for their country. We want to see a team that plays with the kind of intensity, pace and aggression that we saw from O'Neill's Celtic team in the big European nights.
Niall or Micky?Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
;)
Agreed, or at least not worth discarding for the sake of an opportunistic latecomer. Quinn has been a bright spot for Irish fans so far this season. One of quite a few I think. I've been pretty happy with how our key players have begun the season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
I didn't say West Ham were "crap". You are deliberately twisting my words. I said they are one of the worst footballing sides in the Premier League.Quote:
Originally Posted by gastric
Stephen Quinn is a better player than Mark Noble. Perhaps you should have more faith in our own players rather than expecting mediocre English players to change our fortunes?
I didn't say anything about Shane Duffy's move to Blackburn?! I think you have me confused with someone else.
Mark Noble doesn't feel Irish and doesn't want to play for Ireland and if he does declare it is for all the wrong reasons. No need to overanalyse it.
You honestly think Mark Noble will make a difference to us qualifying that McCarthy/Gibson/Hendrick/Quinn/Hoolahan/Reid won't? I heard the same things about Paul Green.
Since when do you have to be a Unionist Skrewdriver fan with steel capped boots to call someone a "fenian c*nt" in a moment of passion? I have been called similar things in the heat of the moment and the people calling me that were politically ambivalent.
Edit: Not even saying I think Noble said what he's alleged to have said. Just saying I wouldn't be that surprised.
I'm sure if someone said he seen Frank Lampard and Eidur Gudjohnsen mocking American tourists after 9/11, people would belittle him too.
Scored today. Playing well by all accounts.