UEFA Coefficient

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03/08/2009, 8:26 AM
Steve Bruce

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

I've treated myself by re-reading what you wrote both now and before. And I'm still none the clearer.

My out-take of what you've said is 'stop with the superiority over the IL people, as 20 years ago they were better than us'.

If that is a broadly correct summary of your point, then my response is 'so what' ? Huddersfield Town used to be one of the most successful clubs in England, but that doesn't stop Man United and a host of other clubs having bragging rights over them in this day and age.

We don't live in the past.

:ball:

Probably just as well, because Derry Citys history in the IL was very poor;):cool:
03/08/2009, 8:33 AM
Mr_Parker

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

The IFA president Kennedy has publicised his desire for summer football in the IL, which will leave our players fitter and sharper for Europe.

:D You really think that just because that numpty thinks summer football would be good for us and it is his desire that it will happen? How many IL clubs have come out supporting his stance since he made those comments. The guy is lucky to know what day of the week it is!!
03/08/2009, 9:08 AM
ifk101

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

LOI isn't very healthy at the moment financially. Who's to say what will happen inside the next 5 years?

Cork, Bohemians, Derry City, St Pats etc could all be forced to turn part-time (or worse, cease to exist)

The IFA president Kennedy has publicised his desire for summer football in the IL, which will leave our players fitter and sharper for Europe. Sponsorship, whilst still considerably less than the LOI IS increasing. Crowds at some clubs are going up steadily e.g. Coleraine and with recession a lot of players from England and Scotland are coming home again because clubs cannot afford to keep them on, so the level is gradually getting better.

Linfield have shown in the Setanta cup that we are not that far behind the top teams in the LOI (and we play makeshift teams as the Setanta cup is low down in our priorities), Glentoran have shown they are capable as well last year by getting to the final.

So yes I do believe what comes around goes around and the LOI and ILs gap will close in the future whether that's down to the LOI imploding or the IL getting better, or maybe a bit of both.

Time will tell.

Luxembourg, Andorra, Malta and San Marino are the only European countries with national leagues ranked lower than the Irish League. All four of these leagues picked up more ranking points than the IL this season and are likely to be ranked higher than the IL in the not to distant future. That is to say, it is highly probable that the IL will be ranked 53rd out of the 53 national European leagues in the next 3-5 years, if not sooner.
03/08/2009, 10:44 AM
Dodge

Quote:

Originally Posted by JC_GUFC

Odense hammered Pat's a few years back and the Danish League is the best Scandinavian league at the moment so Linfield were unlikely to get anything.

We also got a vital half point for the co-eff with a home draw ;)
03/08/2009, 10:47 AM
Steve Bruce

Quote:

Originally Posted by ifk101

Luxembourg, Andorra, Malta and San Marino are the only European countries with national leagues ranked lower than the Irish League. All four of these leagues picked up more ranking points than the IL this season and are likely to be ranked higher than the IL in the not to distant future. That is to say, it is highly probable that the IL will be ranked 53rd out of the 53 national European leagues in the next 3-5 years, if not sooner.

As I said time will tell. Just like there's a decent chance that LOI as we know it will be completely different in the next 3-5 years.

I'm not overly concerned to be honest about European results. Our League perform badly, but I know the league as a whole will still be in existance in for the foreseable future. Whilst there are clubs who aren't exactly flush, none of them are close to extinction either.
03/08/2009, 11:20 AM
ifk101

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

As I said time will tell.

Foot.ie's clairvoyant reveals all. ;)
03/08/2009, 11:54 AM
A N Mouse

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

As I said time will tell. Just like there's a decent chance that LOI as we know it will be completely different in the next 3-5 years.

I'm not overly concerned to be honest about European results. Our League perform badly, but I know the league as a whole will still be in existance in for the foreseable future. Whilst there are clubs who aren't exactly flush, none of them are close to extinction either.

Not sure how you can say that. Have the IL instigated a wage cap yet? I know clubs may be slightly better run than when they were paying silly money left, right and centre. But none of them sailing close to the wind?

Ok there's easyjet now, but Portadown are still flying a player in every week.

And when the excrement hits the football supporter what happens? Put it down to the usual Derry whinging, if you want, but let's compare and contrast what happened when Derry City were called up on their taxes, with what happened Coleraine.
03/08/2009, 12:00 PM
dcfcsteve

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

Probably just as well, because Derry Citys history in the IL was very poor;):cool:

Just as well really - a poor history for a poor league..... :)
04/08/2009, 11:30 AM
Steve Bruce

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

Just as well really - a poor history for a poor league..... :)

Says more about your clubs history rather than the leagues does it not;)
04/08/2009, 11:34 AM
Steve Bruce

Quote:

Originally Posted by A N Mouse

Not sure how you can say that. Have the IL instigated a wage cap yet? I know clubs may be slightly better run than when they were paying silly money left, right and centre. But none of them sailing close to the wind?

Ok there's easyjet now, but Portadown are still flying a player in every week.

And when the excrement hits the football supporter what happens? Put it down to the usual Derry whinging, if you want, but let's compare and contrast what happened when Derry City were called up on their taxes, with what happened Coleraine.

There isn't a wage cap in effect in Irish League football. Coleraine very nearly went out of Business, like Cork nearly did. But Coleraine have appeared to have learnt their lesson, they have new people in charge and the club is run properly.

Portadown are AFAIK are in no financial danger, not flush with money by any means, but hardly sailing close to the wind either.

Glentoran I'd say are the club who are closest club to having real problems but they are taking steps to fix that problem.

In comparison to the LOI, the Irish League is fairly healthy finacially.
04/08/2009, 11:45 PM
dcfcsteve

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

Says more about your clubs history rather than the leagues does it not;)

Indeed. It really started going down hill after we left it.... :D
06/08/2009, 8:04 PM
holidaysong

The 0.125 earned by Derry tonight brings us up to 1.375 for the year so far. We've passed the 1.333 mark which is what we lose for 5 years ago (which I really didn't think we'd do)..

Finland also got 0.125 tonight but with all their teams now out of Europe our (provisional) leapfrog over them in the rankings is now secure.
06/08/2009, 8:49 PM
dynamo kerry

Quote:

Originally Posted by holidaysong

The 0.125 earned by Derry tonight brings us up to 1.375 for the year so far. We've passed the 1.333 mark which is what we lose for 5 years ago (which I really didn't think we'd do)..

Finland also got 0.125 tonight but with all their teams now out of Europe our (provisional) leapfrog over them in the rankings is now secure.

Just so we're clear
Sligo - 0.5
Bohemians - 0.5

2nd Qualifying round
Pats - 1.5
Derry - 1.5

3rd Qualifying round
Pats - 1
Derry - 0.5

1.375

Decent year so far. If pats can manage a draw or even two it starts to look very good. Especially as it's a 4 team score compared to the old 3 team score. It's probably a bg ask to expect 4 Irish teams to do very well in Europe every year. A lot of the experience tends to be at 2/3 clubs.

Still, as the standard rises, we're definitely getting closer. Especially considering that it's not exaclty a great year for the league in a number of other ways.
06/08/2009, 9:55 PM
saintmaniac

Quote:

Originally Posted by holidaysong

The 0.125 earned by Derry tonight brings us up to 1.375 for the year so far. We've passed the 1.333 mark which is what we lose for 5 years ago (which I really didn't think we'd do)..

That's great, I'm very happy, but if you respond to my celebration of a Pats European victory again with the words "It's great for the co-efficient", I should not have to be held responsible for my actions. :D It's not human!
07/08/2009, 3:20 PM
redobit

Should be higher. We let the side down. Looking back we should have taken them.
07/08/2009, 5:20 PM
Mayo Red

Quote:

Originally Posted by redobit

Should be higher. We let the side down. Looking back we should have taken them.

Definately, we should have beaten them out the gate in the Showgrounds on the balance of play and chances, especially in the first half. Such a shame we couldn't progress.
08/08/2009, 12:52 AM
ped_ped

OK, two co-efficient related questions:

This page referenced in the Champions League thread says that the champions of the top 12 countries (countries rated 1 - 12) get straight into the group, but I cannot for the life of me understand who gets into the 4th qualifying round (the play-offs). I get that two third-placed teams and three fourth placed teams and all that... but to put it simply, fill in the question marks:

"The champions of the countries rated 13 - ?? get an automatic place in the play-offs."

---

Question number two - am I right in saying that, theoretically if the champions of a country NEVER qualify for the Champions League as they NEVER manage to win a qualifying round, they could still win an automatic place the following year because the second placed/third placed/cup winners gain so many co-eff points in the Europa League that it pushes the country into twelfth place?
08/08/2009, 1:35 AM
Schumi

Quote:

Originally Posted by ped_ped

OK, two co-efficient related questions:

This page referenced in the Champions League thread says that the champions of the top 12 countries (countries rated 1 - 12) get straight into the group, but I cannot for the life of me understand who gets into the 4th qualifying round (the play-offs). I get that two third-placed teams and three fourth placed teams and all that... but to put it simply, fill in the question marks:

"The champions of the countries rated 13 - ?? get an automatic place in the play-offs."

No champions get an automatic place in that round. They all have to get through the previous round.

Quote:

Question number two - am I right in saying that, theoretically if the champions of a country NEVER qualify for the Champions League as they NEVER manage to win a qualifying round, they could still win an automatic place the following year because the second placed/third placed/cup winners gain so many co-eff points in the Europa League that it pushes the country into twelfth place?

It's possible. I don't know if a country has got an automatic group stage spot before a team qualified though.
08/08/2009, 1:43 AM
ped_ped

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schumi

No champions get an automatic place in that round. They all have to get through the previous round.

So Wisła Krak�w must play through two qualifying rounds after winning the Ekstraklasse... yet fourth-placed Arsenal must only play one tie after finishing 18 points off the mark... so much for the UEFA 'Champion's League,' eh?
09/08/2009, 12:28 PM
dcfcsteve

Quote:

Originally Posted by ped_ped

So Wisła Krak�w must play through two qualifying rounds after winning the Ekstraklasse... yet fourth-placed Arsenal must only play one tie after finishing 18 points off the mark... so much for the UEFA 'Champion's League,' eh?

That point has been made for years.

In fairness though, the top team in Poland are probably no better than Arsenal, so the idea from UEFA's perspective is to allow more in from the better leagues to take account of the difference in quality.

The Champions League is all about stopping Europes top clubs from running off and setting up the proverbial European Super League, and the price that's paid for footballing unity is the likes of Arsenal getting parachuted into the CL at the stage just before the groups. Footballling politics is the art of the possible.

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