FAI Junior Cup 2010/11

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Originally Posted by Longshanks

Well if the stats I put up today are anything to go by, (and as I've said they dont prove too much, although you disagree) you'll see that Limerick have had 9 different clubs making it to the last 8 over the last 6 cups(Fairview and Pike have been both in last 8 twice) it goes to show that there appears to be serious strength in depth in the Junior soccer scene in Limerick, it also seems to be well ran, resourced, financed, have good facilities and well publicised and supported league. I'm not saying that isnt the case in Waterford. As i said in an earlier post, there appears to be some really strong teams in Waterford.

But I'd imagine it'd be toss up between the Limerick Premier and the AUL A that would be the toughest league to win, not trying to be disrespectful to WJL or any other league, just my opinion

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My main point is, and your facts back this up, that there is an ambalance in the structure of the FAI Jun Cup qualifiers. This is very clear. Would you agree on this?
You could go back ten or twenty years, it would'nt matter. The statistics would be consistent.

Also in any of the top premier leagues you will almost always find the same three or four teams battling it out whether it be Dublin, Waterford, Limerick , Tipperary or wherever, all of them equally tough.
It would probably be easier to pick a league winner in Dublin than any of the other supposedly stronger leagues this season.

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Originally Posted by Longshanks

And to rank each division/region that puts teams through to the 'open' draw based on their teams making the quarters(latter stages):

1. Waterford 6/12 50%
2. Limerick 11/30 36.6%
3. Galway 4/24 22.2%
4. Tipp N/S, WW, EC 6/30 20%
5. Mayo 4/24 16.6%
6. Dub/Kildare/Wiclow
Meath/Combine Co's 13/126 10.3%
7. Sligo/Leitrim/Ros 1/18 5.5%
7. Kerry/Clare/Lim Des 1/18 5.5%
9. Donegal/Inishowen
Cavan/Monaghan 1/30 3.3%
10. Cork 1/48 2%
11. Kilkenny/Carlow/Wex 0/28 0%

I've had to merge Dublin saturday and sunday as I could tell which were which.

Still interesting enough stats, although they probably dont prove much. I'd still have Limerick as the top Junior football division. But it does show that the WJL is seriously under represented in the 5th round draw in comparioson to the Cork areas. The WJL should be looking to merge with Kilkenny/Carlow/Wexford to give them a better chance of more teams entering the 5th round.

any thoughts??

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excellent analysis Longshanks. I wish powers that be would take a look and maybe reward best performing areas/leagues. It is always recognised in Waterford that getting out of area is a huge test for any club. This ensures decent representives in open draw , so allowing cream to the top .(so to speak)
In last six finals , Dublin 4 - WDJL 3 - Lim 2 - Tipp 1 -combined 1 -galway 1- are the finalists . This again shows strenght of Waterord league. One other thought is that the domination of dublin clubs in the past (60`s 70`s 80`s) is gone . Country clubs have come to the fore in leaps and bounds since.

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Originally Posted by Mission Bell

My main point is, and your facts back this up, that there is an ambalance in the structure of the FAI Jun Cup qualifiers. This is very clear. Would you agree on this?
You could go back ten or twenty years, it would'nt matter. The statistics would be consistent.

Also in any of the top premier leagues you will almost always find the same three or four teams battling it out whether it be Dublin, Waterford, Limerick , Tipperary or wherever, all of them equally tough.
It would probably be easier to pick a league winner in Dublin than any of the other supposedly stronger leagues this season.

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Might be tougher to pick the relegated teams too

I do agree that the Waterford representation is a bit light - not just based on performance over the years but based on number of teams entered. However as far as I understand the number of teams qualifying for the out of town stages is mainly linked into the number of teams entered not on performance. Not a perfect method I grant you but just about the fairest way... This is just a summary of the Munster area...

Area == Junior teams entered == Qualifiers == Qualifiers per entrant
Clare/Kerry == 38 == 4 == 1:9.5
Cork Area == 74 == 8 == 1:9.3
Limerick == 53 == 5 == 1:10.6
Tipp/WWEC == 48 == 5 == 1:9.6
Waterford == 24 == 2 == 1:12

Yes it suggests Waterford are underrepresented by 1 team.

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Originally Posted by Innishvilla

I do agree that the Waterford representation is a bit light - not just based on performance over the years but based on number of teams entered. However as far as I understand the number of teams qualifying for the out of town stages is mainly linked into the number of teams entered not on performance. Not a perfect method I grant you but just about the fairest way... This is just a summary of the Munster area...

Area == Junior teams entered == Qualifiers == Qualifiers per entrant
Clare/Kerry == 38 == 4 == 1:9.5
Cork Area == 74 == 8 == 1:9.3
Limerick == 53 == 5 == 1:10.6
Tipp/WWEC == 48 == 5 == 1:9.6
Waterford == 24 == 2 == 1:12

Yes it suggests Waterford are underrepresented by 1 team.

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Well done on the research which again shows an imbalance in representation from Waterford.
However, my central point is that a simple change, merging the Waterford Junior League with West Waterford East Cork League would correct the situation.
Why have a county the size of Tipperary composed of two separate leagues joined up with WWEC.?
WHO makes these decisions and on what criteria are they based?
Have any teams from the WWEC League ever qualified from this section?
Are they merely cannon fodder for the stronger Tipperary sides, particularily South Tipp?

Any thoughts?

I don't know about the strength of the West Waterford/East Cork league but it does seem strange that a cork/waterford league gets folded into neither cork nor waterford. I would see waterford as being the obvious choice as I couldn't imagine a team from waterford being happy to face a trip to clonakilty - well it would be like qualifying for the out of town section I suppose...

I agree. It just does'nt make sense that West Waterford/East Cork are not put with WJL. This would be a good starting point for the FAI if and when they decide to address the issue.

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Originally Posted by Innishvilla

I don't know about the strength of the West Waterford/East Cork league but it does seem strange that a cork/waterford league gets folded into neither cork nor waterford. I would see waterford as being the obvious choice as I couldn't imagine a team from waterford being happy to face a trip to clonakilty - well it would be like qualifying for the out of town section I suppose...

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the wwec is a poor enough standard two tier leagus that are spilt after xmas, they have good facilities in cappaquin and a good fundraising commitee, but the gaa rules the roost, recently lismore were thrown out for not fielding a team two games running and mondeligo folded for not having a squad

Heard Regional won their objection against boro, any truth in that?

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Originally Posted by widow

Heard Regional won their objection against boro, any truth in that?

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I heard boro were gone but it could be just rubbish.

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Originally Posted by Mission Bell

Actually the organisers of th FAI Junior Cup do need to take a look at whats quite evident to the naked eye.
Why pitch West Waterford in with Tipperary South and North?
Why have so many teams from Cork in latter stages when past performance does not merit same?
Why have only two reps from WJL which, if scrutinized, probably has the highest ratio of teams reaching the latter rounds of the competition, given the amount of teams qualifying?

So when viewed from this perspective, NO, the organisers of the competition DO NOT HAVE sufficient information on the make up of the FAI Junior Cup.

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Looks like the organiser's need to meet up with you. Or even better change hands.

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Originally Posted by ProEvo

Looks like the organiser's need to meet up with you. Or even better change hands.

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That might be a good idea.
Thanks!
Any thoughts on the statistics provided by other contributors in relation to the debate regarding qualification for latter stages of FAI Junior Cup?

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Originally Posted by trueview6

I heard boro were gone but it could be just rubbish.

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yeah heard it last night from a boro man. boro are out, regional won the objection

Cappamore VRS Geraldines match has been switched to rathurd

hospital v shannon hibs off water logged pitch

Castle rvs. v Star rvs. also off due to waterlogged pitch.

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Originally Posted by twohalves

Castle rvs. v Star rvs. also off due to waterlogged pitch.

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Do Castle Rvs lose home advantage now or do they get another go to try and play it at home?

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Originally Posted by abbeyvale

Do Castle Rvs lose home advantage now or do they get another go to try and play it at home?

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aisling v carew park off pitch destroyed between sand and water like a swimming pool.

yes abbey ye will get home advantage as will carew id take the home advantage we had 3 or 4 injurys they should be fit to play when the game is refixed john boyle was only about 50% fit this morning was only togging out incase. carew offered aisling to transfer it up to carew park this morning they said no

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Originally Posted by thomas72

aisling v carew park off pitch destroyed between sand and water like a swimming pool.

yes abbey ye will get home advantage as will carew id take the home advantage we had 3 or 4 injurys they should be fit to play when the game is refixed john boyle was only about 50% fit this morning was only togging out incase. carew offered aisling to transfer it up to carew park this morning they said no

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bad call from aisling if that was the case they have to go up to carew and play it anyway why not do it when the likes of john boyle and others are not fit. heard a few aisling players were not happy with dalton when they heard he refused to transfer it to carew.

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Originally Posted by white line

bad call from aisling if that was the case they have to go up to carew and play it anyway why not do it when the likes of john boyle and others are not fit. heard a few aisling players were not happy with dalton when they heard he refused to transfer it to carew.

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well thats there call to make i think they had two players suspended aswell so it works out well for everyone.