Stephen Kenny

Even when we didn’t have great squads we were always difficult to beat.

Two big problems:

- We’re easy to figure out and beat
- our manager has no charisma and probably doesn’t have the respect of some of the players. Not in a bad way. I’m sure they all like him personally but not sure he’s very inspiring

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Originally Posted by Jolly Red Giant

There is a lot of nonsense about the players not being good enough - these are professional footballers playing at a high level in one of the most competitive leagues globally. Irish teams in the past with a similar or poorer 'quality' of player did not capitulate like Kenny's teams have done in the past 4 years. Irish teams for decades have always been greater than the sum of their parts (with the possible exception of Staunton's tenure) - now Kenny is succeeding in having them playing considerably less than the sum of their parts.

In 1974 the standard of English football wasn't anywhere close to its position in Europe now and few if any foreign players played in England - Ireland beat Russia 3-0 in 1974 and the team was significantly better than the sum of their parts because the guy managing the team, Johnny Giles, knew what he was doing

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You might want to research English clubs in European finals in the seventies

I think there's an element that we have to be realistic about our squad - many have had poor seasons and aren't where we'd have thought they might be three years ago (when Kenny took over). Bazunu was out of his depth last year in the Premier and isn't doing great this season either (even allowing for a dodgy defence, to put it mildly). Doherty has barely played all year; has had a disastrous time of it. Collins was dropped by Wolves for the run-in last season. Duffy has dropped a division - he's doing well enough at Norwich, though is prone to the odd shocker. Cullen - Burnley have been a huge disappointment this season given how they romped the Championship last season. Knight was a Championship regular at 18, and four years later is at the same level. Smallbone is getting a lot of stick on the Southampton forum for being too lightweight (and I've noted before how ranty that site is in general, so pinch of salt there as required). Manning is the same. Idah is still living off a Cup hat-trick five years ago. That's just the guys who played yesterday - there's similar to be said about Kelleher, Omobamidele, Molumby, McGrath, Parrott, Connolly, Obafemi and others.

It's not a good squad. I think we lose sight of that when we have threads on each of the guys flagging when they when a tackle or whatever. It's a young squad and some of these guys are going to have something click in the next year or two and jump up a level. And some will drift out of the squad and be replaced by someone else. But we're looking at the squad as it is now, not as it might be in 2/3 years' time.

But to be clear - is it so poor a squad as to be so comfortably beaten by Greece home and away, on top of all the other poor results we've had? I don't think so. And that has to be on the manager.

If his contract doesn't get renewed I wonder what level he gets his next job at? Scottish premiership or lower end of English Championship?

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Originally Posted by liamoo11

If his contract doesn't get renewed I wonder what level he gets his next job at? Scottish premiership or lower end of English Championship?

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LOI, can see him being the next Bohs manager.

Or back to Derry

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Originally Posted by liamoo11

If his contract doesn't get renewed I wonder what level he gets his next job at? Scottish premiership or lower end of English Championship?

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That's remarkably optimistic to put it mildly.

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Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

You might want to research English clubs in European finals in the seventies

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Bert Kassies has the UEFA coefficients going back to the start of European football. I'm not sure if he created them back that far or if they were in operation then (on the same basis as now)

Anyway, in 1974, the English league was comfortably the top-ranked in Europe

https://kassiesa.net/uefa/data/method1/crank1974.html

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Originally Posted by liamoo11

If his contract doesn't get renewed I wonder what level he gets his next job at? Scottish premiership or lower end of English Championship?

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Always thought he'd up in the MLS maybe.....

League one would be the highest I'd reckon he'd get in the UK.....

Stephen Kenny's recent CV = = Disastrous term as Republic of Ireland manager = = I can't see too many queue-ing up for him to be honest !

The last Ireland manger with a league of Ireland background who managed at underage level, and replaced Mick McCarthy, ended up managing the Faroe Islands, and grinding an axe with the FAI in public for almost 20 years

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Originally Posted by Trequartista20

The author of the Pundit Arena article linked above is a prime example. Utterly delusional stuff.

'Where are the Kennyites?' is probably a better question. Presumably walking slowly backwards into a hedge.

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You're letting the Pundit Arena guy get under your skin?

I haven't seen anyone bar mypost cheerleading for Kenny on here for a long time. That tells its own story.

Kenny has failed. He's actually gotten worse if anything. The players aren't great at all but we need someone brave to come in a try something different in terms of approach and selection. That back 4 on Friday was tragic. I think most people understand that. It doesn't mean anybody was wrong for hoping Kenny could do the job. There were reasonable reasons to think it might work even if it was always an appointment made due as much to financial constraints as anything.

We move on. Whether the FAI can actually find and afford someone who can deliver dramatic change......I'm not sure. I'd expect us to get better and not be as completely useless against the likes of Greece.

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Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

The last Ireland manger with a league of Ireland background who managed at underage level, and replaced Mick McCarthy, ended up managing the Faroe Islands, and grinding an axe with the FAI in public for almost 20 years

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So ~ You're saying there is a chance ! ! !

A chance for Stephen Kenny.

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Originally Posted by seanfhear

That's remarkably optimistic to put it mildly.

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I'd hope he takes a job even if it's league 1 and work his way back up. I always thought Brian kerr should have taken a job somewhere in England at whatever level and showed he could do it cause I really thought he could. That Faroe s job as well as he done was pointless for his career

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Originally Posted by liamoo11

I'd hope he takes a job even if it's league 1 and work his way back up. I always thought Brian kerr should have taken a job somewhere in England at whatever level and showed he could do it cause I really thought he could. That Faroe s job as well as he done was pointless for his career

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Maybe Brian Kerr didn't get the offers. Stephen Kenny probably won't either.

I think this experience will knock Kenny back and he’ll likely need to take a break from it all. He’s never been the most resilient when things have gotten tough, when the pressure came on, going back to his days at Bohs. He has fallen as often as he has excelled and this one is in the goldfish bowl of the Irish public. His reputation has taken a pounding. It’s going to hurt him a lot. Not nice, and you feel for him, but he knew what he was signing up for.

I could see him taking a job in England lower divisions in 12-18 months.

I said it before if they can get Lee Carsley they should see if Roy Hodgson would be willing to be his part time No 2.

Kenny is finished and it’s obvious he is not up to the job.

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

I think there's an element that we have to be realistic about our squad - many have had poor seasons and aren't where we'd have thought they might be three years ago (when Kenny took over). Bazunu was out of his depth last year in the Premier and isn't doing great this season either (even allowing for a dodgy defence, to put it mildly). Doherty has barely played all year; has had a disastrous time of it. Collins was dropped by Wolves for the run-in last season. Duffy has dropped a division - he's doing well enough at Norwich, though is prone to the odd shocker. Cullen - Burnley have been a huge disappointment this season given how they romped the Championship last season. Knight was a Championship regular at 18, and four years later is at the same level. Smallbone is getting a lot of stick on the Southampton forum for being too lightweight (and I've noted before how ranty that site is in general, so pinch of salt there as required). Manning is the same. Idah is still living off a Cup hat-trick five years ago. That's just the guys who played yesterday - there's similar to be said about Kelleher, Omobamidele, Molumby, McGrath, Parrott, Connolly, Obafemi and others.

It's not a good squad. I think we lose sight of that when we have threads on each of the guys flagging when they when a tackle or whatever. It's a young squad and some of these guys are going to have something click in the next year or two and jump up a level. And some will drift out of the squad and be replaced by someone else. But we're looking at the squad as it is now, not as it might be in 2/3 years' time..

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Is it a coincidence that a lot of players have gone off the boil in tandem with the slow, steady and soul-destroying decline of the national team?

They're with the national team set up what - six weeks of the year?

I don't think you can say such a small part of the year is having such a large impact across the board.

There should be evidence of a “mechanical” implementation of Kenny’s game plan vision – which could be seen when Barry and Eustace were part of the coaching. I think a lot of our play has progressively become off-the-cuff this past year, which questions the coaching.

Player development, how good/ bad the current squad is are for other threads. Kenny isn’t getting the best out of what is available to him and that’s why he must go.

(Eustace is still available).