A 7-team league First Division Next Year

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29/11/2013, 10:01 PM
Charlie Darwin

Quote:

Originally Posted by ATFC-1887

Don't know if its been asked/answered on here already. But just say Rovers B finish top. Will they go down as champions and get the trophy or will it go to second place? And would second place get the automatic promotion spot and 3rd and 4th get the playoffs?

Of course they'd go down as champions. It's only happened once before in Spain, when Real won the Segunda Division and were passed over for promotion by the teams below them. Realistically, they're not going to win it anyway. All indications are it will be 18 year olds with 4-5 senior players there to provide some experience, much like some of the other sides in the Division.
30/11/2013, 8:55 AM
legendz

Quote:

Originally Posted by republican

how can people say that the b team idea is a joke?? in spain and germany b teams play in the division below the top tier or even the next league. youngsters who are not good enough for 1st team yet playing a real game of football every week with all the pressures of relegation and so forth. this is not the case in england and look at the difference in player production in those countries. if rovers or st pats or cork had a bteam in the loi 1st division it would be quality for their younger players to be playing waterford, galway, longford every week. wakey wakey people.

I'd agree with that. It's a brave move for any club to enter a second team with the costs involved. I'm not in favour of it being at the expense of fielding an U19 team. The B team should be for players out of U19's and not in the first team squad. I'm interested to hear how they plan to sort out registration for A and B teams. I'd imagine at least 16 players will have to registered with the first team ruling them out of B action. If players registered with the B team play x number of games with the first team they should be automatically ineligible to play with the B team for the rest of the season?
30/11/2013, 10:32 AM
nigel-harps1954

I wish people would stop comparing the League of Ireland with the Spanish and German leagues regarding the B teams. There's a distinct difference in that there's still enough competitive clubs in those leagues to allow for the B sides.
30/11/2013, 1:36 PM
Bawnville Hoop

Quote:

Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954

I wish people would stop comparing the League of Ireland with the Spanish and German leagues regarding the B teams. There's a distinct difference in that there's still enough competitive clubs in those leagues to allow for the B sides.

Compare it to the Estonian league then, exact same operation.
30/11/2013, 1:46 PM
nigel-harps1954

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bawnville Hoop

Compare it to the Estonian league then, exact same operation.

Not really. There's 6 levels of league football in Estonia.
30/11/2013, 3:15 PM
Bawnville Hoop

Estonian league, take their premier and first divisions. Flora Tallinn and Levadia in Premier with B teams of each in the first division.

There's nothing more to it.
30/11/2013, 3:20 PM
Charlie Darwin

I think the point is that they have six levels, so they're there on merit, not by default.
30/11/2013, 8:54 PM
Dodge

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin

I think the point is that they have six levels, so they're there on merit, not by default.

Based on what? I'd guess they entered the league at the second division
30/11/2013, 9:07 PM
Charlie Darwin

You'd guess or you know? I didn't say what league they entered at - I said there are leagues below them, meaning there is some element of merit to their being in the second tier.
30/11/2013, 11:09 PM
republican

Quote:

Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954

I wish people would stop comparing the League of Ireland with the Spanish and German leagues regarding the B teams. There's a distinct difference in that there's still enough competitive clubs in those leagues to allow for the B sides.

i wasnt for a min comparing the standards of the leagues, was simply saying their system is much better and produces more players through the systems. can we not copy the same idea in this country?? if viable of course but this should be up to the clubs to decide.
01/12/2013, 8:38 AM
Spudulika

There is merit in having B/II/D teams in the league system, short term, though it still stifles the development of a proper national league. In the Baltic countries B teams are the norm, as are farm clubs - whose players are technically property of a parent club yet rented/loaned for a season(s). However (as already pointed out above) the big difference is that there are levels below where clubs can aspire/develop from.
01/12/2013, 6:56 PM
wonder88

A big problem with the First Division in recent years is the travel costs involved. For example in must set Harps back a pretty penny to go all the way down to Wexford, and for the Youths to fulfill the return fixture (twice due to the small number of clubs in league). Due to the transport system in Ireland, Dublin is the most central/accessible location for the country clubs so it a good idea to have another club based in the capital along with Shels. Last year there was no Dublin based club, so I would support a B team as long as they are from the capital.
01/12/2013, 9:05 PM
Macy

Quote:

Originally Posted by ATFC-1887

Don't know if its been asked/answered on here already. But just say Rovers B finish top. Will they go down as champions and get the trophy or will it go to second place? And would second place get the automatic promotion spot and 3rd and 4th get the playoffs?

It'll depend on who is in the automatic relegation spot in the premier.
02/12/2013, 7:55 AM
JC_GUFC

Quote:

Originally Posted by A face

So that needs new teams who either apply themselves or there is an invite communicated to all the existing Premier Div clubs outlining that there is a new option available to them, a reserve team in the first div. This communication was never made. Its not an option (after the horse has bolted) to refer to the standard club application deadline and say 'oh well, because you didn't think of the idea of fielding a reserve team (something that was scraped something like ten years ago), and the fact that you've missed the deadline anyway, then its your problem." .....

I don't see why not.

There was a clear message from the FAI looking for expressions of interest to play in the First Division for the coming season. There have been rumours of Rovers Reserves for a couple of years. It wasn't a total off-the-wall thought that potentially Rovers Reserves would apply and be accepted.

I would ask your own club did the board have any discussion about the potential of a entering a reserve team into the LoI.

That's not to say the FAI haven't totally screwed things up with regards to getting new clubs in. Tralee and FC Carlow were ready to make the step up. They said Carlow could join if they played in Kilkenny! I would like to see the logic behind offering Salthill Devon a licence, who decided they were going to pay their players now that they'd gotten rid of Galway United, but not Tralee or Carlow.
02/12/2013, 10:49 AM
Dodge

Quote:

Originally Posted by JC_GUFC

I would like to see the logic behind offering Salthill Devon a licence, who decided they were going to pay their players now that they'd gotten rid of Galway United, but not Tralee or Carlow.

I think Salthill was another one of those "we need a club badly" jobs. The FAI should never have admitted them. I think it's a good thing they've learned from that and applied some sort of licence requirements to new entrants like Tralee or Carlow. If a club can't meet the minimum standards, it can't really have any issue with not being allowed in. How is it going to grow without even the thinnest of bases?
02/12/2013, 1:30 PM
Nesta99

All the tinkering in the world can be done with the first division, B teams, amalgamated teams, regional divisions etc. None of it is ever going to really succeed until the most basic of bases is that prize money is greater than participation fee. Even a waiver of entry fees for a number of years albeit ensuring that money goes to meeting some minimum criteria would be a step in a better direction.
02/12/2013, 2:00 PM
gormacha

Quote:

Originally Posted by republican

i wasnt for a min comparing the standards of the leagues, was simply saying their system is much better and produces more players through the systems. can we not copy the same idea in this country?? if viable of course but this should be up to the clubs to decide.

I don't think the fact that Real Madrid have a B team is a significant factor in the production of players.

There is no culture of B teams playing in the LOI. I feel it degrades what is already a pi55 poor division.
02/12/2013, 2:16 PM
Charlie Darwin

Quote:

Originally Posted by gormacha

I don't think the fact that Real Madrid have a B team is a significant factor in the production of players.

There is no culture of B teams playing in the LOI. I feel it degrades what is already a pi55 poor division.

Several of the current Real team spent several years in the Bs before making the step up, and they've sold many others on for millions at a time. Pretty much every forward available to the Spain team, bar Torres, came through Real B.
02/12/2013, 2:39 PM
The Donie Forde

Anyone remember the good old League of Ireland 'B' Division, back in the day? I think it was mainly Leinster clubs, mostly LOI reserve teams and a couple of non-Leinster teams like Waterford?

I know LOI 'B' even played representative games occasionally.

Thus, while there may be no recent 'culture' of B teams, we've certainly had it in the past.
02/12/2013, 3:21 PM
Dodge

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Donie Forde

Anyone remember the good old League of Ireland 'B' Division, back in the day? I think it was mainly Leinster clubs, mostly LOI reserve teams and a couple of non-Leinster teams like Waterford?

I know LOI 'B' even played representative games occasionally.

Thus, while there may be no recent 'culture' of B teams, we've certainly had it in the past.

UP until 2011 we had the A championship which was a reserve league in any other name.

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