Let's start thinking that we can top this group.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
Let's start thinking that we can top this group.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
That's why he's one of the most successful managers in the history of the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Noelys Guitar
Great decision. And you could see how long couldn't link up with Keane as well as he had done with Cox. However that's not to say that long was ineffectual when he came on. He held the ball up well.
Killer had a cracking game and the only time he seemed out of his depth was when he ran at their midfield.
Killer snafu'd for Pandev's handball goal. Otherwise he was solid, if a littler weary.
We do need 3 tall players in the back 4.
Win our last four games and we are laughing.
Why were they awarded a penalty when O'Shea made contact with the balls?
Pandev is some player. Very slick and crafty. For a defense that never played together not a bad achievement keeping a clean sheet
Excruciating football to watch sometimes. And frustrating: yes the result is wonderful, 2:0 away from home is not to be sneezed at, but the manner in which we go about gaining the result is tough to enjoy, or even justify. We kept a clean sheet through dumb luck, and poor opponents who gave up after 60 odd minutes, not some gloriously efficient gameplan of Traps.
Is it getting results? Possibly, it might even result in a appearance in the finals; but playing that brand of football, with that kind of mentality in the team? The spirit amongst the players might be strong, but I feel utterly dispirited watching that kind of hoofball. Score before 20 minutes, hoof it away for the following 70. We just seem to drop into some sort of panic-mode, everything suddenly feels last-ditch when we could have just shut out the game with possession.
Given - 8 - Saved us v Pandoev. A few other really good saves. Felt good to have him back
Kelly - 6 - Let Pandev go. Good otherwise
O'Shea - 6 - A few moments. No malice in the penalty, but it is his job to know where his man is. Should have given away another one. Solid otherwise
O'Dea - 6 - Solid, but anonamous
Kilbane - 7 - SOlid, and showed his experience
McGeady - 6 - Great talent, but lacked a bit of maturity tonight. Gave the ball away to often.
Whelan - 7 - Good shift. The middle looked really solid
Andrews - 7 - As Whelan. Looked really solid
Hunt - 8 - I just love the guy. Plays the game like a terrier. Very unsettling for opponents
Cox - 6 - Didn't see much from him
Keane - 8 - What can you say. Best player on the park.
Was not pleasant to watch really was it, must admit I was watching BTG at the same time which was marginally more entertaining.
Did we actually create anything ourselves? Not much I can recall. I don't recall anything else on target.
Yeah it is getting results. According to Soccerbase we're the first team to beat Macedonia at home in a competitive game by two goals since Russia in 2006. In that time England (won 1-0, 2006), Croatia (lost 2-0, 2007), Holland (won 2-1, 2008) and Spain (won 3-2, 2009) have all failed to do what we just did.Quote:
Originally Posted by amaccann
People talk about this like it was no achievement, like we were terribly lucky or we played genuinely badly and somehow squeaked past - and it's simply not true. Teams don't walk over Macedonia in Skopje, we were extremely comfortable for most of the match and if we got an odd slice of luck then we certainly deserved it on the swings and roundabouts principle.
Was it pleasant to look at? Not really. But I watch England, NI, Scotland, Spain, Italy, France, Russia and international football in general enough to know that there is a mere handful of international teams in the world who play nice football. I couldn't give a figs....
Ah now, I think there's a happy medium to be had here; I don't think anyone with their head screwed on would be demanding Barcelona levels of "nice" football from our lads. I'm not talking about fancy triangles of passing here, just some common sense possession, or aggressive pressurising from the players. Dear god it wouldn't hurt us to stop playing like headless chickens, turning our leads into second halves of panicked defending, letting the other team into the match & those root-one clearances. Possession is nine tenths of the law, but the way Ireland play when we're in the lead, it's as if the ball is radioactive.Quote:
Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton
Was listening on RTE after the game Bon.
job well done. 3 points clean sheet 50 for keano. brilliant robbie, hunty and given. never been so happy to watch such a stinker of a second half. was expecting a lot more shakey moments. i dont know what it is with o'shea, he can look like a quality player when he plays alongside quality players at united or for us, but once he is expected to be the main man he seems to buckle under the pressure, 2 clear penalties. rode our luck a bit , but sure its about time we got some, go on the lads euros here we come
we havnt played in a major tournament for 10 years , i couldnt give a fiddlers how we get there. few things can compare to the atmosphere in this country leading up to a major finalsQuote:
Originally Posted by amaccann
Honestly, is it even a handful?Quote:
Originally Posted by SwanVsDalton
That post for me really sums it up Swan. There are some people on here who will never understand. despite reason, that Int'l Football is nothing to be compared to the best of EPL, La Liga, etc.... And its (somewhat comically) always compared to the teams on the the top of those tables.
Irish players generally do not see much of each other in a given year, practice and play with each other all that much, which is par for the course of most teams in Europe. I know they have had afew weeks here, but come on. Its mucky, emotional football, often inconvenient to the players schedule, maybe not the way Pele played with Brazil but then again older is always better in everyone's memory.
They didn't play a perfect game tonight but to expect it to look classic is doing a disservice to yourself as a fan. Just enjoy it for what it is, drink a bit with friends if applicable, and don't worry, b/c the next game is not for months, which does murder to any thought of momentum anyway, in my humble opinion. And thats a run on sentence.
Just to elaborate on your point. Do any of us think that any time soon our kids in Dublin and Kerry and Gweedore and Lisdoonvarna will ever be taught the Barcelona way? There can only be one answer to that question and if it is no then we can never hope to be a decent team at international level. The other question that must be asked collectively of us is - when does the light bulb go off in the head? If Barcelona's way is the best way to play the game, then for how many years can we persist with long ball, hoofball football. If it didn't work for the 100 or so years the FAI have been in operation then what makes us think that it will work the next time we employ those tactics (like against Slovakia, Russia, Andorra and Armenia). Perhaps not the time or place to be fantacising about what might be just hours after a famous victory, but hopefully one day soon our kids will grow up to play football the way it should be played.Quote:
Originally Posted by amaccann
Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
I find comments like these hilarious. The RESULT to me as a supporter of a team is everything, especially a small country like Ireland. We are not Brazil, England, Argentina or Germany. We're a bankrupt country of a few million on the periphery of Europe and we have people who say that not only do we have to win in a country like Macedonia, but we have to win playing good fottball. I would doubt if you asked any of the fans who made that journey whether they gives a fiddler's flam about the style of play, they would say no.Quote:
Originally Posted by amaccann
In my 30+ years of following Ireland to competitive away game (other than tournaments), I have seen them win only in Malta, Lativa, San Marino and Lithuania. Irish away wins are like hens' teeth but yet we have gripes about styles of play. Incredible. Watch Man U and Barcelona if you're not entertained by Ireland winning in Macedonia or Ant and Dec.
Rejoice. We are joint top of the group.
Joint 3rd <cough> :p
Ask any Brit right now if he/she would have rather won vs the Swiss (AT HOME) or played Beautiful football? They did neither, but I am sure where the answer is, because I just talked to more than a few who are here on vacation. And they are ****ing mortified. "We do nothing well." Said one.Quote:
Originally Posted by OwlsFan
Good post Owl. Let's not forget, if we all had to show real names, and age, the tone of this board and all sports message boards on the world wide web, would be vastly different. Credibility would take on a much more important roll than say, I live in my parents basement and so can have a million posts on internet websites, instead of using it as its original intention, like a fan does who actually enjoys the precedings.
Don't see why we can't....Quote:
Originally Posted by BonnieShels
well said owl. don't care if we perform worse than paul mcshanes barber as long as the result is right.Quote:
Originally Posted by OwlsFan
this slovakia game is huge, especially with it coming down to records against each other. a must win. a result there will almost guarentee a playoff spot and take the pressure off the trip to russia a few days later. i really think we can make it through this group. long wait till sept
Given - At his imperious best when called upon, think the two Carling Cup games brought him right up to speed
Kelly - Solid, kept Trikovsky quiet
O'Shea - Game of two halves, clear weakness in the first half, calming and mature presence in the second. Still needs a leader beside him to get the best out of him IMO
O'Dea - see above
Kilbane - The reason he's the starting left full is because he's the best one available to us. End of discussion
McGeady - Drew fouls and kept the ball well, but some of his passes were wild at best when the simple option was on
Whelan - As you were. There's a reason Trapattoni starts him in every competitive game. I suspect he's a "Neil Lennon" player, you don't know what he brings to the side until he's not in it
Andrews - Solid alongside Whelan. When fit, first in the queue to partner the Stoke midfielder
Hunt - Gave too much space to Popov in the first half, didn't notice Popov in the second until a shot from the opposite wing. Will run into the ground for you. Still think he's best suited as an impact player
Cox - Robbed of a goal on his competitive debut. Not a lot else to say about it
Keane - Legend. End of discussion
Long - Came on and did little more than Cox, certainly not enough to suggest he should have started ahead of the West Brom striker
If you had offered me an away win on Friday, I would have ripped your arm off. Excellent defensive performance in the second half, which at 2-0 up is a luxury you can afford. We're in a good position going into the final round of qualifiers in the Autumn.
Well done, great result, and everything else. Now forget about it, the next qualifier is the most important one.
For the people who question the squad, the lineup and the dropouts, there's a reason Giovanni Trapattoni is an international football manager and we argue about international football on the internet.
Lets not fast forward the summer.
Not picking on your post, but don't see how we can.Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapAPony
We have feck all creativity from midfield, as the 2 main potential participants & Trap have currently declared their own 'formal separation'....
All as bad as each other in my book.
I'm not too fussed over the lack of fluidity. Apart from Armenia away & Russia at home (where we should / could have scored early) we have a great habit of getting goals early in games. We got lucky with the goals and the missed penno, but I think if this team needs to go looking for the lead they can get it - they usually do. When we're ahead, it's the other team's problem & we just do the boring stuff. It's quite a pragmatic way of looking at it.
All of the defenders had at least one brain fart tonight, bar Kelly maybe, but overall they were OK. O'Dea gave the ball away badly in the run up to the penalty, JOSH was caught unawares and KK and O'Dea conspired to let a high ball fall to Pandev, who handled it before scoring.
I was disappointed in Whelan. He's our best passer and he was very inaccurate. Andrews did well enough at the pressing game.
I can't believe McGeady hasn't been rated higher. He and Keane really looked like our only two outfield players who can play footy properly. Hunt doesn't look effective having to cross with his right, but I guess he was over that side to null their wide guy.
Functional win with some lucky breaks. I'd have done anything for that. 13 points from 6 - only the "elites" like Germany, Italy, Spain and Holland have more.
I didn't agree with Robbie being captain a few years back but he was a leader in every sense last night, and over the last few weeks.
Good callQuote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
Yep, that's exactly what I was thinking. Then Josh decided to whack a guy's nuts off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crosby87
I thought that too. One Hunt kick just missed the corner flag, going out in the "touch in goal" area. Delaney's idea to try and get some of the Leinster & Munster support on board?Quote:
Originally Posted by shakermaker1982
Just pre-empting the "Trap is a lucky manager" guff from Kelly & co.:
Yes, undoubtedly we got lucky breaks last night, but we do what we need to do, but not much more. All 4 goals scored against Macedonia have had an element of good fortune, but all 4 came early. If it was 0-0 after 65 mins who is to say we wouldn't have done what we did in Armenia? "We take the lead, the rest is up to them" is Trap's motto, apparently.
Keane's defection was lucky. Was it any more lucky than the (ceteris paribus) group changing goal that Russia got in Dublin? 3-2 instead of 2-2 has changed the group dramatically. Was the missed penno more lucky than the one missed against Russia, or the one that Robbie missed against Slovakia?
Eh? Qualification is qualification, doesn't matter a damn how you get there.Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
Plus it'd bring several million Euro into Irish football, which has to be a good thing.
Anyhow, great result, and a very good performance from a weakened side.
Trapatonni was talking about winning in Russia after the game last night which is great to hear. Beat Slovakia at home (which I expect us to do) and make that Russia game a winner takes all encounter. Pile the pressure on the Russians and see if they can handle it seems to be the Trap plan and I like it.
would be great to see a performance like in paris to go top of the group in russia.
I think this is the first time in a long time where we've had consensus on here.
Anyone else note that one of the Macedonian players was almost taking the penalty side by side with the penalty taker? I would have been disappointed if he scored and wasn't asked to take it again. Here's a still shot I took from my TV screen.
https://sites.google.com/site/kilcre...Macedonia.jpeg
Good spot. The ref had already made a visible move to get players behind the line. He was very picky & I reckon he may well have had it retaken. Technically, should it not have had to be retaken anyway?
Only the 2nd Macedonia player was in the box at the time, harsh on Ireland if it had to be retaken.
George noticed that at the time. And reckon it would have been retaken.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
From the rules though... hmmm...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penalty_kickQuote:
For infringements by the kicking team, should a goal be scored the kick is retaken, otherwise an indirect free kick is awarded against his side where the infringement occurred.
Also see the laws of the game Law 14...
http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/afdeveloping/refereeing/8.%20law%2014_559.pdf
Wouldn't agree; I assure you, Robbie never played under-age for NI and his eligibility is fully above-board. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
So we should have had a free out on the edge of our box?Quote:
Originally Posted by BonnieShels
Did anyone see/hear Stan on Sky? It was like a bad dream. For the first time ever I was glad when the ads came on. He was talking complete ******ology. Manuela wouldn't be able to tranlate his incoherent ramblings. Makes you appreciate Trap that much more.
Did not see it - but reading your post reminds me of the cold sweat running down my back when I heard his first press conference - a strategy essentially build on getting the water carrier back.