Clare League Season 2008/09

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Originally Posted by Clifford

are u kidding me, get on with it. its tough enough to go down to bridge with a good ref but that ref brosnan shouldn't be given third division games. he made a complete farce of the game. tempers were swaying on both sides and around the ground. it was lucky there wasn't a serious row or someone seriousy hurt. and its not sour grapes on our behalf. 2-1 down he gave avenue a pen to tie the game up 2-2. the worst decision i have ever seen. u would nearly consider packing it all in. like why bother training ur arse off twice a week, stay off the drink and or dont go out saturday night, for that ****. oh thats right we dont have enough refs so lets accept that below sub standard performance. most clubs in clare have improved their fields or structure, junior or schoolboy but the refs dont seem to have one bit.
apart from o'brien, sutton standard bearers one or two to a lesser degree are ok but some of the rest are shocking. why would u do it. is it for the love of the game? how many refs actually played soccer and have basic knowledge in it and its passion? you are held accountable for anything the ref writes in the report no matter how wrong, who holds them accountable? would the €48 that muppet got on sunday have any thing to do with it??????????????????? yes a handy €48 for 1 and half hours work. 3 or 4 games a week just short of €200 a week. so is it too much to ask that they are made improve. bo hoo the poor refs my arse.

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There has always been and will always be differant standards of refereeing and some of your comments are well wide of the mark. Being a former Referee myself who still watches a lot of local football, I know why I gave it up. The 2 referees that you mentioned as standard bearers are League of Ireland referees, neither of them I think played Junior Football which makes a mockery out of your quote "How many have actually played soccer". For the record... M. O'Holloran, J. Stanford, J. Dennieffe, D. McCarthy, A. Murphy and a couple of new refs have all played Junior Football.
The €48.00 match fee is a bit more than in my day, but still not enough for some of the comments and abuse directed at you on a continous basis.
You would also want to do your maths again. According to you, the referee got a handy €48.00 for 1 and a half hours work. What time did he leave home at and at what time did he return? I can only speak for myself but I would be gone from home at 9.45 or 10 depending where my first game was and would normally be home at 4.30 or later depending on my second game. What you seem to forget is that you only have to get organized for one game on a sunday wheras the referee normally has 2 games.
As old git has already broached the subject, how many former players have actually seriously thought about becoming refereees and listen to your physical condition, your parentage, your knowledge of the game etc, questioned on an ongoing basis.
I took up refereeing for the love of the game, it was several forms of the above that made me pack it in.
Every referee officiates to the best of his ability, if you are not satisfied with it get on to the League or the Referees Inspector.
I for one would not have liked my name broadcast on a website for everyone to have a pop, as unless you are aware, the referees are unable to reply themselves.

In fairness to the refs they get a lot of sh1t thrown at them every season.Sometimes get physically abused aswell.On sunday we played in terrible weather but at least we(the players) got to go home have a shower and put our feet up. The ref who was just as badly soaked then had to drive to Tulla to ref another match straight after.Plus there expected to get every offside call and every penalty claim spot on even though they dont have the help of professional linesmen.Is that possible??I think not.So instead of bitching bout the refs maybe players should stop d mouthing and diving and get on with the game.

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Originally Posted by Interested

There has always been and will always be differant standards of refereeing and some of your comments are well wide of the mark. Being a former Referee myself who still watches a lot of local football, I know why I gave it up. The 2 referees that you mentioned as standard bearers are League of Ireland referees, neither of them I think played Junior Football which makes a mockery out of your quote "How many have actually played soccer". For the record... M. O'Holloran, J. Stanford, J. Dennieffe, D. McCarthy, A. Murphy and a couple of new refs have all played Junior Football.
The €48.00 match fee is a bit more than in my day, but still not enough for some of the comments and abuse directed at you on a continous basis.
You would also want to do your maths again. According to you, the referee got a handy €48.00 for 1 and a half hours work. What time did he leave home at and at what time did he return? I can only speak for myself but I would be gone from home at 9.45 or 10 depending where my first game was and would normally be home at 4.30 or later depending on my second game. What you seem to forget is that you only have to get organized for one game on a sunday wheras the referee normally has 2 games.
As old git has already broached the subject, how many former players have actually seriously thought about becoming refereees and listen to your physical condition, your parentage, your knowledge of the game etc, questioned on an ongoing basis.
I took up refereeing for the love of the game, it was several forms of the above that made me pack it in.
Every referee officiates to the best of his ability, if you are not satisfied with it get on to the League or the Referees Inspector.
I for one would not have liked my name broadcast on a website for everyone to have a pop, as unless you are aware, the referees are unable to reply themselves.

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Should be nominated for post of the year :) Power to the Men In Black :)

Only 9 teams remain from Clare. 3 qualify for the 4th round open draw.

Rineanna vs Burren
Rhine or Bridge Utd vs Corofin or Mntshn
Lifford or Kilrush vs Bunratty

I expect Lifford, Corofin and Bridge to get thru this weekend. All close games to call though.

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Originally Posted by Jock MIB

Should be nominated for post of the year :) Power to the Men In Black :)

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Depending which team you are on the ref will be wrong 50% of the time. If players were up to the standard that they want the refs to be at ( 100% no mistakes) then they would be playing pro football. Players, managers, referees all make mistakes in every game, thats what makes it so much fun:D

The €48.00 match fee is a bit more than in my day, but still not enough for some of the comments and abuse directed at you on a continous basis.
You would also want to do your maths again. According to you, the referee got a handy €48.00 for 1 and a half hours work. What time did he leave home at and at what time did he return? I can only speak for myself but I would be gone from home at 9.45 or 10 depending where my first game was and would normally be home at 4.30 or later depending on my second game.

48 Euro is great money now matter what way you look at it. Ref should tell both Teams/Managers at the start of the game that any abuse towards him or anyone else will result in Red Card, First player to do it gets Red, that sould send out the message straight away. I understand that Ref has to travel to and from games but they also have to travel to their day Job, do they get paid for that, no.

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Originally Posted by smellyfeet

The €48.00 match fee is a bit more than in my day, but still not enough for some of the comments and abuse directed at you on a continous basis.
You would also want to do your maths again. According to you, the referee got a handy €48.00 for 1 and a half hours work. What time did he leave home at and at what time did he return? I can only speak for myself but I would be gone from home at 9.45 or 10 depending where my first game was and would normally be home at 4.30 or later depending on my second game.

48 Euro is great money now matter what way you look at it. Ref should tell both Teams/Managers at the start of the game that any abuse towards him or anyone else will result in Red Card, First player to do it gets Red, that sould send out the message straight away. I understand that Ref has to travel to and from games but they also have to travel to their day Job, do they get paid for that, no.

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Lets look at this objectively , if we take it that you leave home at 10am and return at 4.30pm that is 6.5hours . 48 euros / 6.5 = 7.38 euro per hour . This is less than minimum wage , not taking into account the fact it is on a Sunday.

However if it is 2 games in that 6.5 hour period it is 48 x 2 =96 /6.5 = 14.76 euro per hour. Still not a great rate for working on a Sunday.

4 teams x 11 palyers + 3 subs = 56 . So if each player is paying towards the referees fee it works out at €1.70 each to have their games officiated . To me this is a pitance to have a game on a Sunday , but to think that verbal abuse and sometimes physical threats can be part of this earning would not encourage me to become a referee. As for coming on here giving out about a referees performance and naming them while hiding behind a handle well thats just sad.

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Originally Posted by First

Lets look at this objectively , if we take it that you leave home at 10am and return at 4.30pm that is 6.5hours . 48 euros / 6.5 = 7.38 euro per hour . This is less than minimum wage , not taking into account the fact it is on a Sunday.

However if it is 2 games in that 6.5 hour period it is 48 x 2 =96 /6.5 = 14.76 euro per hour. Still not a great rate for working on a Sunday.

4 teams x 11 palyers + 3 subs = 56 . So if each player is paying towards the referees fee it works out at €1.70 each to have their games officiated . To me this is a pitance to have a game on a Sunday , but to think that verbal abuse and sometimes physical threats can be part of this earning would not encourage me to become a referee. As for coming on here giving out about a referees performance and naming them while hiding behind a handle well thats just sad.

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Hold on now,give the calculator a rest, i didn't have a go at or name any Ref, Just gave a insight, thats all.
My understanding is that they get paid while game is on, not paid for travelling as is the same as any day job.

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Originally Posted by smellyfeet

Hold on now,give the calculator a rest, i didn't have a go at or name any Ref, Just gave a insight, thats all.
My understanding is that they get paid while game is on, not paid for travelling as is the same as any day job.

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This wasn't directed totally at you, I know you haven't named any referee and were just giving your insight. As for the travelling most people when negotiating their salary will take travel costs into account. Not everyone is lucky enough to have work on their doorstep. I am sure that this is also taken into account by the referees when they do their travelling to officiate at 2 games on a Sunday. Do they receive mileage reimbursement from the Clare League ?. Anyway what ever way they calculate their fee it is a small amount per player and doesn't really merit verbal abuse being thrown at them because they are getting paid . Do you take it in your daily job , I don't think so.

It still boils down to " NO REFS , NO GAME "

Heard that a good few of the Rineanna lads are furious that the County Hurling Final is clashing with their local derby with league leaders Bunratty and also that 2 or 3 of them are going to head to Cusack Park instead which I don't believe. Are Newmarket still managerless going into Saturday's big game with Middleton or what's the story in the village?

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Originally Posted by talisman

Heard that a good few of the Rineanna lads are furious that the County Hurling Final is clashing with their local derby with league leaders Bunratty and also that 2 or 3 of them are going to head to Cusack Park instead which I don't believe. Are Newmarket still managerless going into Saturday's big game with Middleton or what's the story in the village?

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Its poor timing for this fixture alright , but it has been argued on this thread on numerous occasions, that the Clare league shouldn't be affected by the GAA. I would beleive that some of the Rineanna players will be in Cusack Park on Sunday , after all they nearly have enough points to be safe :).

To answer your second question , no Newmarket will not be managerless on Saturday. Things are ok in the village so don't go worrying about it too much :p

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Originally Posted by hacker

[/B]


rumour has it youv'e been approached to take over the team..any truth??:p

on a serious note its good to hear philip is still there he's a good coach and a nice guy..

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Truth is I had to turn it down , I have my eye on the Sligo Rovers job.;)

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Originally Posted by old git

clare league are always looking for new refs & ideas .. would you be intrested in becoming a ref.. we have all had goes at refs on here even when i played there were some terrible refs .. but you just have to get on with it .. in fairness they are doing their best and without them ( bad or not) we would have no soccer in clare at all .. p.s. what would you class as a good weekly wage to get abused / sworn at 3-4 times a week for 90 mins .. :D

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raise it up to 60 euro per game? 5 games is 300 a week i know its a lot of work but i am sure martin and whoever would be well up for that they can meet with clare league (fixtures from april to sept is 26 weeks let them choose the six week breaks) the mats is around 6000 for two refs, average panel say 16 thats 37.50 per player for refs give that straight to the CDSL pre season and let them pay the two boys weekly or monthly or at the end of season, this leaves the hassle of looking for lads to paay the 5 euro or watever a week for the refs?i have thought of it before but i dont drive so refing is kinda out the question, ill get back to ya when i pass my driving test ha ha http://foot.ie/images/icons/icon9.gif i am only throwing out ideas to better the league have you got any ideas mate, wats your prediction for the league this season??

I have been sitting on the sideline for a long time and following the foot.ie blog, but when I see what "celts 1888" and "clifford" write about the game on Sunday its time to get off the fence. Don't know what game both were at but from what I saw, and spoke to the ref after the game, the first penalty was for tripping the attacker using the hip. The second bridge goal was because the ball was last played by a defender back to another defender which meant the attacker could not be offside. The Avenue peno was for a push in the back just as the attacker went to head the ball back into the area and the sending off was for a second yellow card. Celts1888 wants the same two refs all season and he doesn't know what he is talking about! Who would want that job! I certainly would pity any ref stupid enough to land himself in that one. Can clifford name a ref who has not sent off that same player? You were beaten fair and square, and as Iluvfootie and your own captain told ye on sunday "get on with the game" and lets try looking at our selves in the mirror when we lose a game, not that we did! He he!

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Originally Posted by smellyfeet

Hold on now,give the calculator a rest, i didn't have a go at or name any Ref, Just gave a insight, thats all.
My understanding is that they get paid while game is on, not paid for travelling as is the same as any day job.

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Unless the criteria has changed there is a standard match fee of €24.00 plus an Urban travel allowance of €18.00 (for a round trip of 25 miles) any milage over the 25 miles is 72c per mile. Premier games are €6.00 more (which is where the €48.00 comes in).
So just to correct your mis-understanding smellyfeet, there is a match fee plus a travel allowance.
Hope this helps.

, and spoke to the ref after the game, the first penalty was for tripping the attacker using the hip. The second bridge goal was because the ball was last played by a defender back to another defender which meant the attacker could not be offside. The Avenue peno was for a push in the back just as the attacker went to head the ball back into the area and the sending off was for a second yellow card. Celts1888 wants the same two refs all season and he doesn't know what he is talking about! Who would want that job! I certainly would pity any ref stupid enough to land himself in that one. Can clifford name a ref who has not sent off that same player? You were beaten fair and square, and as Iluvfootie and your own captain told ye on sunday "get on with the game" and lets try looking at our selves in the mirror when we lose a game, not that we did! He he![/quote]

1. "tripping the attacker using the hip"- surely thats wat you call standing your ground- otherwise the likes of vidic and skrtle carvalho would be cleaning kicking people out of night clubs for a living
2. the avenue penalty was only given because the ref knew he had made errors, clearly was not a penalty
3. how is a forward pass directed to the player not offside if a defender tries to intervene the pass with a slide
4. as for the red crd well i am not suprised but in all fairness he has always been singled out, not that i am trying to defend him
5. get back on the fence unless you can disagree with these valid points
6. the ref thing is only an idea is that wat were here for try help this league,

1...tripping attacker with foot / hip / knee / arm are all penaltys.. but sometimes refs do not always give them
2. cant comment as did not see
3. forward pass if defender gets a touch with a slide unfortunatly attacking players then onside .
4. cant comment again as did not see incident.

Rule 11 Offside

It is not an offence in itself to be in an offside position.[/FONT][/SIZE][/LEFT]
A player is in an offside position if:
• he is nearer to his opponents’ goal line than both the ball and the
second last opponent
A player is not in an offside position if:
• he is in his own half of the field of play or
• he is level with the second last opponent or
• he is level with the last two opponents

Offence

A player in an offside position is only penalised if, at the moment the
ball touches or is played by one of his team, he is, in the opinion of
the referee, involved in active play by:
• interfering with play or
• interfering with an opponent or
• gaining an advantage by being in that position

Now if i have read this right,

the player has played the ball and it struck an opponent then gone to is fellow player who is in an offside position then the Player has gained an advantage from being in that Position so he is offside

Now if it is

The player slides into a tackle and the ball goes to an opponent in an offside position without touching the player tackled then the Opponent is not offside as the ball had not been touched or played by his fellow player, if it had struck the player tackled as the ball has touched him then the player is deemed to have gained advantage from being in that position so is offside

Now you see why we have hard time calling offside :-)

Sorry Old Git edited your post by mistake i was using qoute from your earlier post

Jock mIB

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Originally Posted by Jock MIB

Rule 11 Offside

It is not an offence in itself to be in an offside position.[/FONT][/SIZE][/LEFT]
A player is in an offside position if:
• he is nearer to his opponents’ goal line than both the ball and the
second last opponent
A player is not in an offside position if:
• he is in his own half of the field of play or
• he is level with the second last opponent or
• he is level with the last two opponents

Offence

A player in an offside position is only penalised if, at the moment the
ball touches or is played by one of his team, he is, in the opinion of
the referee, involved in active play by:
• interfering with play or
• interfering with an opponent or
• gaining an advantage by being in that position

Now if i have read this right,

the player has played the ball and it struck an opponent then gone to is fellow player who is in an offside position then the Player has gained an advantage from being in that Position so he is offside

Now if it is

The player slides into a tackle and the ball goes to an opponent in an offside position without touching the player tackled then the Opponent is not offside as the ball had not been touched or played by his fellow player, if it had struck the player tackled as the ball has touched him then the player is deemed to have gained advantage from being in that position so is offside

Now you see why we have hard time calling offside :-)

Sorry Old Git edited your post by mistake i was using qoute from your earlier post

Jock mIB

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no problem jock ... i remember when the offside rule was easy and it ain't that long ago :D

""Conversely, a player who is in an offside position when the ball is touched or played by a team-mate may potentially commit an offside offence even if he runs back in to an on-side position before receiving the ball. This potential remains until another player touches or plays the ball and offside position is reevaluated, or the ball goes out of play, or an opponent makes A CONTROLLED PLAY ON THE BALL."" i think that5 raps that up