Eligibility Rules, Okay

Is 'The Fly' now a convincing 'double agent' ??
:rolleyes:
Or his account sabotaged?
:confused:

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Originally Posted by Predator

What exactly is this 'have your cake and eat it' attitude that annoys you?

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I suspect it's to do with Irish nationals who qualify to play for the IFA by virtue of possessing official British citizenship (whether personally acknowledged or not) being content to represent the IFA for careerist reasons before declaring for the FAI for reasons of national identity. I don't think it's as black and white as calling it a 'having your cake and eating it' attitude, mind. The right is there under FIFA's current legal framework to play for one association for whom you're eligible before switching once to another for whom you're also eligible. According to FIFA, the regulations are operating satisfactorily and as intended. Also, the relationship between these players selected by the IFA is a two-way one; it's not a one-way relationship with benefits flowing in one direction only as the idiom would suggest. There's also the issue of players growing up within the IFA's system and remaining there for a time for reasons of geography/convenience/the IFA having first encountered them and offered them a place in a squad before they'd fully matured, realised or developed their identity, and so forth.

I find there to be a sort of 'have your cake and eat it' attitude on the part of some NI fans. How prevalent it is, I'm not sure. I'm not accusing the likes of NB or GR of possessing it either; they clearly don't. I've frequently encountered it online and even over the radio, however. Nationalists are expected by these firebrands to demonstrate allegiance to, or at least take an interest in, NI. Otherwise, they are branded as bitter and sectarian. This is in spite of the inherently British nature of and symbolism that surrounds the NI team. Nationalists, by and large, don't take an interest in that, not because they are necessarily bitter or sectarian, but due to the fact this British entity/these British symbols are an irrelevance; their national identity is represented by something else entirely. Defensive appeals to the IFA's 'Football for All' campaign are also misguided in so far as it is self-evident such a programme, no matter how well-intentioned (credit where credit is due and all that), isn't doing enough to make the nationalist community feel like the IFA are relevant to them. Whether it ever can is another thing and it's not really my business, but this derogatory branding of nationalists whose interests legitimately lie elsewhere is irritating.

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Originally Posted by Predator

What exactly is this 'have your cake and eat it' attitude that annoys you?

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The inferred notion that players can do what they like, when they like and that the IFA should just bend over and take it up the chuff.

It's a minor irritation - no more, no less.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

a sort of 'have your cake and eat it' attitude on the part of some NI fans

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I like the new direction this thread is taking, actually. And thanks to whoever it was calling me the Voice of Reason above :o

Off to watch the currently all-conquering* NI Women's team next week. Any er, scouts in the Antwerp or Brussels region very welcome. I understand Mlles Lennon and McGuinness among others will be in the squad...

* wins over Bulgaria and surprisingly Norway thus far, plus a creditable draw in Hungary. As I expect Geysir will confirm, Iceland remain favorites to qualify- a couple of our girls play over there.

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Originally Posted by Gather round

And thanks to whoever it was calling me the Voice of Reason above :o

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I'm sure that the 'Voice of Reason' tag was made in a relative context :)

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Originally Posted by Gather round

I like the new direction this thread is taking, actually. And thanks to whoever it was calling me the Voice of Reason above :o

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Whoaa..........'major contributor from the Norn Iron perspective' and 'I'm not accusing the likes of NB or GR of possessing it either' ('it' being a 'have your cake and eat it' attitude), does not equate to being called the Voice or Reason.

Foot.ie tip lads - if GR gets to you, pay him a compliment. He loses all sense of perspective.

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

Is 'The Fly' now a convincing 'double agent' ??
:rolleyes:
Or his account sabotaged?
:confused:

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It's my alter-ego Mr. MacPhisto.

First person to get the reference gets a 'Thanks.'
(A Thanks from The Fly is hard to come by btw - just look at my stats. I don't give them out willy-nilly)

Actually Great Rotundo is just after your cake...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8dBo-GcrXU

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Originally Posted by The Fly

It's my alter-ego Mr. MacPhisto.

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I want to see Mirror Ball Man.

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Originally Posted by Not Brazil

What remains is for the IFA to develop a strategy that ensures, as far as possible, that their resources are used to develop young players who have a desire to represent Northern Ireland throughout their International career.

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And if such a strategy is employed by the IFA from early years projects onwards, then it would be incumbent on the Stormont executive ministers responsible to make important decisions regarding the acceptability of the IFA in providing (heavily taxpayer funded) services that are intended for the benefit of the whole community in the north.

The Education Department is currently funding 30 IFA Primary Schools Coaches to the tune of £3 million over two years. If the IFA have developed a strategy that will target only those youngsters who are likely to have a desire to play for the north in later years, then clearly the IFA are not the organisation to be in charge of providing this service, and control would need to be taken back by the Education department. It would seem insane to have an organisation like the IFA in charge of aspects of youth sport provision if their goal is to bypass schools, areas etc.. that will potentially develop the next McClean, Duffy, Gibson, George or Kearns.

Likewise with IFA grassroots development officers who are funded by local councils. If these people have an IFA remit only to develop the footballing skills of those teenagers who they deem likely to be loyal, then clearly councils would need to reassess their funding to the IFA.

Off course the IFA can do whatever it likes with any money it has in its own coffers, but its clear that if their remit across the board, including early years and teenage development is to target particular young players, from particular areas or schools, then they are not the organisation to be providing heavily subsidised services meant to benefit the whole community.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

I want to see Mirror Ball Man.

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That only happens in threads with an American connection.

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Originally Posted by gastric

So, wanting 18/19 year olds to make a decision about their future is not wanting to change the CAS ruling? Presently, a player of any age can play for Ireland. How can you suggest this is not trying to change the CAS Agreement?

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I do not seek to change the CAS ruling.

I do not seek to deny the right of Citizens of the Republic Of Ireland to play for the Republic of Ireland.

I know that a player of any age can play for the Republic Of Ireland.

CAS rulings and FIFA Statutes do not dictate which eligible players the IFA select to represent them...merely that they are eligible.

I want the IFA to focus on selecting and developing players who want their long term International career to be with Northern Ireland.

In your anger, you're starting to bark up wrong trees.

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

Why?

In any other walk of Life people have relative freedom to choose.
Until they get a full competitive cap it's up to them. Even FIFA agree.
End of.

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You miss the point too - but that's not surprising.

We know about freedom of choice, FIFA rules etc.

Freedom of choice also extends to the which eligible players that IFA wishes to select to represent them.

Sinking in yet?

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Originally Posted by co. down green

The Education Department is currently funding 30 IFA Primary Schools Coaches to the tune of £3 million over two years. If the IFA have developed a strategy that will target only those youngsters who are likely to have a desire to play for the north in later years, then clearly the IFA are not the organisation to be in charge of providing this service, and control would need to be taken back by the Education department. It would seem insane to have an organisation like the IFA in charge of aspects of youth sport provision if their goal is to bypass schools, areas etc.. that will potentially develop the next McClean, Duffy, Gibson, George or Kearns.

Likewise with IFA grassroots development officers who are funded by local councils. If these people have an IFA remit only to develop the footballing skills of those teenagers who they deem likely to be loyal, then clearly councils would need to reassess their funding to the IFA.

Off course the IFA can do whatever it likes with any money it has in its own coffers, but its clear that if their remit across the board, including early years and teenage development is to target particular young players, from particular areas or schools, then they are not the organisation to be providing heavily subsidised services meant to benefit the whole community.

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And if such a strategy were to be employed by the IFA in distributing this finance, then they could also potentially lose out on the next Lennon, McCourt or McGinn. It would be inherently apparent to those receiving this level of football schooling (and those not) that the intention existed in the IFA to alienate the nationalist school-goers, when further alienation is the last thing they should be afforded by the IFA if they actually sought to implement a positive, proactive and inclusive approach. There would also be political implications.

What do you think is the likelihood of such strategic utilisation of funds and is there any evidence of it occurring?

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Originally Posted by co. down green

And if such a strategy is employed by the IFA from early years projects onwards, then it would be incumbent on the Stormont executive ministers responsible to make important decisions regarding the acceptability of the IFA in providing (heavily taxpayer funded) services that are intended for the benefit of the whole community in the north.

The Education Department is currently funding 30 IFA Primary Schools Coaches to the tune of £3 million over two years.

If the IFA have developed a strategy that will target only those youngsters who are likely to have a desire to play for the north in later years, then clearly the IFA are not the organisation to be in charge of providing this service, and control would need to be taken back by the Education department. It would seem insane to have an organisation like the IFA in charge of aspects of youth sport provision if their goal is to bypass schools, areas etc.. that will potentially develop the next McClean, Duffy, Gibson, George or Kearns.

Likewise with IFA grassroots development officers who are funded by local councils. If these people have an IFA remit only to develop the footballing skills of those teenagers who they

deem likely to be loyal, then clearly councils would need to reassess their funding to the IFA.

Off course the IFA can do whatever it likes with any money it has in its own coffers, but its clear that if their remit across the board, including early years and teenage development is to
target particular young players, from particular areas or schools, then they are not the organisation to be providing heavily subsidised services meant to benefit the whole community.

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That made me laugh - particularly in the context of sports association funding in Northern Ireland.

The IFA have, and always will have, the freedom of choice to select who they want to represent them.

I am talking about players of 18 and above, playing representative football.

However, good luck with blocking the funding.:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Not Brazil

I want the IFA to focus on selecting and developing players who want their long term International career to be with Northern Ireland.

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That would be a fairly equitable policy to promote on one hand because it would see the players that do harbour the ambitions of representing the IFA having a greater chance of doing so. But, realistically, there are far too many variables to take into account that would obstruct this policy.

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Originally Posted by dantheman

This is absolutely true, however its also applies in reverse. The FAI must also adopt a similar policy, which included training camps in Northern Ireland (by proxy would be better).

There has been a long, boring and tiring campaign by OWC fans to portray the actions of the FAI as sectarian. To remove this slur completely some of these camps should be in loyalist areas of the north.

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There will be no official FAI training camps on the territory of the IFA.

Not in Nationalist areas, not in Loyalist areas , not in mixed areas and not in areas where people don't care much for that kind of stuff.

Official FAI camps will be held on the territory of the FAI, funded by the taxpayers of the Republic Of Ireland, where Govt funding is required.

Hope that clears any doubt up on that issue.:D

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Originally Posted by Olé Olé

That would be a fairly equitable policy to promote on one hand because it would see the players that do harbour the ambitions of representing the IFA having a greater chance of doing so. But, realistically, there are far too many variables to take into account that would obstruct this policy.

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Not really.

At Under 19 level, players should know where their dream/heart/loyalties sit.

Those who side with the FAI should pursue that path at that time, with the blessing of the IFA.

If it doesn't work out with the FAI, for whatever reason, the option to switch to the IFA is always there.

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Originally Posted by The Fly

The suggestion that the FAI should establish training camps in Northern Ireland is contentious to say the least, but the notion that they should be held in Loyalist areas is just insane.

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Insanely funny, all the same.:D

I don't expect to see any "Loyalists" representing the FAI anytime soon.