On a side note, looking at that squad, thank **** we have O'Shea.
On a side note, looking at that squad, thank **** we have O'Shea.
I am not sure where you got that stat from but I looked it up on 'my stat site' and it says he only has one assist (Same as Glenn Whelan). Now the site could be wrong but 1 sounds more likely than 3 to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
If Trap were going to go for the man with the most exists he would have gone for Long, but Trap is never one for such obvious tactics, he knows the value of the element of surprise.
When the German manager looks at our squad he will be as baffled and confused as many here. He will be full of fear and trepidation wondering what Trap is up to, that same fear will spread to his squad.
Round 1 to Trap, it's as good as a goal start for us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Murfinator
I wonder what the odds on us getting beat 11-1 are?
I too would probably have started Long instead of Walter or indeed started them both.
From a statistical point of view Walters (2nd) is actually above Long (3rd) in the stats I looked at, albeit only marginally
90 v 100. (Wilson is 1st at no. 50). I am not to sure why, Long has 2 goals and 2 assists, Walters 1 of each.
The only area Walters is ahead in is in passes par game (26 v 13).
Oh there is one other area, the one which probably clinched it for Trap, aerial battle won, 3.9 v 1.
Ward V Wilson is a trickier one, however last season they were within a point of each other, all the
above stats are based on the 7 or so games this season so a bit unreliable. Ward had a better pass rate
77% v 65%.
I am pretty happy with Coleman over Kelly, Coleman has impressed me on a number of a occasions not
least very recently when he got pass 2 players and put a good cross in IIRC.
It also depends on us holding them or still being in the game at least if/when he is introduced. Id much prefer having him start and try to nick something to hold on to maybe, little point throwing him in when the game is gone, as lets face it, it could well be if the recent Spain/Italy/Croatia games are any guide. But we can hope ....Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
[QUOTE=tricky_colour;1634541]I am not sure where you got that stat from but I looked it up on 'my stat site' and it says he only has one assist (Same as Glenn Whelan). Now the site could be wrong but 1 sounds more likely than 3 to me.
If Trap were going to go for the man with the most exists he would have gone for Long, but Trap is never one for such obvious tactics, he knows the value of the element of surprise.
When the German manager looks at our squad he will be as baffled and confused as many here. He will be full of fear and trepidation wondering what Trap is up to, that same fear will spread to his squad.
And then the Germans laughed! " Fis is a very funny joke, ya. ' Ze Irish team is like their economy - baffling and confusing.' ' Ze know nooothing!' ;)
Have to say I have no expectations (or excitement) for this match whatsoever, kind of expecting something similar to the Russia match at home. I hope I'm wrong.
I think my excitement is rooted in the prospect of the unknown. I have similarly low expectations but it adds to the sense of having nothing to lose, so I'm simply hoping what is a rather novel and inexperienced selection - albeit forced and not entirely to my favour - rise to the occasion and give it a right go. In a way, the Russia match in Moscow was certainly exciting!Quote:
Originally Posted by theworm2345
So no Given, Dunne, Duff or Keane.
Welcome to the future...
Tonight will reveal a lot if nothing else.
A draw would be a miracle. The Guardian had an article on the Germans yesterday and mentioned some disharmony within the squad but Low was pretty calm about it. They'd have to be in complete disarray for them to not tear us a new one.
I'd have preferred Coleman at RM with Kelly in at RB. Ward shouldn't be allowed near an Irish squad until he learns how to defend.
Damage limitation is the best we can realistically aim for.
Ireland 0 Germany 2
i got it from the premierQuote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
league's fantasy football site. they've credited him with three assists, against Wigan, Man City and Swansea. Whelan has two, against Reading and Swansea
With no offence meant to O'Shea, he is certainly stating the bleeding obvious in this article!
http://www.independent.ie/breaking-n...t-3257316.html
Interesting to note that the first thing many people see is something to moan about, rather than appreciate the biggest shift in Trap's tenure.
I'm really looking forward to this game.
For me the plusses are competitive starts for Coleman and McCarthy and in all probability they will be part of the team for the next 8 to 10 years.
Not just for those 2 players, but what they bring to the team, that what has been missing.
Added to that, this is the first time we have 3 at CM, with 2 of them being technically capable players.
Cox is also technically gifted and versatile, he could be the type of player we need to get us out of pigeon hole, player role mentality.
Splitting hairs with Walters up front instead of Long, we'll see how it works, both players have their merits.
Having Long as a sub is a potent choice to throw into the game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
Interesting!! I have found the site (I think), this is the page:-
http://www.premierleague.com/en-gb/p...nathan-walters
It now says he has 4 assists!! and 2 goals.
The site I looked at was
http://www.whoscored.com/Players/3860
That gives him 1 goal and 1 assist!! Quite big discrepancy!!
I would be more inclined to believe the premier league site though as I expect people check their players are being awarded all their points.
So lies dammed lies and statistics!!
Mind you another site I looked at only gives him 1 goal two.
A third site gives him 2 goals but one is in the Carling Cup, it also lists an Ireland game, so maybe that is included as well.
Kazakhstan 1 - 2 Ireland
Stoke 3 - 4 Swindon (Walters scores 1)
So he has either 2 or 3 more assists perhaps coming from those games.
Now Ward provided an assist V Kazakhstan and the other goal was a Keane penalty for a foul on Keane
so no more assists there. So the 2 or 3 assists must have came from the other game, he can't have got 3 assists as he scored one of them!! Had a look at that game and he may have got 1 assist but not 2. Can be 100% sure Walters
provided a cross but it looks like him on the poor quality video.
The site I look at original only includes Premiership games (I think).
close, but I got it from here: http://fantasy.premierleague.com/sta...filter=assistsQuote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
Still has him on 3 assists, same site (well same premierleague.com domain), but different values
I had a look at Squawka as well: http://www.squawka.com/players/jonathan-walters (click total chances created)Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
and they only list one assist as well, with 7 key passes
The plus side is that he may actually go with 3 central midfielders, i think this is the only way we'll compete in the future. Ward for me is probably the 3rd choice left back, poor performances obviously dont get you dropped. I'm wary of Coleman at full back, would liked to have seen him on the right side of midfield with McGeady on the left. Happy with O'Shea at centre half, much prefer a Dunne-O'Shea partnership going forward. Cox is an ok player but it must be obvious that he's miles behind Shane Long. Playing a 4-5-1 incorporating McClean, Dunne and Ciaran Clark/Marc Wilson would offer some hope.
The usual doom and gloom on here I see.
We will get at least a point tonight.
In Mr Trapattoni and the lads we trust.
In recent games its been St Ledger carrying and covering for Dunne.Quote:
Originally Posted by bishbash
It's St Ledger with Dunne/OShea for me
Well, I had a dream last night that we beat them 3-0. Of course, the last time I had a dream like that, we won the World Cup too.Quote:
Originally Posted by the doc
Agreed, no shortage of confidence eitherQuote:
Originally Posted by the doc
I don't think Dunne and O'Shea will be doing much going forward at their ages. Ward is in the side because he is quick and a reasonable defender.Quote:
Originally Posted by bishbash
Critics of Trap's conservatism appear not to have noticed that this is the most attacking pair of full backs we've put on the same pitch since Carr and Phelan played together under McCarthy over a decade ago.
Yes it has been noted by some. Trap always speaks of balance. So why has he done this now? Why go with 2 attacking full backs in a game of this importance? WHy not in a friendly? Why go for it against one of the best teams in the World, when we are already so weak in defense?
Trap does not believe we are going to be able match them in football and score more - to make up for our weak defence - so why has he done this now? WHy not go with conservatism as usual and hope for the best and scrape a draw?
Hey Trigger!Quote:
Originally Posted by strangeirish
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ls5...e_gdata_player
The more attacking full-backs balances out three in the middle, while Cox (possibly) tucking inside to join Walters means a more attacking RB would have space to exploit. That's my reading anyhow. Definitely a gamble given we're not sure on Coleman's defensive ability, but it's not entirely unbalanced.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
Because playing three in midfield takes away a lot of our natural width, meaning the full backs have to provide more going forward and need more speed/stamina to get up and down the line constantly. The most interesting part will be seeing where McGeady fits in.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
I don't think that makes any difference really, the point is why are we more attack minded, even with your formation, with the 2 wider midfielders supporting both full backs and mccarthy most likely sitting deep in the middle, we are still very attack minded.
There are still some papers reporting a 4-4-2. I will be very sceptical if that proves correct.
I see Trap seeing this as a win win for him under all scenarios. A double win if we lose. A triple win if we got a draw. Its certainly a bit near to try this out where a hammering is possible.
As regards Mcgeady i see him running horizonal rather than vertical tonight!!
It's more attacking because we have faster, more attack-minded players in the team.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
I still don't get your logic that Trap will be delighted if we lose the match.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
Fantasy site awards the points as per midnight the night of the game. The likes of the dubious goals committee etc doesn't change it so I'd say that's where the discrepancy come from.
Would sooner have Long in personally but it's a far tighter call then the media and a lot of people are making out. Long has 2 golas in the league and has been sub or been subbed on a number of occasions, he's not banging them in every week. I think Trap always intended bring Long on when the game stretched a bit, I think he'd have been brought on before Walters had Keane been fit, I don't buy this theory that he's suddenly 4th or 5th in the pecking order. Horses for courses seems to be Traps MO.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetsujin1979
Interesting thanks for those, n doubt I will be quoting from them in future!
It seems to be pretty much what was the Actim index, which I thought they had stopped producing.
Just had another look for it, and found this
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/stats/a...onship?cc=5739
Which is an index for the Championship and very interesting it is too, the much-maligned Andy Keogh with 5 assists,
Well ahead of Simon Cox on 2.
Really hoping Fahy and McCarthy step up tonight. It will be up to Andrews to get involved from the off and get the other 2 lads up and running.
Need a big performance from the erratic McGeady. If he has one of those dozy nights, we'll have very few options to alleviate pressure down the wing with Duff gone.
Anyone recall Walters 15 minute cameo at home in the last qualifiers?? Albania ?? When he's in the zone, he's one of the best retainers of posession in the Premiership. He's used to being isolated and scrapping for posession for Stoke. I think Trapp has got this right on the requirements of this game and if we are going with 4-5-1.
Long is a quality player but when he wins the ball, he has a tendency to take on players and run into the channel. He doesn't lay it off as much.
I think Trapp wants the possession won and then fed on to a team mate. Walters does this for Stoke very well.
Thanks Christ there appear to be some semblance of tactical effort to keep the ball for more than 10 seconds.
Well said Wolf hopefully Fahey and McCarthy can knock the ball around a bit tonight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfie
Sold out according to the FAI.
hopefully to fans willing to put their dislike of the manager to one side and get behind the team like never before....Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
All said - I really hope McCarthy, Andrews and Fahy are not reduced to spectators as the ball is hoofed high and far above their heads. There's not much a 3 man midfield can do if the ball spends most of the time in the air!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by the bear
Everyone will be up for it. It would be nice to get one over on the landlords. Can't waitQuote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
The germans will be fuming to see Klose and in particular Podolski start who they do not rate very highly at all. Think we might have got off the hook a little to avoid having to face Kroos, Muller and particularly the in form Gotze though no doubt he'll be sprung from the bench if they need him.
Of whos playing, Reus is the man to fear, Ozil and Schweinstieger are both in shaky form. Reus is on fire, think he has 4 goals in his last 3.
I saw a lot of the papers today labeling Schmelzer as inexperienced and a potential weak link, I'd say thats nonsense and he's a very dangerous attacking fullback who could lay down a statement here.
Hard to call the extent of just how much Germany will win by tonight, I don't anticipate any other outcome but think our showing could range from positive and something to build from to a decapitation from having so little experience. We'll learn a lot about this formation and the fringe players ability to step up, that's for certain.
Check ticketmaster. Match sold out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
He's playing the players and formation people have been bleating about so there is absolutely zero reason for anyone to complain, it'd say a lot about the character of our supporters if they did anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
You think most Irish fans want Cox as right winger? Or even Ward at left full? Not trying to be facetious but there isn't one over-arcing "Irish fans position". Most people want different things, and who are you to say they can't complain about team selection/tactics?Quote:
Originally Posted by Murfinator
All I want is players playing in position, mostly.