16 Team Premier Division / Winter Season from 2012/13 TODAY'S DAILY MAIL

Why are people saying the clubs think this will be a panacea? It's far more likely that they think it's just a small step in the right direction. To dress it otherwise is tending towards the hysterical.

And some of the arguments I've read about how terrible winter football is are very amusing. You'd almost think we didn't have a league running here in winter for the best part of a century. Or that football didn't become the country's biggest spectator sport with almost every league playing through the winter.

A lot of fuss about very little really.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mr A

Why are people saying the clubs think this will be a panacea? It's far more likely that they think it's just a small step in the right direction. To dress it otherwise is tending towards the hysterical.

And some of the arguments I've read about how terrible winter football is are very amusing. You'd almost think we didn't have a league running here in winter for the best part of a century. Or that football didn't become the country's biggest spectator sport with almost every league playing through the winter.

A lot of fuss about very little really.

---

Why is it even a small step in the right direction? Is there any evidence that, overall, it will be any way beneficial to the League?

Its a sideways step IMO.

The one concrete near fact is that our European performances will be negatively impacted. Its highly likely they will be even more negatively impacted by the decreased wages in the League, but winter football won't improve it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

The one concrete near fact is that our European performances will be negatively impacted. Its highly likely they will be even more negatively impacted by the decreased wages in the League, but winter football won't improve it.

---

Any concrete facts around how european performances actually benefit the league in total?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Macy

Any concrete facts around how european performances actually benefit the league in total?

---

Or even how they've benefitted the clubs themselves?

Best performers in europe in the last 7 years; Cork, Derry, Shels, Pats, Drogheda. Only Pats haven't been relegated and our European runs haven't added many to the gate (if any at all)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Macy

Any concrete facts around how european performances actually benefit the league in total?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dodge

Or even how they've benefitted the clubs themselves?

Best performers in europe in the last 7 years; Cork, Derry, Shels, Pats, Drogheda. Only Pats haven't been relegated and our European runs haven't added many to the gate (if any at all)

---

I've got a lot of quality photos and I'm still paying the bills...... but I've yet to see one reason to justify changing season.

Surely the onus is on those requesting the change to demonstrate why its beneficial rather than the other way around?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

Surely the onus is on those requesting the change to demonstrate why its beneficial rather than the other way around?

---

It could have been argued before the last change as well, but we are where we are now with summer football. I think there are few compelling arguments to be made for the advantage of one over the other, so for that reason I'd say we should leave it alone.

Suppose the positives will be the fact you wont be competing with GAA. Also the organisation of the Setanta cup should be a lot easier.

Outside of that I fail to see how else it would benefit the league moving from Summer to Winter.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

Suppose the positives will be the fact you wont be competing with GAA. Also the organisation of the Setanta cup should be a lot easier.

Outside of that I fail to see how else it would benefit the league moving from Summer to Winter.

---

Tha GAA don't play on Friday evenings though, so I don't think the competition is as much as some people say it is. It's probably too much to ask of Pineapple Stu to compare the attendances during weekends with GAA to the other weekends, but I doubt there'd be too much of a significat difference when you take into account that the non-GAA games take place away from the key beginning and end of season periods.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

Suppose the positives will be the fact you wont be competing with GAA. Also the organisation of the Setanta cup should be a lot easier.

---

Or World Cups, or having a mid season break. And the fact that crowds are better at the start and end of the season when the weather is generally worse.

The reason why it should be the summer side justifying the retention is that it was a move from the traditional season that had served us relatively well (we'd survived that long anyway!) up until the move. Summer season is still a break from the norm. The assumptions about it being direct competition from UK football, and the weather being bad have turned out to be false - crowds are down during the UK close season, when the weather is at it's best. A winter season won't be a panacea or a silver bullet - it will be back to the traditional times were the clubs obviously feel they can maximise support they have.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

I've got a lot of quality photos and I'm still paying the bills...... but I've yet to see one reason to justify changing season.

Surely the onus is on those requesting the change to demonstrate why its beneficial rather than the other way around?

---

Why that's true, in this case you're using Europe as a reason to stay in Summer. I'm saying that European results haven't helped the league so its pointless bringing it up.

I'm not in charge of any club but I prefer Winter football. I'll still go in summer

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by peadar1987

It's probably too much to ask of Pineapple Stu to compare the attendances during weekends with GAA to the other weekends

---

Yes; yes it is. :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dodge

Or even how they've benefitted the clubs themselves?

Best performers in europe in the last 7 years; Cork, Derry, Shels, Pats, Drogheda. Only Pats haven't been relegated and our European runs haven't added many to the gate (if any at all)

---

So are you hoping you will snatch that final euro place this weekend or not, or does it matter?

Its enjoyable for fans yeah. Might bring in the odd shilling in the short term.

Hasn't helped us bring in any fans

I've no preference for summer or winter football. I was surprised it came up as an issue though.
On the subject anyways, one argument put forward for summer football is European results. TNS of Wales seemed to get on ok against Boh's this summer. Pre-season training usually lasts 4-6 weeks? If there was a mid-July start, sides in Europe could get back training in early June.
On possible poor crowds in Winter. Magner's league games get good crowds in Winter. GAA Junior, Intermediate and Senior club Provincial and All-Ireland series games get good crowds as well despite the time of year and the conditions. It comes down to the games and the level of interest. I'm not sure the time of year matters all that much and attendances will go up or down either way.
For the A Championship, a move to winter football might be best. If clubs want to apply, it'd be easier to join in the summer and if they want to leave the A Championship, it's easier to leave in the spring/summer and drop into whatever league in the summer/autumn.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by legendz

For the A Championship, a move to winter football might be best. If clubs want to apply, it'd be easier to join in the summer and if they want to leave the A Championship, it's easier to leave in the spring/summer and drop into whatever league in the summer/autumn.

---

It's much easier to get players to sign for your A Championship side in the current setup than it would be if it was ran during the winter imo.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dodge

Its enjoyable for fans yeah. Might bring in the odd shilling in the short term.

Hasn't helped us bring in any fans

---

I have a mate from England who went to the Elfsborgs game, has now been back twice since, bought a replica shirt, drunk in McDowells and considers himself a Pats fan.

I worry he is the sole exception to prove the rule, though.

Performing well seems to be dismissed or seen as something that should be seen as a bonus. I guess it is a bonus in someways but performing in Europe is surely important for the promotion of the league. There have been good results here and there but no club have consistently done well. Boh's missed a good chance this season to have a good-run to the Europa League play-offs. Good results over a few years, it doesn't necessarily have to be group stage qualification but knocking on the door would raise the league's profile.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lim till i die

It's much easier to get players to sign for your A Championship side in the current setup than it would be if it was ran during the winter imo.

---

I'd have thought it'd have been easier in the summer when players have finished the season with a club and might want to take on a challenge for the new season. It's not easy for new clubs to come or go in the summer season to/from a winter season.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dodge

Its enjoyable for fans yeah. Might bring in the odd shilling in the short term.

Hasn't helped us bring in any fans

---

You don't no that Dodge, I'm sure if you went around the Saints fans in Sligo tonight some of them would be there because they got hooked from a European game they went to over the last few years

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by legendz

I guess it is a bonus in someways but performing in Europe is surely important for the promotion of the league.

---

But it's been pointed out that performing (relatively) well in europe hasn't raised the profile of the league in general, and hasn't even resulted in a significant improvement in the attendances of the teams that perfromed in Europe. As Dodge pointed out earlier, of all the teams that had decent runs in Europe, St. Pats are the only team that aren't suffering for it now. Even overachieving in Europe through unsustainable wages to players hasn't helped the league or the clubs themselves.