Shelbourne FC Demoted to First Division - All Purpose Thread

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Originally Posted by Drogman.

Some people on here have said that it made the league look like a joke, well in all fairness, it has been a joke for a past number of years, that's why changes are being made.

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More of a joke then. For example Miriam mentioning our ground deal in the same breath as the Shels and DC fiascos as if its a bad thing.

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Originally Posted by paudie

Isn't that what Tiger Woods married?

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We should deffo go for that.

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Originally Posted by Gareth

There is a HUGE difference, in that there is a potential asset of 20million ish. Debts in common alright, but that asset is something that would make a deal with fans even more difficult to broker, especially when times were prospering on the field.

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The value of the Tallaght site wouldn't have been that much different - why were the property developers sniffing around and lending Rovers money for a stake if it wasn't worth a huge amount?

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Originally Posted by Gareth

There is a HUGE difference, in that there is a potential asset of 20million ish.

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I think you'll find that asset is worth a lot less. A third is already gone, another 3rd is already spent and a chunk of the other 3rd will be drip fed to Shels over the next year if Finbar Flood can do a deal to keep Shels in business.

This time next year [or the year after], Shels will be millionaire's, just, and thats all you'll have. No Tolka, just the last million or so from the sale of Tolka because Ollie spent the rest buying titles, one of which you should be stripped of.

The proceeds from the sale of Tolka Park lease were supposed to be used to re-establish the sporting entity at another location, not spent on not paying players wages.

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Originally Posted by BohsPartisan

Kehoe wasn't callenged either when he insinuated that the average attendance is 3 to 4 hundred!

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well the discussion was primarily about Shels :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by bohs til i die

well the discussion was primarily about Shels :rolleyes:

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But he was talking about the league in general at that stage.

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Originally Posted by sniffa

12 million is peanuts when you read this.

Fourteen months after US financier Malcolm Glazer and his family took over Manchester United in a hotly contested takeover battle, the club's improving financial prospects have been reflected in a £660m debt reinfinancing deal. The deal will cut the club's annual interest bill and strengthen the Glazer family's grip on the club. A spokesman for the Glazers said the amended structure would continue to provide manager Alex Ferguson with 'sufficient funds in the transfer market'. The Financial Times, citing people familiar with the package, said the club's annual interest charge would fall to £62m, compared to £90m under the old deal. It said overall borrowings would rise to £660m from £580m, but the club had halved to £135m the amount they owe in the form of higher risk payment-in-kind notes.

Now thats frightening!!

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I don't know about that - compare the worldwide television and merchandising income of Manchester U with that of Shelbourne F. 12 mill is bonkers debt whatever way you look at it.

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Originally Posted by Philo

Would have been funnier to see how much he squirmed had he been asked how come he completely sold out the PFAI as soon as Delaney offered him a job with the FAI and why his final act as head of the PFAI was to move the organisation's offices into FAI HQ.

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Very true. His appointment stinks and he was clueless last night. Couldnt believe he had the nerve at the end to say that in 2009 there will be a fully professional 10 team league:rolleyes: HOW??

Miriam, you good thing, asked all the right questions IMO.

KOH

steve i reckon you should chair some shelbourne fans takeover with all your enthusiasm and belief in how possible it is ;)

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The proceeds from the sale of Tolka Park lease were supposed to be used to re-establish the sporting entity at another location, not spent on not paying players wages.

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yes well pointed out, the sale would have cleared debts and wages, and possibly paid for the wages for another couple few months, but after that ye would be back in the same position

Gavin was shocking last night, turned it off after he squirmed his way around Miriam asking if Shels getting a Premier licence made a joke of the whole process, and Dolan did his usual profit of doom act

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Originally Posted by jebus

...and Dolan did his usual profit of doom act

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Almost forgot about him...

Pat Dolan saying clubs should live within their means :eek: Next up Roddy Collins to back up Dolan. :D

And if you only knew how much that incompetent fool Gavin is on.... :eek:

KOH

Didn't see it, but it's a prety poor indictment of the FAI's PR skills. A trip down to see Bunny Carr might be required for Mr Gavin.

It seems to be a trend though - we had a few of the senior guys in Sligo a couple of seasons ago (03) and I thought the standard of speaking could have been a lot better.

Fran Rooney was at the helm and I really expected him to be a lot better, given the kind of presentations he should have been used to with Baltimore. He was very average.

Brendon Dillon was head of the league at the time, and he was very articulate - a good speaker - pity he's out of things.

I can't remember who else spoke that night, but it was far from inspirational stuff.

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Originally Posted by jebus

and Dolan did his usual profit of doom act

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profit of doom

you suggesting he profits from doom?

is this related to the doyle transfer!???!

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Originally Posted by wws

profit of doom

you suggesting he profits from doom?

is this related to the doyle transfer!???!

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:D very good

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Originally Posted by paul_oshea

steve i reckon you should chair some shelbourne fans takeover with all your enthusiasm and belief in how possible it is ;)

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I'd be happy to host them in the Stockwell Multiplex ! Drop me a PM with your flight details boys, and I'll get the tea and biscuits in.... :D

I'm just an eternal optimist POS. Also - with a background in 'political' representation and running campaigns, I probably have greater faith in the power of individuals than most people do. And I'm a supporter and shareholder in a fn-controlled club who have done exactly the type of thing that Shels fans arguably need to do (AFC Wimbledon).

People tend to totally under-estimate the level of power and influence they can have if and when they get organised - which is a huge shame.

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Originally Posted by Paraic

Didn't see it, but it's a prety poor indictment of the FAI's PR skills. A trip down to see Bunny Carr might be required for Mr Gavin.

It seems to be a trend though - we had a few of the senior guys in Sligo a couple of seasons ago (03) and I thought the standard of speaking could have been a lot better.

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Theory about Delaney appointments - do you think he* deliberately hands out important jobs to incompetents to make himself look better. He made his name during Saipan by being the only available FAI person who could (barely) string two sentences together.

When I say "he" appoints people I mean, of course, a faceless FAI committee which means Delaney isn't accountable for bad decisions.

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Originally Posted by Jerry The Saint

Theory about Delaney appointments - do you think he* deliberately hands out important jobs to incompetents to make himself look better.

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If you appoint incompetent people you are responsible. Same in any company so would make no sense. A successful or improved FAI eLOI boosts Delaneys position unless he is looking to be sacked & given golden handshake for remaining 5-6 years of his contract.

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Originally Posted by Jerry The Saint

Theory about Delaney appointments - do you think he* deliberately hands out important jobs to incompetents to make himself look better. He made his name during Saipan by being the only available FAI person who could (barely) string two sentences together.

When I say "he" appoints people I mean, of course, a faceless FAI committee which means Delaney isn't accountable for bad decisions.

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Unfortunately, as has been said before i'm sure, alot of people in the FAI are simply not football people. the politics in el circles is such that it's nigh on impossible for anybody who wants to - to progress in football admin in this country. How many of these officials came up through the ranks for example i.e supported local club, into club, then onto fai's top chair.

alot of pish posh has been talked about reform and blah blah etc, but we've yet to see it. his favourite is always talkin grass-roots football, yet some counties in this country have far less facilities for kids / youth football than most developing countries have.

the licencing is obviously got by the the old irish nudge and a wink. i havent read all threads here but how shels got a licence is not just a question that should be answered, it borders on criminal negligence. same could be said of dub city debacle.

anyway it's my opinon that all this reform is just the self-appointed delaney appeasing the uefa's and fifa's of this world so he can continue junketing around with the national team. you simply cant be seen as creditable, when your a faceless, unaccountable, untransparent and grossly paranoid administration.

Gavin was just simply awful. For the FAI to effectively promote the eL they must never again waste such a Prime Time opportunity like that.

"THE future for Shelbourne remains in the balance after chairman Finbarr Flood's assertion that a big 48 hours lay ahead for the league champions, with their survival chances rated only as "50-50".

Flood and Shels' management committee are attempting to deal with a long list of creditors and could be forced to pull the plug unless they can find a method to wipe the club's debts with an immediately pressing figure of €4m needing to be cleared.

Unless the creditors are prepared to be patient, the only way Shels will survive is if they can strike a deal with property developer Ossie Kilkenny - who has first option on the sale of the lease on Tolka Park - to follow through on the completion of the sale now.

For the past three seasons, Kilkenny has been providing bridging capital to the club and has offered to put forward the cash to sustain the team for the coming season although that money would be drawn down from the value of any eventual sale.

Kilkenny, who is chairman of the Irish Sports Council, is currently keeping a low profile. He failed to make a scheduled appearance at yesterday's announcement of the Irish Institute for Sport's new Director of Sports Science.

Daniel McDonnell"

Funny then how Flood could come out yesterday and dismiss talk of Shels not being able to participate in the new Premier League or in Europe as rubbish and assure everyone that Shels will be fielding teams in both competitions.

Any of you folk resident in Dublin hear anything on the grapevine that has not already been aired? Personally I think the club would have some chance if they were to volunatrily crop out of the CL and also go down to Division 1 and radically slash their costs. They would at least then get some kudos from other El supporters and could maybe bounce back in a few years ala Rovers.

its not necessarily about people or how they are organised, its more about the person(s) that is organising them, getting them organised and speaking on behalf and for them.

Iam worried & not...

??????? OK I can understand the "I am worried" part but the "& not" requires further explanation, care to elaborate?

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Originally Posted by Banner

Personally I think the club would have some chance if they were to volunatrily crop out of the CL and also go down to Division 1 and radically slash their costs. They would at least then get some kudos from other El supporters and could maybe bounce back in a few years ala Rovers.

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They certainly would earn back some of the respect they've squandered over the last few years. Someone said in another thread, they should drop out senior football for a couple of years and get their house in order, then apply for the A league and work their way up. I would agree with that and if they announced they were going to do that, as much as I loath the fekers I'd consider throwing a few quid into a collection bucket for them. Especially if the fans took over the club.
Gareth, Higgins and Co., its over to you.

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Originally Posted by Paraic

Didn't see it, but it's a prety poor indictment of the FAI's PR skills. A trip down to see Bunny Carr might be required for Mr Gavin.

It seems to be a trend though - we had a few of the senior guys in Sligo a couple of seasons ago (03) and I thought the standard of speaking could have been a lot better.

Fran Rooney was at the helm and I really expected him to be a lot better, given the kind of presentations he should have been used to with Baltimore. He was very average.

Brendon Dillon was head of the league at the time, and he was very articulate - a good speaker - pity he's out of things.

I can't remember who else spoke that night, but it was far from inspirational stuff.

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Rooney's never been a good speaker...don't forget it was one of his presentations that precipitated Baltimore's collapse

Loads of rumours. ome from high placed sources. If Shels pull out I'm sure it'll all come out. I won't say too mcuh but there's more than football authorities looking at things now

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Originally Posted by Dodge

Loads of rumours. ome from high placed sources. If Shels pull out I'm sure it'll all come out. I won't say too mcuh but there's more than football authorities looking at things now

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Come on Dodge, you can't just leave us hanging on that cliff...

Spill them. Is Inspector Knacker after Shels?

Gavin a first-class arsehole. Whilst head of the PFAI, he remained quiet for months on the Shels non-payment of wages to players. Why? Because he knew he had a cushy job lined up with the association at the end the season. Compare this to how outspoken the PFAI were at the time of Shamrock Rovers and others were not paying their players. As a former head of the PFAI, Gavin of all people should know how badly the clubs are run. Instead, he has sold out to the forces of evil of Delaney & co.

Also, don't forget that his last act as head of the PFAI was to move the asscociation's headquarters from the SIPTU's offices in Parnell Sq. to the new FAI headquarters in Abbotstown. What other industry would this happen in? Can you imagine ASTI moving their offices to the Dept. of Education? No other union would move in with an association that represents their employers. It's all part of Delaney's plan to have every aspect of the game in this country other his thumb and Gavin went along with it knowing he had the eL job sewn up... a total conflict of interests. Hope the pair of them die screaming... *******...

Oooooooooooooooooooohhhhhhh!!

Sounds intersting, I wonder have the CAB or the revenue commissioners or the Gardai taken an interest in the goings on at Shels? Has someone been making "loads a money" without paying any tax?

Maybe a director taking his salary directly from an aforementioned buscuit tin without inforing the auhtorities? (or some such skullduggery?) Could result in a nasty fine or perhaps even a prison sentence?

C'mon lads the above is pure speculation please spill some beans!

Ollie and Maxi in a cell
Makes OZ look like Porridge

ollie could bring the fags and maxi the lighter

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Originally Posted by passerrby

ollie could bring the fags

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I doubt they'd be in short supply where they're going ;)

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Originally Posted by pól-dcfc

Come on Dodge, you can't just leave us hanging on that cliff...

Spill them. Is Inspector Knacker after Shels?

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Word on the street is that some creditors are more nervous then others, the revenue arent too keen to hang around waiting either and the developers arent interested in stumping up another 7 figure lump sum.

If the creditors want repayment pronto, they could go legal, get Shels wound up and then get what they are owed from the sale of the asset[s]. I am sure there are others better positioned to explain how exactly this works but thats doing the tounds.

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Originally Posted by LukeO

Gavin a first-class arsehole. Whilst head of the PFAI, he remained quiet for months on the Shels non-payment of wages to players. Why? Because he knew he had a cushy job lined up with the association at the end the season. Compare this to how outspoken the PFAI were at the time of Shamrock Rovers and others were not paying their players. As a former head of the PFAI, Gavin of all people should know how badly the clubs are run. Instead, he has sold out to the forces of evil of Delaney & co.

Also, don't forget that his last act as head of the PFAI was to move the asscociation's headquarters from the SIPTU's offices in Parnell Sq. to the new FAI headquarters in Abbotstown. What other industry would this happen in? Can you imagine ASTI moving their offices to the Dept. of Education? No other union would move in with an association that represents their employers. It's all part of Delaney's plan to have every aspect of the game in this country other his thumb and Gavin went along with it knowing he had the eL job sewn up... a total conflict of interests. Hope the pair of them die screaming... *******...

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nail on the head

delaney is unreal - the brass neck of those two thinkin they could get away with this as well

stupid fcks writing a letter over a perceived slight at booze up whilst the irish representatives for the CL are crumbling before there eyes

what the fck is their priority!??!

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Originally Posted by wws

what the fck is their priority!??!

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Take a wild fookin guess. Delaney can't lose with Gavin anyway. After this season is yet another unmitigated disaster, he sacks Gavin and hey presto, he has a scapegoat abd the PFAI is knobbled in one fell swoop.

KOH

Dunnoe, some in the PFAI mightn't be happy. Might turn them more militant

Pigs might fly

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Originally Posted by Banner

I wonder have the CAB or the revenue commissioners or the Gardai taken an interest in the goings on at Shels?

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The Office of the Director of Corporate Enforcement should probably have a gander too.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

If the case is that Derry are taking Shelbourne's place as champions, shouldn't Derry be moved to Shelbourne's group, and St. Pat's take the spot in the group left by Derry?

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Aye, but it's handier to leave it the way it is. Would rather change group though, personally.