Nathan Collins D Brentford b.2001

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Originally Posted by irishfan86

That was what the pre-game lineup showed (four at the back), but it seemed pretty clear to me for large portions of the match that it was in practice a back three.

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Never mind that BFC's FB's were able to get forward more than anticipated, esp Henry (an absolute flyer) and also after Fulham went down to 10 men, that was a back four which Frank picked for that game.

Frank picks his formations/tactics according to the opposition: Against a top team which is flying etc, esp away from home, it's usually a back 5. But against an equal or lesser team he normally goes back 4.

Anyhow, Ben Mee may be fit for Saturday (C.Palace at home), so it will be interesting to see whether he comes back in, or is on the bench (don't want/need to rush him).

Played another 90 mins in a back four in Brentford's 2-2 home draw with Palace. Was at the game and would say he had another v.good game, marred only by a misjudgement for Palace's equaliser. (Didn't have a good view myself, but TV replay suggested that instead of blocking the attempt, he left it for the gk, but it went through the latter's legs).

Anyhow, Ben Mee wasn't yet fit to play yesterdfay, but almost certainly will be brought back in for BFC's League Cup game away to Bristol Rovers on Tuesday evening if fit. NC will probably make way for Mee, unless Frank decides to rest Pinnock instead.

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

Played another 90 mins in a back four in Brentford's 2-2 home draw with Palace. Was at the game and would say he had another v.good game, marred only by a misjudgement for Palace's equaliser. (Didn't have a good view myself, but TV replay suggested that instead of blocking the attempt, he left it for the gk, but it went through the latter's legs).

Anyhow, Ben Mee wasn't yet fit to play yesterdfay, but almost certainly will be brought back in for BFC's League Cup game away to Bristol Rovers on Tuesday evening if fit. NC will probably make way for Mee, unless Frank decides to rest Pinnock instead.

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Even if the keeper calls for that you put it into row z and tell him where to go if he has an issue with it.

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Originally Posted by JR89

Even if the keeper calls for that you put it into row z and tell him where to go if he has an issue with it.

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Apparently "Flekken had urged Collins to leave the ball, he duly jumped up and that allowed Andersen to cancel out Kevin Schade’s delightful first-half effort."

Anyhow, more about NC's settling in at Brentford here: https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footb...after-30796660

In a split second moment like that, if the keeper calls you jump out of the way or else you get a deserved bollocking afterwards. That one's on Flekken.

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Originally Posted by Eirambler

In a split second moment like that, if the keeper calls you jump out of the way or else you get a deserved bollocking afterwards. That one's on Flekken.

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Disagree, because now Collins looks like a fool for moving out the way and letting the player score.

You're judging it based on the outcome though, which Collins couldn't possibly have done in the circumstances. If the keeper calls for it, as a defender (and I'm speaking from experience here) you heed the call and trust that your keeper, who has a better view of the situation, has called it correctly. Of course, if he's messed up, which he did in this case, you end up looking like an idiot, but you can be certain Flekken's the one getting the blame in the Monday post match review for that.

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Originally Posted by Eirambler

You're judging it based on the outcome though, which Collins couldn't possibly have done in the circumstances. If the keeper calls for it, as a defender (and I'm speaking from experience here) you heed the call and trust that your keeper, who has a better view of the situation, has called it correctly. Of course, if he's messed up, which he did in this case, you end up looking like an idiot, but you can be certain Flekken's the one getting the blame in the Monday post match review for that.

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And speaking as a goalkeeper, and goalkeeper coach, you still rely on your defender making a split second decision based on what danger they see in front of them. Goalkeepers can mistake judgement too.

For me, if the keeper shouted, he takes partial blame, but Collins should still have recognised the danger and put the boot through it when it so was close to goal.

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Originally Posted by Eirambler

You're judging it based on the outcome though, which Collins couldn't possibly have done in the circumstances. If the keeper calls for it, as a defender (and I'm speaking from experience here) you heed the call and trust that your keeper, who has a better view of the situation, has called it correctly. Of course, if he's messed up, which he did in this case, you end up looking like an idiot, but you can be certain Flekken's the one getting the blame in the Monday post match review for that.

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I was a defender too and under no circumstances would I rely on a keepers shout in those circumstances. Clear your lines... clear your lines

Mee back in tonight in the EFL Cup away to Newport. Looks like a back three alongside Xanka and Ajer (squad players), with NC on the bench and Pinnock rested completely.

Basically this is a 'B' team, with only Janelt a regular Prem starter (Mee aside)

Ben Mee back into Brentford team ahead of Collins today v Bournemouth. Not the end of the world but interesting to see Mee get his game quickly enough.

Collins showing why he should probably be starting with passes like that for the assist for the equaliser.

Fine ball and he was under enough pressure too. Mbeumo had a lot to do but when you provide an assist from your own half then it's a good day of work.

A short thread on Nathan Collins' 50th Premier League appearance today, the only Irish player under 30 with 50 PL appearances

Silly mistake again got Evertons third goal, he just doesn’t seem to be able to stamp them out

Overall he’s played well again though, I’d say. He’s so good on the front foot.

Beto has been giving him a tough time I thought, Collins doesn’t seem to win the share of defensive headers you’d expect. Had looked good on the ball up to that moment though

At fault for Wolves’ second and third goals today. Crap back pass and crap forward pass respectively.

Collins at fault again for Wolves’ fourth. Another terrible pass at the back. A hatrick of errors.

His concentration seems to be his major achilles heel. We’ve seen it a few times in green over the last 12-18 months - costly positioning mistakes, passes, etc. maybe he’s just going through his John Stones 2016/17 phase.

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Originally Posted by SkStu

Collins at fault again for Wolves’ fourth. Another terrible pass at the back. A hatrick of errors.

His concentration seems to be his major achilles heel. We’ve seen it a few times in green over the last 12-18 months - costly positioning mistakes, passes, etc. maybe he’s just going through his John Stones 2016/17 phase.

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If he keeps going like this ~ He won't be playing much for Brentford's first team !

He can seem lackadaisical at times. And he makes tricky stuff look effortless at other times. It's a fine line between the two.

I think he's more at fault for the first goal than he is the third
But look if you're going to have a bad game have a mare and move on immediately

Looks like the majority of Brentford fans giving him the benefit of the doubt from his recent performances pre-injury which is good (certainly less fickle than half the village idiots down the Molineux). Shocker of a game, however hopefully just nerves - does need to cut out the causality - however think it’s just part of the course for some ball-playing defenders like Lescott, Stones, Van Dyke etc. Needs to bounce back in the next game.

https://griffinpark.org/forums/threa...139273/page-12

It's just possible that with BFC's injury problems (am tempted to say "crisis"), that Collins was rushed back before he was fully fit/ready, and this was playing on his mind?

Anyhow, there's no better man than Thomas Frank to get him back to his best:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/articles/c88209j5l3yo.amp

He had a bit of a knack for goalscoring when he was with Burnley and Stoke. He has one tonight for Brentford in the cup, his second overall for them.

Against Wolves too - helping make up for the two he "scored" for Wolves against Brentford last month :p

jesus, yeah! Had totally forgotten about that!

Could be on the move again in the summer if Brentford's poor form continues, which isn't ideal for us. Think his development would benefit staying at one club for an extended period of time but Brentford are in relegation form and facing a difficult fixture list, with Luton looking like they can wiggle their way out of the bottom three. Maybe Toney's return can turn things around.

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Originally Posted by ifk101

Could be on the move again in the summer if Brentford's poor form continues, which isn't ideal for us.

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No chance.

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Originally Posted by ifk101

Think his development would benefit staying at one club for an extended period of time but Brentford are in relegation form and facing a difficult fixture list, with Luton looking like they can wiggle their way out of the bottom three.

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The next 9 or 10 games are tough, no doubt, but the final run-in is easier.

And even if Luton can keep it up (big ask), both Forest and Everton could be dragged down by points deductions for FFP. Whatever happens, Bees won't panic, that's for sure.

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Originally Posted by ifk101

Maybe Toney's return can turn things around.

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If any of you play Fantasy PL, get him in your team before tomorrows game at home to Forest - I've a feeling he'll be back with a bang.

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

If any of you play Fantasy PL, get him in your team before tomorrows game at home to Forest - I've a feeling he'll be back with a bang.

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strange gameweek in FPL, spread over 2 weeks so the deadline was last saturday. he's a candidate to be brought in alright though.

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

No chance.

The next 9 or 10 games are tough, no doubt, but the final run-in is easier.

And even if Luton can keep it up (big ask), both Forest and Everton could be dragged down by points deductions for FFP. Whatever happens, Bees won't panic, that's for sure.


If any of you play Fantasy PL, get him in your team before tomorrows game at home to Forest - I've a feeling he'll be back with a bang.

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How much are you putting on ~ That he will be back with a Bang ?

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Originally Posted by seanfhear

How much are you putting on ~ That he will be back with a Bang ?

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Don't play FPL, and haven't been near a bookies in a while.

It's just a feeling I have, based on how he's been doing in training/BCD games, plus his natural confidence - apparently he's been telling all his teammates: "Big Dog's back!":
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/68024653

While Forest are hit by injuries, incl their two best players, Elanga and Gibbs-White. I suspect Nuno will set his stall out to defend - it could be a long 90 minutes for them.

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

Don't play FPL, and haven't been near a bookies in a while.

It's just a feeling I have, based on how he's been doing in training/BCD games, plus his natural confidence - apparently he's been telling all his teammates: "Big Dog's back!":
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/68024653

While Forest are hit by injuries, incl their two best players, Elanga and Gibbs-White. I suspect Nuno will set his stall out to defend - it could be a long 90 minutes for them.

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As long as Big Dog doesn't back himself at the bookies ! ! !

Absolute shocker from Collins today at home to Liverpool. One of the worst performances by a Premier League player I can recall.

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Originally Posted by Colbert Report

Absolute shocker from Collins today at home to Liverpool. One of the worst performances by a Premier League player I can recall.

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Where did it all go wrong ?

OK ~ That's a bit of an exaggeration ~ But, It hasn't turned out like we all were hoping a couple of years ago, yet anyway.

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Originally Posted by Colbert Report

Absolute shocker from Collins today at home to Liverpool. One of the worst performances by a Premier League player I can recall.

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He was pretty good up to the third goal. Actually had some really good moments, some vital tackles and blocks. He fell apart after that mistake.

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Originally Posted by passinginterest

He was pretty good up to the third goal. Actually had some really good moments, some vital tackles and blocks. He fell apart after that mistake.

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He looked like the only Brentford player who wanted to actually try and defend.

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Originally Posted by passinginterest

He was pretty good up to the third goal. Actually had some really good moments, some vital tackles and blocks. He fell apart after that mistake.

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TBH, I think Jake O'Brien would have beaten Salah to that ball - he is really quick after his first two or three strides. Eighteen months ago, I thought we would be building our defence around Collins - and that may yet happen - but with the options available now, I don't think he's undroppable

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Originally Posted by samhaydenjr

TBH, I think Jake O'Brien would have beaten Salah to that ball - he is really quick after his first two or three strides. Eighteen months ago, I thought we would be building our defence around Collins - and that may yet happen - but with the options available now, I don't think he's undroppable

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Agree. Collins' game has become so erratic he'll need Bazunuesque tolerance to retain his Brentford spot. So it's hardly unreasonable to suggest a midfield role for Ireland in coming friendlies. Cullen is struggling badly - he looks lost at EPL level and had a dismal Euro campaign. Collins is a far better all-round footballer and well capable of McGrath/Lawrenson style versatility.