Potentially eligible players thread

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17/03/2021, 11:21 AM
DeLorean

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

Cirkin was born here. That's about as far from "tenuous" as it gets.

As far from tenuous as it gets would be to be born here, to Irish parents, and remained growing up here beyond the age of three, I would say. I'm not questioning his eligibility, I'm questioning whether it's a fair to say it's the "equivilant" of McGeady/McCarthy. Do you think it is?
17/03/2021, 11:24 AM
CraftyToePoke

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

Cirkin was born here. That's about as far from "tenuous" as it gets.

McGrath & O'Leary born in England. And I would describe their Englishness as tenuous yes & that's before you consider Cirkin has a third country, his parents one in the mix.
17/03/2021, 4:24 PM
DeLorean

Silence is deafening.
18/03/2021, 8:40 AM
Diggs246

These are actually interesting points. Is obafemi really irish for example? Born in Dublin, left for london very quickly. Parents and culture Nigerian.
18/03/2021, 8:58 AM
DeLorean

His Irishness is as solid or as tenuous as he wants it to be, I guess.
18/03/2021, 10:14 AM
tetsujin1979

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeLorean

As far from tenuous as it gets would be to be born here, to Irish parents, and remained growing up here beyond the age of three, I would say. I'm not questioning his eligibility, I'm questioning whether it's a fair to say it's the "equivilant" of McGeady/McCarthy. Do you think it is?

If you're born here, you're Irish. If your parent, or grandparent, was born here, you're Irish. There's no levels of Irishness.
18/03/2021, 10:18 AM
DeLorean

So Kevin Kilbane is English then, whether he likes it or not?
18/03/2021, 10:19 AM
tetsujin1979

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeLorean

So Kevin Kilbane is English then, whether he likes it or not?

See below

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

If you're born here, you're Irish. If your parent, or grandparent, was born here, you're Irish. There's no levels of Irishness.
18/03/2021, 10:25 AM
pineapple stu

Sorry tets - that's nonsense. There absolutely is differing levels of Irishness. Cirkin is an obvious example. He is absolutely eligible to play for Ireland, and that is a black or white question, but he will probably the first to acknowledge that he's less Irish than I am.

Or this article from the Indo in 2015 does a very good job of showing differing levels of Irishness among former Ireland players. Compare "I was born in Dublin but it never felt like home" (Steve Heighway) with "Others might have mentioned the fact that I wasn’t born in Ireland but it was never a problem for me. My dad was from Donegal so I never really thought of it as a big issue." (Ray Houghton) They're clearly expressing differing levels of Irishness.
18/03/2021, 10:27 AM
DeLorean

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

See below

I saw it the first time. It doesn't stack up though. Is Patrick Bamford as Irish as you or me, even though he considers himself 'more' English? Of course there are levels of Irishness.
18/03/2021, 10:37 AM
tetsujin1979

I don't see it that way, and I've seen where the "this person isn't as Irish as this person" discussion ends. If you have a passport, you're Irish, if you don't, you're not.
18/03/2021, 10:42 AM
pineapple stu

So even though I've quoted people to whom this actually relates, and who do see different levels of Irishness, you know better, end of story?

I've already distinguished between eligibility (which is black and white) and culture/feeling (which can vary), so your passport comment isn't relevant to the degrees of Irishness question.
18/03/2021, 10:59 AM
sadloserkid

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

If you're born here, you're Irish. If your parent, or grandparent, was born here, you're Irish. There's no levels of Irishness.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tetsujin1979

I don't see it that way, and I've seen where the "this person isn't as Irish as this person" discussion ends. If you have a passport, you're Irish, if you don't, you're not.

Which is it though? If you're born in another country to Irish parents you're Irish? But if you don't yet have an Irish passport you're not?

And does that also mean that if you obtain an Irish passport at, say, 30 you become Irish instead of being your previous nationality?

I think you're oversimplifying here in a big way and it's borderline offensive to those whose nationality isn't 100% clear cut.
18/03/2021, 11:03 AM
seanfhear

Being born in a Stable does not make you a Horse. I don’t think Mr Wellington thought of himself as Irish.

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-...ears-1.2244707
18/03/2021, 11:18 AM
DeLorean

Quote:

Originally Posted by sadloserkid

I think you're oversimplifying here in a big way and it's borderline offensive to those whose nationality isn't 100% clear cut.

And also offensive to the many who consider themselves 100% Irish but hold British passports, so - by Tets' (most recent) criteria are British - end of discussion. There are no levels of Britishness, after all.
18/03/2021, 1:15 PM
Ol� Ol�

Patrick Bamford was heavily tipped to get his first England call up today. No such luck- Ollie Watkins has been preferred to him.
18/03/2021, 1:17 PM
seanfhear

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ol� Ol�

Patrick Bamford was heavily tipped to get his first England call up today. No such luck- Ollie Watkins has been preferred to him.

England have a lot of good forwards to choose from. I wonder if we had qualified for a major tournament would Bamford and some others have been a lot keener to get on board ?
18/03/2021, 1:22 PM
John83

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeLorean

And also offensive to the many who consider themselves 100% Irish but hold British passports, so - by Tets' (most recent) criteria are British - end of discussion. There are no levels of Britishness, after all.

While I don't agree with tets on this, he seems to have said that this is binary, not exclusive, i.e. that that person would be both Irish and English. He just doesn't qualify their Irishness.
18/03/2021, 1:31 PM
DeLorean

Yes, it's the 'and English' bit that many would find offensive though.
18/03/2021, 1:38 PM
John83

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeLorean

Yes, it's the 'and English' bit that many would find offensive though.

I've always found the Wellington quote pretty awful, and it's the mirror image of that.
18/03/2021, 1:43 PM
DeLorean

Quote:

Originally Posted by John83

I've always found the Wellington quote pretty awful, and it's the mirror image of that.

Don't really get you? All I'm saying is that there are loads of Irish who hold British passports but don't consider themselves any bit British.
18/03/2021, 1:45 PM
John83

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeLorean

Don't really get you? All I'm saying is that there are loads of Irish who hold British passports but don't consider themselves any bit British.

I completely get it. Just because they were born in a stable doesn't mean they're horses. I just find that sentiment revolting. Always have, regardless of the "stable".
18/03/2021, 1:48 PM
seanfhear

Wellington really put the boot in with that one.
19/03/2021, 12:47 AM
CraftyToePoke

Quote:

Originally Posted by CraftyToePoke

Christy Pym / Peterborough United / 25 / Keeper

- https://www.thesun.ie/sport/football...f-ireland/amp/

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChristyPym

�My family are very Irish, both on my Mom�s and Dad�s side. My Mom�s Dad was from Knock in Co Mayo and he was a very proud Irishman � he came across to England for work when he was about 20 years old.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChristyPym

�My call-up for England came along when, at the time, my previous agent and I were speaking to the Republic of Ireland and we were trying to push that.

�I got called into the office at Exeter and was told I�d been called up and my initial thoughts were, �I�m getting called up to the Republic of Ireland squad�, because at the time, Ireland were speaking to my agent.

�Ireland told my agent that they weren�t going to do anything because they were happy with the keepers that they had at that time. Obviously, the opportunity came along to represent England, my family lived in Exeter, so I thought that I would take that opportunity and see what would happen.�

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChristyPym

Pym feels the way Peterborough play out from the back is similar to what Kenny wants from his goalkeepers and the 25-year-old would love to work with the former Dundalk manager and keepers like Darren Randolph and Caoimh�n Kelleher.

�I�ll play out left and right foot and I think that�s been a big part of my game this year and last year as well.

�I speak to Jack Taylor who plays with Peterborough and he was with Stephen Kenny with the Irish U21s and has only said good things about Kenny. I played with Dara O�Shea at Exeter and he has only had good things to say.

�I�ve looked at the keepers in the setup and I would back myself to be good enough to be part of it.

All here : https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/...-40246481.html
19/03/2021, 4:36 AM
seanfhear

Quote:

Originally Posted by CraftyToePoke

All here : https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/...-40246481.html

Could we have Pym’s for the Summer ?
19/03/2021, 6:08 AM
pineapple stu

Can someone who says "mom" actually be eligible for Ireland?
19/03/2021, 6:32 AM
elatedscum

Quote:

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Can someone who says "mom" actually be eligible for Ireland?

I�m gonna guess it was an American intern tasked with transcribing the interview, either that or software. You�d rarely hear mom from someone who grew up in England
19/03/2021, 7:00 AM
pineapple stu

It's getting more common I think - people growing up watching too much American TV and getting their influences from there. It's a phrase that I have a particular hatred for for no overly rational reason; it's just a horrible-sounding word. So I'll be keeping a wary eye on this guy, even more than "I'm a good Catholic" Westwood :)
19/03/2021, 7:28 AM
Diggs246

Quote:

Originally Posted by seanfhear

Could we have Pym’s for the Summer ?

Anyone who drinks pims is not irish eligible
19/03/2021, 7:32 AM
sadloserkid

Quote:

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Can someone who says "mom" actually be eligible for Ireland?

Only if they have an Irish passport apparently.
19/03/2021, 7:55 AM
DeLorean

Quote:

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Can someone who says "mom" actually be eligible for Ireland?

It's always been 'mom' where I live. It's certainly better than 'mammy' which you'd hear fully formed grown ups say in parts of the west. :)
19/03/2021, 8:30 AM
DCSIL

Quote:

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Can someone who says "mom" actually be eligible for Ireland?

if you grew up in the English Midlands it's Mom.
19/03/2021, 8:44 AM
seanfhear

Quote:

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Can someone who says "mom" actually be eligible for Ireland?

Yes Pop.
19/03/2021, 8:46 AM
seanfhear

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diggs246

Anyone who drinks pims is not irish eligible

What do you think we Dunk our Wexford Strawberries in ? ?
19/03/2021, 8:50 AM
NeverFeltBetter

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeLorean

It's always been 'mom' where I live. It's certainly better than 'mammy' which you'd hear fully formed grown ups say in parts of the west. :)

Same here. This is the first I'm hearing of it not being pretty common actually. For me the weirdos are the ones who call their parents by their first names.
19/03/2021, 9:23 AM
CraftyToePoke

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeLorean

It's always been 'mom' where I live. It's certainly better than 'mammy' which you'd hear fully formed grown ups say in parts of the west. :)

Same around my way. Surprised by this reaction on here today to the word.
19/03/2021, 9:27 AM
CraftyToePoke

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeverFeltBetter

For me the weirdos are the ones who call their parents by their first names.

Nature's freaks NFB.
19/03/2021, 10:14 AM
John83

Quote:

Originally Posted by pineapple stu

It's getting more common I think - people growing up watching too much American TV and getting their influences from there. It's a phrase that I have a particular hatred for for no overly rational reason; it's just a horrible-sounding word. So I'll be keeping a wary eye on this guy, even more than "I'm a good Catholic" Westwood :)

I work with a lot of non-native speakers. They typically learn American English, so I have fallen into the habit of using it from time to time too, mostly when speaking with a non-native speaker. Has to be a possibility for a footballer too, given how international the professional game is now. It's just a word. Grow up.
19/03/2021, 10:33 AM
tetsujin1979

Liam Delap included in England U18 squad
19/03/2021, 10:36 AM
ColourfulPeanut

Fantastic news on Finn. Would love to see these lads progress to the fringes of the first team ASAP. We've been far too complacent with our young players and it's the one thing Kenny seems to have a grasp on.

That England squad also includes Barry and Egan-Riley who could ultimately play for us too

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