UEFA Coefficient

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Originally Posted by bigmac

Correct with respect to the number of European places and where we enter the competitions. However the seeding next season will be based on our position at the end of this year.

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This is my understanding too. Seedings go on rankings in May2009. Places go on rankings May 2008.

There are 5 champions league group places available for countries ranked 13th and lower from next year.

I think Drogheda were really unfortunately to draw Dynamo Kiev. I think they may well have taken the Rangers team that played Kaunas (only saw the 2nd leg) and the Brann side that beat Ventspils on away goals are struggling at the moment. Kaunas have 4 games (at least) left now and a real chance to gain a club coefficient as well as boost the national one.

If Derry make the UEFA Cup they are more likely to be seeded.

Most clubs would prefer to be exampt from a round. They still get the prizemoney as if they won, no danger of injuries and no travelling costs. It does reduce the chances of them helping our coefficient though. It is a fault in the system. It will be most obvious from next year in the champions league of they give coefficient points when the bottom 6 meet in a prelim round. These countries will quickly pass out those above them.

I've a couple of questions regarding the new format UEFA Cup:

1) Will it still be regionalised?

2) Will you now have to wait until the Group Stage until you earn double coefficent points / your own club points? This would mean having to get through an extra two rounds before getting the double points and club points...

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Originally Posted by pete

* When get to 34th 2nd place in the league goes direct to Uefa round 2.
* If we make it to 27th Cup Winner goes direct to 3rd round of Uefa Cup.

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These are very achievable targets. Pats can make a big contribution if they can manage a win over Elfsborg.

We would want to have good campaigns over the next 2 years to try and reach these targets as we will be taking a huge wallop when the 06/07 total of 2.833 goes.

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Originally Posted by holidaysong

I've a couple of questions regarding the new format UEFA Cup:

1) Will it still be regionalised?

2) Will you now have to wait until the Group Stage until you earn double coefficent points / your own club points? This would mean having to get through an extra two rounds before getting the double points and club points...

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1. I suspect they could remove it as there will be very few teams involved in the early rounds.

2. I would guess everything pre group stage will be a qualifier so half points.

No one really knows what Uefa will do. For coefficients they only publish points for the teams involved in each years competition.

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Originally Posted by pete

No one really knows what Uefa will do.

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That's a fair summary - it'll be very interesting to see what happens next year. Remember that if the champions win their first tie in the CL then they're guaranteed at least 4 more games. If they lose in CLQ2 then they go into UCQ4 (chance of a huge glamour tie but very little chance of progressing), whereas if they win CLQ2 then they're in the group stages of the UC regardless.
I could definitely see this happening in the short to medium term. Once we are assured of seeding in the first round then all it will take is a good draw/ stroke of luck and there's a LOI team in the group stages of Europe.

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Originally Posted by bigmac

That's a fair summary - it'll be very interesting to see what happens next year. Remember that if the champions win their first tie in the CL then they're guaranteed at least 4 more games. If they lose in CLQ2 then they go into UCQ4 (chance of a huge glamour tie but very little chance of progressing), whereas if they win CLQ2 then they're in the group stages of the UC regardless.
I could definitely see this happening in the short to medium term. Once we are assured of seeding in the first round then all it will take is a good draw/ stroke of luck and there's a LOI team in the group stages of Europe.

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Agreed.

However my reading is that our champions won't be seeded unless we can move up another place. We need to catch Bosnia and hold off Hungary - danger also that BATE could really boost the Belarus coefficient should they make the group stages of the CL (real chance v Levski).

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Originally Posted by gspain

Agreed.

However my reading is that our champions won't be seeded unless we can move up another place. We need to catch Bosnia and hold off Hungary - danger also that BATE could really boost the Belarus coefficient should they make the group stages of the CL (real chance v Levski).

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Correct. 32 is the seeding cutoff (assuming no team coefficients below that) for the CL. I predicted 33rd earlier this season, but hopefully Pats can pull out a result to get over that hurdle.

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Originally Posted by bigmac

Correct. 32 is the seeding cutoff (assuming no team coefficients below that) for the CL. I predicted 33rd earlier this season, but hopefully Pats can pull out a result to get over that hurdle.

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Yeah. Pats probably need to win at least one game to give us a shout.

If not it will probably be a reverse of this season as our Champions won't be seeded but entrants in Qround 1 of UEFA will be.

Where can you get the individual co-effs for each team, I seen Shels and Derry, but what about the others.

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Originally Posted by TheBoss

Where can you get the individual co-effs for each team, I seen Shels and Derry, but what about the others.

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If your talking about LoI clubs, then they inhererit the LoI average as they have not had the oppotunity to excell over that average.

Shelbourne (Lille), Derry City (Paris Saint Germain) both scored a remarkable home draw in the !st round of the UEFA Cup and that one result was also added to their individual club total. Cork City also made it to the 1st round (Red Star Belgrade) unfortunately they didn't benefit that time.

I only learnt this about two weeks ago through the posters on foot.ie.

For me it's a reminder that UEFA Cup 1st round is a goal and teams can get some medium term benefit.

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Originally Posted by HarpoJoyce

Cork City also made it to the 1st round (Red Star Belgrade) unfortunately they didn't benefit that time.

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Slavia Prague.

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Originally Posted by Dazzy

Slavia Prague.

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Aw Crap! Does this mean I have to apologise to the fans of at least three different clubs now. Sorry I got that wrong, I confused their 2006 Champions league game, it's to Cork City's credit they play quality sides, regular.

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Originally Posted by HarpoJoyce

If your talking about LoI clubs, then they inhererit the LoI average as they have not had the oppotunity to excell over that average.

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I am aware they inherit the league co-eff, but Drogs and Pats if successful get their own co-eff, I want to know their current one.

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Originally Posted by TheBoss

I am aware they inherit the league co-eff, but Drogs and Pats if successful get their own co-eff, I want to know their current one.

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2.420 is the figure published by UEFA for the St. Pat's and Cork City before the start of the UEFA Cup qualifying rounds
http://www.uefa.com/competitions/uef...id=727066.html
(apologies, the clubs of FIN and FH Hafnarfjardur (ICE) are positioned lower than their quantity, I'm presuming the more specific quantity is correct)

As you can also see from the table what clubs/countries could be targeted to be overtaken.

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Originally Posted by TheBoss

I am aware they inherit the league co-eff, but Drogs and Pats if successful get their own co-eff, I want to know their current one.

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At the moment they do not have one because for the team co-efficient points from qualifying rounds do not count. So if Pats make it to the first round of the UEFA Cup, next season they would take the country ranking for the past four years and their own from this year plus 33% of the country co-efficient (not taking into account any possible changes this new system might do).

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/calc.html

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UEFA Team Ranking

The UEFA team coefficients are calculated as the sum of the number of points of each individual team, and 33% of the country coefficient. Before 2004 the contribution of the country coefficient was 50%. See the team coefficients of 2007 for an example of such a calculation. For the calculation of the individual points of the team coefficients games played in qualifying rounds are not taken into account.
The UEFA team ranking is computed by the sum of 5 coefficients in the last 5 years. See the team ranking of 2007 for an example of such a ranking list. In this list the yellow lines with country information indicate the lowest possible value for a team of that country (even if that team didn't play any game in the last five years). The most recent team ranking is used for seeding of clubs for draws in the Champions League and the UEFA Cup.

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Maybe a bit of good news and correcting myself here. I forgot about the spot reserved for the winners of the 2009 competition.

The seedings in the CL may go down as far as 34 next year if as expected the winners of the CL are a team that has already qualified for the group stages in 2009/2010.

It is not clear yet what UEFA will do with the winners spot. However they are likely to give it to the champions of country 13. My guess then is that the champions of countries 14-17 will be exempt from QR1. Thus the seeding in round 1 will go down to country 34 not allowing for club coefficients.

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Originally Posted by DmanDmythDledge

So if Pats make it to the first round of the UEFA Cup,

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And if they manage to get a result there...
It's a simple process, each team gets one third of their country's coefficient plus whatever points they have earned themselves in the proper rounds over the last 5 years.
For Derry that is 1 point for their draw in 06/07. At present they are the only Irish team who would have a team coefficient next season. If they qualify for Europe they will almost certainly be seeded as they would have one third of the Irish coefficient (currently equal to 2.888) plus one point of their own - giving them 3.888. This would rank them above teams from Cyprus, Croatia, Finland, Lithuania etc.. providing none of them have team coefficients as well.

Big point tonight for Pats.

Currently ahea dof Bosnia and Hungary in play. Gyor got a respectable 2-1 defeat in Germany and debrecen just gone 2-1 down in Swiotzerland. Need 2 defeats here although both will be dangerous at home.

The Bosnians are a goal down at home to Besiktas. This is really key.

BATE's win last night in Bulgaria was a disaster for us. If they reach the group stage sof the champions league it will be a full extra point and huge opportunities to score well.

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Originally Posted by gspain

BATE's win last night in Bulgaria was a disaster for us. If they reach the group stage sof the champions league it will be a full extra point and huge opportunities to score well.

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I would like to see them in the group stages but realistically they won't get a single point in the group.

Slightly off topic but Scotland are screwed this year with Rangers out & Queen of the South in the Uefa Cup.

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Originally Posted by gspain

Big point tonight for Pats.

Currently ahea dof Bosnia and Hungary in play. Gyor got a respectable 2-1 defeat in Germany and debrecen just gone 2-1 down in Swiotzerland. Need 2 defeats here although both will be dangerous at home.

The Bosnians are a goal down at home to Besiktas. This is really key.

BATE's win last night in Bulgaria was a disaster for us. If they reach the group stage sof the champions league it will be a full extra point and huge opportunities to score well.

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gspain, are you not losing the bigger picture of the 5-Year UEFA Co-Efficient measurement. Counting half-time scores and individually results. teams from many leagues will under-perform and produce terriffic results, but over 5 years a reflection of their (results) worth is seen.

1. BATE Borisov succeeding (even one leg win) along with FKB Kaunas and Anorthosis is good for all clubs in the q1 of the CL, as they continue to pioneer the way for other clubs.

2. The primary ranking Co-Efficient - the one UEFA use, not the 4 + current year by that Plat Deutsh fraulein Bert Kassiesa uses - needs to have a naturally ranking from 1 to 53 with Leagues at regular intervals of a couple of points, three at most between teams. This will aid motivation as there is another target a short distance away. The alternative is the same Leagues (lower mid-table) winning and when/if LoI get to the top of a pile the next League is too far ahead. (Please view LoI premier and First Divsion for teams grouping together and not being able to bridge gap to upper group.)

2. It's a vintage year for Belarus football, something to be celebrated.