He said that in his opinion, if you were born in the North, then you shouldn't be able to play for the Republic. He accuses McClean of "using" the north's system to get where he is.
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He said that in his opinion, if you were born in the North, then you shouldn't be able to play for the Republic. He accuses McClean of "using" the north's system to get where he is.
Is Derry City in the north's system?
Same oul' ****e, and Christ that yank was annoying!!
Yeah, the Yank was super super annoying, he read pre-written question like the boring priest off Father Ted. Fair play to Keith for putting up with the two of them, it was a bit awkward when the host said "let me know if there's anything I can do for you" to Gillespie at the end of the interview, right after hitting him with softball questions about his gambling problem.
To be fair, most North Americans can't talk to anyone about being 'colonizers'...
:rolleyes:
'Defector' James McClean is hiding behind religion, says Keith Gillespie
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sp...-16167976.html
Where do you begin with that.
Well, at least they've stopped mentioning the Good Friday Agreement...Quote:
Originally Posted by BonnieShels
:eek:Quote:
To Keith Gillespie, it’s a simple philosophy, made unnecessarily complicated by the small print of the St Andrews Agreement and issues such as national identity and dual nationality.
Keith Gillespie believes that if you are from northern Ireland you should not be allowed to play for the republic of Ireland. His opinion, like that of many others, is fairly ill-informed on this matter. Keith Gillespie mustn't be aware that nationality (and by extension national identity) is the foundation of international football. He clearly has no profound understanding or appreciation of the national identity of some people.
Elsewhere, some Sky Sports hack tweeted that Jimmy Boyce has said that "there is no doubt" that the FAI are approaching 'young NI born' players, as if it merited some kind of mention.
McClean was with Trojans in the Derry & District League and Institute in the Irish League as an amateur. He played one game for Institute in the Irish League. Only listened to the podcast once and recall them suggesting he came through the Irish League. Not sure how accurate such a claim would be, but maybe they were referring to that, or maybe they weren't up-to-speed on Derry City's status, although that seems improbable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
As yer man says above, just another case of "Same sh*te, different eejit"...
Certain people are in denial. They never had nor will have a clue.
As you've said before, the idea of forming a claim on a player due to them coming through the system (for the sake of argument, let them have Trojans, Stute and the scant, intermittent meetings with the IFA U21s) is just ridiculous. I think you touched upon it previously, but the input of friends and family - those who encouraged, clothed and fed him daily - is never mentioned. The picture painted is always one of the altruistic and magnanimous IFA pulling James McClean or whoever from the slums and catapulting them to superstardom. It's simply false, insulting and, at this stage, frankly, boring.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
Indeed. He admits it himself:Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
James McClean doesn't have to excuse himself either. The use of such terminology is indicative of a profound lack of understanding of this issue.Quote:
It’s disappointing when people don’t want to play for Northern Ireland because although we’re a small nation, we’re a very proud nation. We do come up against some of the top countries, yet pull great results out of the fire. We have fantastic support that will back us through thick and thin. I’m obviously biased, but I don’t understand why you wouldn’t want to pull on that shirt.
The FAI should be approaching all players eligible to play for them who might be able to offer something. What provoked Boyce's comment and why does he think it significant?Quote:
Elsewhere, some Sky Sports hack tweeted that Jimmy Boyce has said that "there is no doubt" that the FAI are approaching 'young NI born' players, as if it merited some kind of mention.
They should indeed. The IFA are doing likewise, as stated by Mick O'Neill last week.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
I don't know what prompted Boyce, possibly the same hack - something Gilmour if I recall correctly. I have SSN on to see if there is anything mentioned.
https://twitter.com/#!/Paul_Gilmour - this lad
As a nordy, I find that northern accent awful to listen to.Quote:
Originally Posted by joe_denilson
The Derry News will have an exclusive from James McClean as he 'hits back' at Keithy. Keep your eyes peeled...
'McClean hits back at Keith Gillespie over 'defector' claims': http://www.joe.ie/euro-2012/euro-201...aims-0025575-1
Quote:
But McClean, who has had to put up with plenty of abuse, particularly on his now defunct Twitter page, since making his debut for the Boys in Green earlier this year had little time for Gillespie’s criticism and reaffirmed his commitment to the Republic’s cause.
“It’s a joke,” the Sunderland wide man is quoted as saying in the Irish Daily Star in response to Gillespie’s comments.
“I’m Irish and I’ve always been Irish and I’ve always supported the Republic of Ireland.
“I’ve always wanted to play for the Republic of Ireland and I couldn’t be more proud that I am doing that.
“Just because I’ve grown up in Northern Ireland doesn’t change that.”
McClean has admitted that he regrets his decision to appear for Norn Iron at underage level, saying that it was “naïve” and that if the Republic of Ireland came in for him, there would be never any doubt where his allegiances lay.
Gillespie felt that by adopting such an approach that McClean was using the system and that players born in Northern Ireland should have to play for Northern Ireland.
'Fine Gael senator echoes calls for all Ireland soccer team': http://www.thejournal.ie/fine-gael-s...77309-Jun2012/
Quote:
A FING GAEL senator has echoed the calls from Sinn Féin for there to be an all Ireland soccer team saying there is no better time for the issue to be considered.
With the Republic of Ireland preparing for their Euro 2012 campaign and talk that the Republic could co-host Euro 2020, senator Catherine Noone believes there is no better time than now for the issue to be considered.
She said: “Players from both sides of the border have already proven that they can collaborate and thrive with an all-island rugby team, and I think a unified soccer team would also have considerable advantages.
“Consider the fact that the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland have never qualified for the same tournament – the opportunity cost, in this instance, is minimal.”
Her words echo those of Sinn Féin whose members called for the creation of such a team at the party’s Ard Fheis in Killarney recently, arguing that other sports such as rugby, cricket and international rules already had all island teams.
Noone encouraged the Football Association of Ireland and the North’s Irish Football Association to learn from the experience of the Irish Rugby Football Union (IRFU) which operates on an all island basis selecting players from the four provinces.
“A unified team, drawing from a deeper pool of talent, with the support of the entire island, would enhance our chances to qualify for international tournaments more regularly,” she said.
“You only need to look at the great players who have lined out for Northern Ireland in the past including George Best, Pat Jennings and Danny Blanchflower to see the potential long term benefits of merging teams from both side of the border.”
Noone acknowledged that while it was an issue for the two associations she said that many people “don’t see any real barriers to this happening”.
Oh God, where do you even start in responding to that?
Catherine Noone's been busy today.
Thing is, whilst there might be a bit of mischief on Sinn Féin's part, she sounds completely serious.
Awwww, bless her - Catherine is obviously a bit naive on these matters.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
I wonder does she understand the offside rules?
Sensible answers from Michael O'Neill in an interview with Ritchie Kelly at the launch of the Foyle Cup in Derry: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18352345
FG agree with SF??
WTF.
I enjoyed MON's interview. It's refreshing to hear an employee of the IFA talking sense for once.
I suppose there's no need for Gerry Espana Armstrong anymore...
As regards Catherine... I'll be sending a wee letter to her.
Even more refreshing to hear someone at the IFA at it. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by BonnieShels
Yeah yeah. Obviously FG and SF have convinced me of the One team in Ireland project.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
'Mon, what's not to like?
IFA must build from the bottom to keep top stars: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/op...#ixzz1ykxfAvjx
Quote:
The sleep of reason on social media networks like Twitter brings forth not so much monsters, but morons; no more so than during and after the Republic's hammering at the hands of Spain and Italy. As the team in green shipped goal after goal, the abusive tweets got both increasingly poisonous and gleeful.
Those behind the gloating and hostility on Twitter were, in large part, Northern Ireland fans. They accused the Republic and the Football Association of Ireland of being 'sectarian poachers'.
They justified their emnity towards the Republic on the grounds that the FAI has been recruiting players from the north who are, let's be blunt about, young Catholics, or nationalists.
They cited the examples of James McClean from Sunderland and Darron Gibson of Everton - both Derry-born players who opted for the southern side rather than the northern one.
In spite of claiming that they were ones objecting to what they regard as a sectarian redefinition of the two teams in Ireland - in which Catholics from the north will only play for the south - their language and tone online was itself shot through with old-fashioned sectarianism.
For the record, I prefer if young northern Catholics and nationalists opted to play for the Northern Ireland side, maintaining a tradition on the field of one team kicking with both feet.
That tradition of a religiously mixed Northern Ireland squad stretches back to the days of Pat Rice, Pat Jennings, Gerry Armstrong and Martin O'Neill.
If the leakage of young, talented Catholic players from north to south eventually turns into a flood, we could be left with the unedifying scenario of a solely Protestant team for the north, thus solidifying yet another element of northern society into rival religious-ethnic blocs.
Even when the Northern Ireland team fully reflected the religious-ethnic breakdown, there was an in-balance on the terraces of Windsor Park. Windsor was a very cold house for Catholic supporters of Northern Ireland, who had to put up with an endless soundtrack of The Sash, We Are The Billy Boys, Derry's Walls and various hymns of praise to the killers of the UVF and UDA.
In the main, at least inside the stadium, that kind of noxious atmosphere is a thing of the past. The Irish Football Association and the work of Michael Boyd and his team have won deserved praise from Fifa and Sport Against Racism Ireland for transforming the ground on international match days into a family-friendly, all-inclusive, safe arena.
The IFA and in parallel a number of Irish League clubs based in traditional unionist working-class areas have worked tirelessly to reach across not only the sectarian divide, but also towards the new ethnic communities settling in Northern Ireland.
One visible sign of that outreach programme is the numbers of teenagers in the area I grew up in, The Markets, wearing Glentoran and Crusaders shirts and tracksuits, the lads attached to these clubs' mentoring/sponsoring programmes for players from the district.
The relatively recent phenomena of young northern Catholic players opting for the Republic is, however, related to bigger political and constitutional questions surrounding Northern Ireland.
Nationalist politicians who have defended the right of Shane Duffy, Darron Gibson and James McClean have pointed to the Good Friday Agreement as the legal-constitutional basis of their right to choose to play for the south. They have pointed out that, under the 1998 accord, the right to be Irish inside the north is given full parity of esteem with those who want to declare themselves British. The right to choose is now enshrined in an international treaty, politicians like the SDLP's Pat Ramsey have asserted.
In effect, Ramsey and others are right: the agreement is written into international law and may be the reason why Fifa has been reluctant to slap a ban on young Catholics opting for the south.
In spite of their protestations, unionists now operate the basic framework of the Belfast agreement. They do so because, at its heart, the accord gave unionism something it has always sought from nationalist Ireland: the principle of consent.
Easter 1998 was, in fact, a major victory for unionism, because it resulted in the unionist veto on constitutional change being accepted by the overwhelming majority of nationalists, north and south.
The Provisional IRA ended its armed campaign without its main 'war' aim being achieved - the end of the British presence and the unionist veto.
Today, Sinn Fein talks about consent and winning over unionists to the cause of a united Ireland. In order to persuade nationalists to swallow the consent principle pill, unionists have had to sugarcoat it with concessions to those they share the island with.
These are the peripherals of political, social and cultural parity, as well as the harder, earlier demands of the negotiation process, like early release of prisoners.
Parity of esteem in terms of choosing which green jersey you don to play international football falls into that category: it is a peripheral concession on the far side of the bigger constitutional question that unionists have to accept. Meanwhile, leaving those larger existential, political questions aside, all the IFA and northern soccer can do is continue to build up a loyal tranche of young players from the grassroots game.
They need to carry on regardless with this type of approach - even if some potential stars decide their fortunes lie with the FAI in Dublin.
I thought all you eligibility scholars might like this interesting read
James McClean The North and the Republic of Ireland
Interesting and better than most.
Is this bit correct?
Recognising the unfair disadvantage to the IFA, the FIFA legal committee went as far as inviting the FAI to voluntarily “confine itself to selecting for its association teams Northern Irish players who meet one of the following requirements: a) the player was born in the Republic of Ireland, b) his biological mother or father was born in the Republic of Ireland, c) his grandmother or grandfather was born in the Republic of Ireland, or d) he has lived continuously, for at least two years, in the Republic of Ireland”.
Needless to say the FAI rejected the invitation, leaving us in the current situation.
My understanding was that CAS themselves ruled this out because Kearns' (not Cairns) rights would not be respected if such an agreement was made.
It is correct - reference the CAS Findings Paragraph 64.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
What? Sure thats just the normal rules stutts, they weren't asking them to do anything other than go along with the general laws/statuettes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Its how we have so many 2gs and 3gs playing for us.
Rodgers throws in bit of the old fashioned Paisleyite paranoia for good measure.
'Indeed, with the FAI already in a position to field an All Ireland Team, what is to stop FIFA instructing the FAI and IFA to compete jointly under the banner of Ireland?'
Even if FIFA in some fit of madness wanted to do that, they couldn't. What stops FIFA from doing that are the bleedin' FIFA statutes.
Rodgers just can't resist delving into the madness :D
Thanks, but even if the FAI had agreed CAS paragraph 90 says it would have contravened Kearns' rights?Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
(I'm in a hurry so couldn't pay it full attention)
CAS paragraph 90 refers to the imaginary gentleman's agreement that was a part of what the IFA called a case.
It's not referring to the request by FIFA for the FAI to declare an unconditional surrender.
Haven't had a chance to read the piece in full yet, but I see it's only out of the traps and straight into paranoid persecution complex territory...
A inter-associational agreement transcending or operating external to FIFA's statutory framework would have contravened the right to switch association once accorded to Kearns' under FIFA's statutes. If FIFA had applied the above criteria, Kearns would not have possessed the aforementioned right.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
In March of 2007, FIFA viewed the right of Irish nationals born north of the border to play for the FAI as exposing the IFA to a "one-way situation".* CAS, in paragraph 70, interpreted FIFA as having viewed this supposed situation as "unfair" on the IFA. FIFA never described anything as "unfair". After later analysing the matter in greater detail at the end of 2007, FIFA came to the conclusion that their existing statutes were in fact sufficient to deal with the matter of Irish player eligibility. I think it is then fair to say they acknowledged their statutes were operating as intended.
*Whilst the situation may appear to be "one-way" on the face of it, I believe such to be a simplistic and lazy analysis in that only Irish nationals, and not those in possession of only British nationality (the prerequisite to playing for NI), are eligible to play for the FAI. Dual British and Irish nationals born north of the border cannot be simply designated as default IFA players. The two nationalities are to be treated as two distinct entities and no association can lay claim over those players in possession of both (until such players become tied to either association, of course). Eligibility for one association is not dependent on eligibility for the other. Does that make sense? It's quite an abstract concept to explain.
Thought this was interesting. The FAW have corrected media speculation which suggested that Angel Rangel was eligible to play for Wales by virtue of having resided there for 5 years: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18833190
Quote:
The Football Association of Wales has confirmed Swansea City defender Angel Rangel is not eligible to represent Wales.
The 29-year-old has resided in Wales for five years since joining Swansea from Terrassa in June 2007.
Rangel has made over 200 games for Swansea and was a regular in the Premier League last season.
The FAW have confirmed Rangel is not eligible under an agreement the four home nations have lodged with Fifa.
Other than birthplace, parents or grandparents players can only represent one of the home nations if they have had five years of continuous education up to the age of 18 in that country.
That ruling, introduced by Fifa in 2009, has led to England-born Crystal Palace midfielder Andy Dorman winning three caps for Wales.
Stoke City defender Ryan Shawcross, who was raised in north east Wales, is also eligible under the same ruling but has previously turned down Wales' advances.
Really? So where does that leave Owen Hargreaves?
Hargreaves had a Welsh mother and an English father.