Spain V Republic of Ireland - Wednesday, 12 June 2013 - Friendly - Yankee Stadium

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Originally Posted by osarusan

I've often wondered about that myself. Is it a simple interpretation of the 'offside when the ball was kicked and interfering' or is it because the player coming from an offside position helped them get a better run and consequent jump than the other player?

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Not 100% relevant, but in hockey there is no offside rule (probably because lumping the ball over the top every time is less of an option). A lad I used to play with would wait until the chaos of a corner or something to slip over the endline and sit down behind the goal. Everyone would forget about him (sure he wasn't even on the pitch!), until our next attack, where he would suddenly pop up beside the keeper, 30 yards away from the nearest defender screaming for the ball. Got us a lot of goals before people started copping on

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Originally Posted by geysir

The one I don't get, is a player being ruled offside when coming from an offside position to challenge for a kick out from his own goalie.

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Just for clarification, you can only be offside from a kick from the hands, not from a goal kick after the ball has gone wide.

I imagine that, as part of the point of offside is to stop huge long balls, then without this offside, you'd see huge kicks going right to the other box, with forwards dragging the defensive line back because there's no offside if you jump to head the ball.

Cox cost us more than those 2 goals.

Interesting, I just watched the first 65 mins as I had to go to work, but I'e recorded it and ill be watching the rest when I go home. I think only 1 review here I'd agree with.

Granted, Spain were almost at full strength, and we were effectively a mixture of reserves and first team, had it really mattered Spain could have and would have won this game like the Gdansk affair. They could have been 2 up or more before half time! I think people as usual are getting carried away because we were not at full strength and saw a lot of new young faces.

Hendrick was anonymous in his first half cameo, there is nothing you can say about him, as he barely touched the ball. McCarthy got some good touches, but you could hardly call him excellent when they had 73% possession in the first half. He is a midfielder and if/when he gets on the ball he loses/misplaced pass it everytime then he was hardly outstanding or excellent.

We were completely over-run in midfield as expected, and our full backs were exposed time and time again, Kelly more so, thank god for a narrow pitch or it would have been a lot worse.

Sammon is played for his height and strength, I've seen him do nothing with it so far except against Austria for the ball onto McClean. He has a good first touch as much as he has a bad first touch. His run for the goal was all wrong, he has pace and he had a few yards on pique, he shouldn't have narrowed his angle the way he did in order to extend that yardage on pique.

Coleman should have learnt a lot with that game, the importance of knowing when to run and when to hold onto possession he lost it a couple of times too easily.

I don't think there is much positives to take other than we got to see a lot of the next generation players and a whole host of lads who wont with a bit of luck get near the team for the important games, play with pride and heart. I only saw the first 65 as I say, unless we did something outstanding in the next 25 mins I don't see any justification in most of the reviews here. One thing that was against us and suited Spains greater technical ability was the speed of the pitch, we found it difficult for the first 30 mins to cope with the speed.

Its almost depressing watching Spain at this stage.

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Originally Posted by Grafter

Never feel good after a defeat but it was heartening.

Stephen Quinn did look assured when he came on, McClean's aggression on the park good to see too.
Really the team can go on their hols in good spirits after this game with hope in their hearts for the Autumn.

P.S. Forde really had the 40's matinee idol look going with the hair tonight;)

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Forde is like a young Jack Dempsey.

http://www.google.com/search?q=jack+...ey%3B331%3B450

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Originally Posted by paul_oshea

McCarthy got some good touches, but you could hardly call him excellent when they had 73% possession in the first half. He is a midfielder and if/when he gets on the ball he loses/misplaced pass it everytime then he was hardly outstanding or excellent.

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When your backs are to the wall it takes a different kind of 'excellent' to perform well. When he did receive possession, options were non-existent to it was better to play loose balls into channels rather than dwell on it and be caught in a more dangerous areas. Plus, "every time" is a massive exaggeration.

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Originally Posted by Fixer82

Forde is like a young Jack Dempsey.

http://www.google.com/search?q=jack+...ey%3B331%3B450

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Ha, good one!

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Originally Posted by DeLorean

When your backs are to the wall it takes a different kind of 'excellent' to perform well. When he did receive possession, options were non-existent to it was better to play loose balls into channels rather than dwell on it and be caught in a more dangerous areas. Plus, "every time" is a massive exaggeration.

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But that's the whole point, people are bigging him up to be this top class midfielder, so even against Spain, he should be able get on the ball more, and at least dictate the play more/better. I said I watched the first 65, I recall 4 misplaced passes in the first half, a couple of frees against, 2 blocks and 2 interceptions, he tried to get in on them but wasn't able dispossess - most of the time. To say he was outstanding/excellent is a massive exaggeration.

Fair enough, I think he was a lot better than that assessment given the circumstances. We were starved, as most teams are against Spain, of possession in decent areas so it wasn't really an evening for him to be able to dictate too much in an attacking sense. I would have definitely considered him one of our 'outstanding' players, to take the term literally, along with Sammon and Coleman.

Ya relatively compared to the likes of McShane, kelly, hendrick, keogh, O'dea, keane, sammon he was outstanding, because none of them did anything really. But he was not oustanding outside of any comparison to his peers on the Irish team.

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Originally Posted by paul_oshea

Granted, Spain were almost at full strength, and we were effectively a mixture of reserves and first team, had it really mattered Spain could have and would have won this game like the Gdansk affair. They could have been 2 up or more before half time! I think people as usual are getting carried away because we were not at full strength and saw a lot of new young faces.

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had it really mattered maybe we would have raised our game also. who knows?
cant stand this attitude when we do some way well that its only because our better opposition werent at full pace etc. The game has to be taken and analysed for what it was and what actually happened. spain didnt go in at ht 2 goals in front because they didnt. if the 1st half mcshane header and salmons chance are put away we could have gone in 2 up.

yes our ball retention wasnt great and we could have been more clinical with the few chances we got but for the squad we have (full strength or otherwise) i think the last two weeks have given some optimism for the future. fair play to the players and management for that.

people need to start throwing some positive comment towards this team and get behind them without constantly searching for gripes and moans. i think our squad have earned it with their efforts over the last two weeks in particular. there should be far more hype and excitement about this team than there is and in my opinion its because many believe its below them to give their support. its seen as a safer option to follow the crowd and be negative really

Spain would have been lucky to be 2-0 up at half time. They hit the bar with a fortuitous long-range effort but apart from that they create little and the Irish defence looked very comfortable. On the other hand, Sammon should definitely have scored in the first half, and we were denied two certain goals in quick succession by Casillas in the second half.

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Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin

Spain would have been lucky to be 2-0 up at half time. They hit the bar with a fortuitous long-range effort but apart from that they create little and the Irish defence looked very comfortable. On the other hand, Sammon should definitely have scored in the first half, and we were denied two certain goals in quick succession by Casillas in the second half.

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I thought that ball (from Pedro?) that hit the bar was a superb shot from the edge of the box, came after a piece of dazzling skill.
In that instance, I thought we were the fortuitous ones.

We drew against an average england who were focusing on Brazil, and beat 10 man georgia and the faroes, people need to take a reality check, its not a moan, its factual based arguments.

CD, iniesta was in from what i remember or maybe pedro and should have done a lot better, another chance went across goal. That sammon chance was never going in, McShane should have done better with a free header alright.

The irish defence were all over the place for the first 15-20 mins. We were getting cut open, with some better finishing or more urgency spain could have scored.

I think people are getting carried away with a 2 goal loss and some wins against mediocre opposition. I'm not moaning I'm just stating fact. The real test will come against Austria and Sweden and apart from gaining confidence from winning, I don't see any difference in the performance or the difficulty of the task at hand in september based on Traps team and formation, now than I did 3 weeks ago, with the exception of the introduction of Hoolahan and the hope he will start in September.

Btw I just spoke with my Spanish colleague who said the Spanish media reported, that when Ireland went 1-0 down they actually looked to play a bit and became a bit more open, which made their task easier, but also that they became more aggressive(not in a good way), he also said they felt that it could have easily been 3 or 4-0.

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Originally Posted by paul_oshea

I'm not moaning I'm just stating fact.

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Yes Paul, your opinions are ....fact!
And your "facts" are miserly. :)

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Originally Posted by geysir

I thought that ball (from Pedro?) that hit the bar was a superb shot from the edge of the box, came after a piece of dazzling skill.
In that instance, I thought we were the fortuitous ones.

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I meant fortuitous in the sense it wasn't an obvious goalscoring opportuning, but yes we were lucky the bar saved us.

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Originally Posted by paul_oshea

CD, iniesta was in from what i remember or maybe pedro and should have done a lot better, another chance went across goal. That sammon chance was never going in, McShane should have done better with a free header alright.

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You can't say Iniesta was in and should have done better then discount Sammon's much clearer opportunity. Sammon had easily the best scoring opportunity of anybody in the first half and he stuffed it up.

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The irish defence were all over the place for the first 15-20 mins. We were getting cut open, with some better finishing or more urgency spain could have scored.

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Spain didn't lack urgency, they lacked the precision to break down our strong defending. It's a common method of discounting a decent Irish performance, saying the opposition lacked their usual zip when in fact we just defended well and were a bit lucky that their passes didn't stick.

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I think people are getting carried away with a 2 goal loss and some wins against mediocre opposition. I'm not moaning I'm just stating fact. The real test will come against Austria and Sweden and apart from gaining confidence from winning, I don't see any difference in the performance or the difficulty of the task at hand in september based on Traps team and formation, now than I did 3 weeks ago, with the exception of the introduction of Hoolahan and the hope he will start in September.

Btw I just spoke with my Spanish colleague who said the Spanish media reported, that when Ireland went 1-0 down they actually looked to play a bit and became a bit more open, which made their task easier, but also that they became more aggressive(not in a good way), he also said they felt that it could have easily been 3 or 4-0.

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Who's getting carried away? Most of us were in the doldrums after Austria, thought we should have taken the game more to England, have to write off the Georgia game and the Faroes are the Faroes. We did OK and look to have some good players coming through.

The Spanish papers also hailed Casillas for his world class saves that probably won Spain the match.

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Originally Posted by jbyrne

people need to start throwing some positive comment towards this team and get behind them without constantly searching for gripes and moans. i think our squad have earned it with their efforts over the last two weeks in particular. there should be far more hype and excitement about this team than there is and in my opinion its because many believe its below them to give their support. its seen as a safer option to follow the crowd and be negative really

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Hardly.
You don't have to be a pessimist to see this team is very limited in its meaningful abilities, handicapped (usually) by a blinkered old fool running it and whose main credit is to run themselves into the ground. If only in an effort to correct their (very many) own collective mistakes.

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

Hardly.
You don't have to be a pessimist to see this team is very limited in its meaningful abilities, handicapped (usually) by a blinkered old fool running it and whose main credit is to run themselves into the ground. If only in an effort to correct their (very many) own collective mistakes.

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all things are relative. we have our most limited squad in decades yet for the third campaign in a row are in serious contention as we hit the business end of things.

give realism a go about where we are vs where we should be with what talent we have at our disposal. you might enjoy following this team a bit more (or even at all)

I think realistically we can hope for, on a good day with a full strength team, to compete and stay with the likes of Spain for a full 90 minutes with the rub of the green. We'll more than likely never get to that level. But neither will nearly every other international side.
We have good players like Forde, McCarthy, Long, Hoolahan, Coleman.
We have not got a whole lot on the bench when our top performers are injured.
We don't have a huge depth of talent to choose from.
I think last night's performance was heartening in that we were playing one of the greatest teams of all time and we gave them a good go for what was almost our B team and defended well and had a couple of chances.

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Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy

Hardly.
You don't have to be a pessimist to see this team is very limited in its meaningful abilities, handicapped (usually) by a blinkered old fool running it and whose main credit is to run themselves into the ground. If only in an effort to correct their (very many) own collective mistakes.

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This looks like something you'd suffer reading in the Indo, which is why I stopped reading the paper of lies back when they invented a story to force the man out of his job. Blinkered old fool indeed.

Played 13 since the Euros. Won 6, drawn 4 and lost 3 v Germany, Greece and now Spain. We're still level with 2nd place in the qualifying group and our main rivals don't look to be that strong so we're still in with a shout.

I think most of us would have taken that when we were coming home from Poland, there's fukk all to be taken, positive or negative, from last night's game. We actually created more last night than we did in Moscow last campaign, it's nothing new.