Poor Standard of Ref's in the Eircom League.

Feel i have to rant about it.Im sure ye all agree with me too.Its the basic and obvious decisions that are the most annoying thing about it.Players and managers work hard on the training ground all week and can go out and play well but still come out on the wrong end of a game because of a ref.Too often this season refs decisions have been the "wild cards" that have won and lost games for teams.I know its part of football but in this league a decision by a ref seems to tip the balance more often.I think the answer is professional referees have to be brought in.As the league gets more professional the refs have to aswell.

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Originally Posted by eamo1

Feel i have to rant about it.Im sure ye all agree with me too.Its the basic and obvious decisions that are the most annoying thing about it.Players and managers work hard on the training ground all week and can go out and play well but still come out on the wrong end of a game because of a ref.Too often this season refs decisions have been the "wild cards" that have won and lost games for teams.I know its part of football but in this league a decision by a ref seems to tip the balance more often.I think the answer is professional referees have to be brought in.As the league gets more professional the refs have to aswell.

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Getting professional refs guarantees nothing. Look at the Premiership. This season has been the worst for some time as regards refereeing standards, bad judgment calls and inconsistency.

There is also add cost in having full time refs. It takes a long time to develop and train to become a good ref and even then some will get it wrong. Agree full time refs would (can only) improve the situation but it wont happen over night.

It is seriously brutal so far this year. At least MNS is highlighting that this is actually the case. If refs can recognise that it needs improvement and efforts are made to do so then its a step in the right direction.

I dunno, its a tough one but something has to be done.

"M is for the mistakes we sometimes make. ...Surely a bit of controversy is part of the games appeal."

I understand refs will make mistakes, but it's not unusual for refs in the league to get the rules wrong, eg Hancock let 2 UCD players rejoin the game against Rovers last weekend without waving them on (if he did subtlrly wave them on and I missed it he let one on from behind the goal line and one on so he could dive straight into a tackle!)

Buttimer doesn't even know how many subs a team is allowed to name ffs!

And Alan Kelly doesn't know that a goal stands even if it hits a post at the back of the net and comes back out!

Eddie Foley could be a great linesman....if it wasnt for that damned offside rule

With every game in the premier now being recorded for MNS the referees should have the decency to admit mistakes. Wes Charles should never have got a straight red last week and Anto Murphy should receive a warning for unsporting behaviour at the very least :mad:

I'm not a ref but I've always felt that blaming the officials is a total cop out.

Yes there have been times over the years where I felt we had been done huge injustices (play off in Drogheda (Feb'03) anyone?), but overall, you do ttyour work on the pitch, you hope for your share of fair play and good luck and you accept the outcomes as being overall a fair reflection of what you put in.

The heavy reliance of the governing body on Dublin based officials always has our paranoia atennae raised, so if there is genuine bias - let's produce a few refs of our own.

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Originally Posted by MyTown

I'm not a ref but I've always felt that blaming the officials is a total cop out.

Yes there have been times over the years where I felt we had been done huge injustices (play off in Drogheda (Feb'03) anyone?), but overall, you do ttyour work on the pitch, you hope for your share of fair play and good luck and you accept the outcomes as being overall a fair reflection of what you put in.

The heavy reliance of the governing body on Dublin based officials always has our paranoia atennae raised, so if there is genuine bias - let's produce a few refs of our own.

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I'm sorry, but its not a one or two mistakes thing, this is big decisions EVERY game which change games. Its never solely the refs fault but they certainly have more of an impact than they should.

My example above. It is clear to all that Eddie Foley actually doesnt understand the offside rule, e.g. he gave offside from a throw in recently.

I dont go in for this Dublin bias thing I just think they're ****e.

They are amateur/volunteer referees & they make mistakes. I am sure they don't do it deliberately. For my money it is the linesmen that are the problem - a lot of them let the referee make decisions when the ball is out of play...

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Originally Posted by micls

I dont go in for this Dublin bias thing I just think they're ****e.

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I am going to print this off and frame it. Finally, a Cork fan who realises there is no such thing as a Dublin bias.

Referees are always going to make mistakes. It's pretty hard to get everything 100 per cent right but what annoys me is the whole jersey farce that Buttimer keeps stirring up. It lowers the credibility of the league and it's just fussiness taken to the extreme.

Apart from that, I don't tend to remember which referees make which poor decisions considering there are so many.

Also, AFAIK, the top leagues do not have full time refs. IIRC, Pierluigi Collina and Graham Poll were two of a very few group that were full-time refs.

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Originally Posted by pete

They are amateur/volunteer referees & they make mistakes. I am sure they don't do it deliberately. For my money it is the linesmen that are the problem - a lot of them let the referee make decisions when the ball is out of play...

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Amateurs/volunteers don't get paid about 400-500 quid a game Pete. But I'd agree the linesmen are worse.

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Originally Posted by seand

I understand refs will make mistakes, but it's not unusual for refs in the league to get the rules wrong, eg Hancock let 2 UCD players rejoin the game against Rovers last weekend without waving them on (if he did subtlrly wave them on and I missed it he let one on from behind the goal line and one on so he could dive straight into a tackle!)

Buttimer doesn't even know how many subs a team is allowed to name ffs!

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Indeed. The linesman at one of our home games (I think Sligo but I'm not certain) repeatedly gave throw ins when the ball was on the line and one of our players was given offside from a throw in pre-season.

Making mistakes over whether a tackle was a foul or close offsides is annoying but understandable (we've all given out about tackles at games and then changed our minds after seeing them on TV) but there's no excuse for well-paid refs not knowing simple rules.

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Originally Posted by superfrank

Also, AFAIK, the top leagues do not have full time refs. IIRC, Pierluigi Collina and Graham Poll were two of a very few group that were full-time refs.

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It's only the Premier League in England that have full-time contracted officials - Howard Webb (who is the best referee in England at the moment) will be the only Full-Time official at the European Championships this summer.

The only real advantage of having full timers is that they're fitter physical wise - stamina and such improved. The training sessions and feedback meetings that they have on the Select Group in England do happen here as well.

As Dave McKeon said on MNS - the top 8 or 9 officials on the list basically fit in the demands made of officials if they were full time anyway (training several times a week - if not every day, video reviews of games etc)


We have 50 or so officials on the Panel in the eL - if we apply the English model to this then it'll cost the FAI the grand total of €5,150,000 per year to pay them on the standard contract used in this field.

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Originally Posted by Longfordian

Amateurs/volunteers don't get paid about 400-500 quid a game Pete. But I'd agree the linesmen are worse.

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Fair enough but it is not like we can fire the existing refs & promote all those brilliant refs who are being held back. I have no reason to believe the current refs are not the best in Ireland.

alot of the problem is the fact dont explain decisions after games mns is a forum why not let ref come on and explain why he balls it up or why he believes he is right, only a thought:D

My pet hate is the linesmen who wait for the referee to award a corner, goal kick and whatever which way the throw ins go, only then move their flag in the direction that the ref gives. Cowards!

Tonight and over the weekend take notice of who the culprits are - these linos with no balls of their own should be named and shamed.:mad:

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Originally Posted by superfrank

Also, AFAIK, the top leagues do not have full time refs. IIRC, Pierluigi Collina and Graham Poll were two of a very few group that were full-time refs.

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Collina was an accountant. His current position may be full time, but he was a part time ref.

Refereeing is bloody tough. The number of calls I get wrong from the stands is enormous. The ref might be a bit closer, but he still only has one pair of eyes and a very human brain. I'm forever ****ed off at people who watch six replays of a close call on TV before making a biased judgement that fits their first impression and criticising the referee for not making the same call.

However, a number of good points have been raised above regarding refs making errors regarding the rules. This is something that should and can be rectified.

we need a completely independent body to monitor their performances using the footage which rte now have, with a situation where the refs can be suspended for poor performances.

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Originally Posted by BobtheDrog

we need a completely independent body to monitor their performances using the footage which rte now have, with a situation where the refs can be suspended for poor performances.

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ye i agree with that big time