Noel O'Connor

It has been suggested to me by an Eircom League employee that one of the main causes that we're in the mire is that Noel O'Connor is no longer with us.In fairness, yer man made a few very valid points. He maintained that even though our league positions in the past two seasons didn't mirror it, he felt that we had started to make good, if only slowly steady progress, on the playing front. The league cup success and being screwed by poor finishing and tosspot referees is proof of that. But where the crux of the matter comes in is the amount of off the scenes work he did. He organised training pitches, match transport, fundraising activities, the under 21's and it is unknown as to the amount of personal finance he put into the club while trying to run a business of his own. It now has come to light that he jumped at the chance to be Cork number 2, because of the committees belief in John Purcell ahead of him. He questioned Purcells ability to fulfill promises about ficticous revenue, and saw the writing on the wall. You could say he jumped ship, but that's hardly fair on someone as dedicated as he was. I believe the club are struggling for training facilities, have no fundraising in place, have to travel to away games in cars and have no 21's.
My view on all this is: If there was no John Purcell, then O'Connor would have stayed. Then you would have had all of the above, minus the Kerry boys and Derek McCarthy but plus Brian Morrisroe and maybe one other. You also would have Mike Kerley as his assistant who would learn a lot from O'Connor for when he ultimately took over. And vice-versa, Noel would have had top quality advice from someone who has played at the highest levels. I believe we'd be top two now if we had the above set-up...but the we'll never know now, will we??

so what is your point?

I'm not trying to make a point..I'm simply relaying an opinion of someone I spoke to at the FAI offices. I do think there are some valid points there, though given your antipathy towards the man, I wouldn't expect you to see it. Anyway, I don't want to start a slagging match over something thats only hypothetical, so forget I said that.

There are a lot of valid points in there Joe and I do feel that Noel was under-rated but I was finally updating my website today and realised that under Noel we won only one of our last 13 league games last season. Noel brought in and developed some excellent young players and even players who didn't get on with him recognised him as a talented and astute coach. The League Cup victory must also be recognised as an excellent achievement. However there were also many questions about Noel's ability. Why couldn't the League Cup winning side, who beat four premier league teams on their way to glory, perform like that week in and week out, eventually finishing in a re-election position that year. Why did so many players leave the club during his reign while others who remained on had little or no relationship with the man. Tactically he was average at best, some good moves countered by the banishment of Welderick to the bench and a seeming refusal to use his substitutes when they were needed. Given the resources (or lack of) available to him he can hardly be judged to have failed in his two-year tenure. But one look at the league tables from that time will show that he was no raging success either!

This is interesting - though as Joe said there is no point going on about hypothetical situations. It seems clear from his post though that O'Connor (irrespective of his footballing nous - we'll never ever agree on that anyway) was a driving force off the field. He obviously had a lot of energy and commitment for the club. Compare this to the seeming inertia of the current members who from what I can see are not doing anything really proactive in the current crisis - despite obvious positive sentiment towards the club - except waiting for an investor to come in. I don't know anything except what has been posted here about potential investors being prevented by the boards unwillingness to step aside so I can't criticise them on that score.

Whether we would be in this situation if Noel was still here is a moot point - however it is safe to say that if he was here there would likely be more energy coming from the club in finding a solution and being open to supporters club suggestions.

I'm not trying to portray him as a raging success either SLK, but looking back on what you said I'll make the following remarks:Players that left such as Ray O'Halloran (coming to end of career) David Dunphy (arrogant overrated thug) Gareth Ryan (no need to comment) Derek McCarthy was a big mistake but from what I gather the blame is not 100% on the butchers side. Weldrick was never got rid off, and I believe that he had some issues outside of the game which were causing problems for him on the pitch. Then when you look at what he brought in or up through the ranks: Eoin Keating, Gareth Cooney, Brendan Sweeney, Steven O'Flynn, Paul Finnucane, Conor Molan, Colm Heffernan, Graham Loughman, Mike Kerley (back) Ciaran Foley...I'd say he imported better than he exported, wouldn't you??? Anyway, my point is that the club would be a lot more stable if he was still involved...maybe the progress this season is because the division is the worst its ever ever been, maybe its not, but I'd rather learn to walk before Icould run any day....it's better for the future.

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Originally posted by joeSoap
I'm not trying to portray him as a raging success either SLK

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That's a relief! :p We're basically in agreement then!

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Originally posted by joeSoap
Players that left such as Ray O'Halloran (coming to end of career) David Dunphy (arrogant overrated thug) Gareth Ryan (no need to comment) Derek McCarthy was a big mistake but from what I gather the blame is not 100% on the butchers side. Weldrick was never got rid off, and I believe that he had some issues outside of the game which were causing problems for him on the pitch.

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They weren't the only players who left though. Ger O'Connor, Jason Purcell, Anthony Ryan, Mike Ahearne, Mike Heath, Paul Harmon and a handful of others too. I'm not suggesting that O'Connor was responsible for all or even most of those departures but regardless of Noel's undoubted attributes his inter-personal skills aren't the best. I quite like the guy and have always gotten on with him but that's beyond debate.

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Originally posted by joeSoap
I'd say he imported better than he exported, wouldn't you???

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Couldn't agree more but it's still undeniable that we'd be in a stronger position on the pitch if we'd still retained some of the players we've shed in recent years. Some of these departures have nothing to do with football but if you added Fyffe, Welderick, Hughes, Paul Harmon and even Dunphy (looking good for Kilkenny these days) to our current squad then we'd be stronger than we are. The five players I mention are certainly better than three or four players we have hanging around on the squad. But yeah, I agree with your point, Noal was putting a good team together and if he'd stayed we might even have retained Ricardo. :(

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Originally posted by joeSoap
Anyway, my point is that the club would be a lot more stable if he was still involved

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Probably so yeah, changing managers is a bit tumultous at the best of times.

Fyffe-Gone to Greece singing for the summer
Weldo-Gone for the summer to the States
Hughes-Gone to Jersey,
All of the above were leaving anyway regardless and will all be available again endish of season or next.
Paul Harmon-Alcoholic who won't even train properly for the 'View
Dunphy-Thug..leopards never change their spots
Ger O'Connor-Never good enough in my opinion
Jason Purcell-Past it at LOI level-admits it himself
Anthony Ryan-Class player...wheres he gone??
Mike Ahearne-Decent junior player but thats all folks
Mike Heath-got huff 'cos he felt he was better than Jimmy at the time...walked off with his ball and never came out to play again. Nice attitude for a semi-professional footballer.

...with you about Dunphy. I always thought he was a fine attacking fullback and scored some crackers too! Seems like hes doing well for the Cats aswell.

Going back to the initial post in this thread:

So it's all Purcell's fault you think?

Give the man a break!! What about the 25,000 euro he is going to raise from a skipathon? Maybe he was misquoted about the 100,000 euros he was to have in the bank before the start of the season... ;)

LOL