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http://www.rte.ie/news/2005/1206/conservative.html
David Cameron.
I like the look of the guy.
39 is an astonishing age to be leader there like.
There's a big anti-Labour feeling going in Britain from what i've read recently and there hopeing his new young bla bla bla image will sail them into Downing Street on the crest of a wave.
I think Gordon Brown won't work out that well really especially in England.
But its probably different policies the tories need rather than a different leader.
Yeah Risteard.
Sad thing is New Labour could have had it all - they had a big majority, a youthful bunch of ministers etc.
Then the spin began and they merely became Tory-lite. Infighting, gigantic egos and Blair's Presidential style didn't help either.
Alaistar Campbell was effective in his own way but became the story far too often and exhibited breath-taking arrogance all the time.
When Blair shacked up with Bush for the Iraq obscenity he blew it all away.
Even The Guardian and Observer are given him a regular kicking these days.
On Radio 5 Live this morning, on Victoria Derbyshire's programme, I was surprised at how negative the reaction to Cameron was, though, but, then, phone-ins don't tell much anyway.
It's amazing how anti-Blair the UK has become, isn't it?
You living in England?
What you reckon Camerons election chances are?
Surely they're getting sick of Labour in a similar way as they were sick of the Tories in the 90s?
Cameron exudes the confidence Bliar did in 97. It's clear he has modelled himself on the same smiles and spin that won it for new labour.
Under it all though he is still a Tory and if the English are stupid enough to re-elect the Tories then they must have the shortest memories of any nation on this earth.
I'm leaving if this country elects the Tories. Fair enough, the National Assembly for Wales has a lot of governmental power now, but really, having the Tories in Westminister can only do harm.
It scared the ****e out of me when I first saw him. We have identical haircuts!!!
Not mad into English politics but I'venoticed it on
Sky News the past few days. Seems an alright chap, I can't see how anyone can be worse then Tony.
New Labour = Tory anyway. There is no difference, if anything Cameron will move the tories to the centre and leave blair on his own to the right. FFS he's even re-introducing Grant Maintained schools as his own idea...Quote:
Originally Posted by Soper
I understand that, however I feel that a party which has *some* actual left wingers as backbenchers will serve me better than a bunch of fox hunting ol' chaps.
Pre 1997, and probably through 1998 I would've agreed with you. The left wing back benchers usually bottle it in the end - how many votes has blair actually been defeated on (answer is 1 afaik).Quote:
Originally Posted by Soper
Cameron himself made an interesting point regarding the Tories that neatly summised their problem.
Research has shown that if you explain a certain policy to people, and they like it, if you then tell them that it is a Tory policy a large number of the same people will then decide they no longer like it !
The Tories obviously have a serious image problem. Major image surgery is the only answer to this - even more than Labour required in the mid 1990's. Cameron is making the right noises re this, but I'm not convinced that the Tory party itself has the appetite to make the changes that are required without fragmenting.
As someone who is regularly out canvassing in South London council estates, I can confirm that Labour in general, and Blair in particular, are deeply unpopular in what should be their guaranteed traditional heartlands. The problem for voters, however, is that there is no acceptable or viable alternative at the moment. The Tories are considered unacceptable, and whilst the Lib Dems are popular they're not seen as viable contenders for government. I doubt this situation will have changed to any great degree by 2009/10, so I think we'll be stuck with Labour for yet another term that would bring them close to Thatcher/Major's 18 year period in office. They'd doubtless be reduced in numbers, but still in power.
Having said all that, politics is a funny aul business, and you never know what could happen in an instant to change all that.....! :)
We vote in Fianna Fail every election - now there is stupidity and short mindedness of the highest order.Quote:
Originally Posted by Speranza
Wouldn't it be great for a change though both here and in england if we could have a good old political slagging match about principles and policies without the stupid grins.
Oh for a bit of choice.
No, Risteard, I get Radio 5 live via the Sky satellite (add channels0 set up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Risteard
I agree, that people are getting sick of New Labour but my point was that Blair has made so many stupid and arrogant ****-ups even many in his own party are throwing their hands up in despair.
Dunno about Cameron yet. He didn't fair that well when working in the background for other Tories but that's probably a bit harsh on him TBH.
I've always been inclined towards Labour but the utter cyniscism of Blair and co. over the past few years in particular has beena real turn off.
Anyway, it doesn't matter since I don't live in England but I'm interested in politics worldwide hence my replies to you.
abd don't get me started on President Chimpy McFlightsuit:mad:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/cartoons/s...661933,00.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/cartoons/s...656182,00.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/cartoons/s...627795,00.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/cartoons/s...570441,00.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/cartoons/s...537741,00.html
I LOVE Steve Bell's cartoons in the Graunaid,:D
BTW Steve very best of luck to you in your campaigning....meant to say that to you before.Quote:
Originally Posted by dcfcsteve
Just curious, has Labour's policies in ANY way impacted on those estates you mentioned. Other than the odd new community centre and so on. You remind me of the Guardian a few weeks ago when Bliar visited a tough estate and the PE machine had a small area of the estate "cleaned up" for the inevitable Bliar photo-op. Always cosmetic with the fcuker isn't it? And I remembe, y'know, what I was doing the night in 1997 when he swept to power and thinking what he might achieve in Norn Iron with that massive majority and so on.
Remember my bellyaching about politicians a few months ago?:D A very good buddy of mine here in Beeslow (played for all my footie teams and is still involved with Beeslow FC) topped the poll in late 90s in local elections and remains resolutely (despite offers from parties) an independent. He told me lately that he feels dirty after meetings with some party politicians and their schemes and double-speak. That reminds me of Bliar and co and the Tories of course as well.
Do you, personally, not get p!ssed off and frustrated when you have to deal with these slimeballs in the course of your political work.:confused:
Tip my hat to you I do, it would drive me even madder ***than I am now
***(double meaning - mad as in angry with poliicians, ok, MOST politicians, but also mad as in insane/daft/looney - the latter which I cheerfully admit to but am comfortable with LOL)
David Cameron's election as Tory leader has certainly raised eyebrows, he only became an MP in 2001. Yes, there is a New Labour legacy about his election. However, the Thatcherhouse in Formby, Merseyside had the Union Flag at half mast.
Thanks Hamish - there's a long way to go betweennow and next May ! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by sirhamish
Labour nationally has limited impact upon local neighbourhoods, by virtue of the system. They obviously influence the costs of living, broader availability of jobs etc for people, but the micro stuff that affects your every day and on-going quality of life - like local policing, housing, schools/education, health etc - is primarily organised at a Local Authority level. So Blairs and Brown's work doesn't really filter down too far.
With regards Labour's performance on-the-ground, they ahve been nothing short of disastrous for a lot of inner-cities. There are swathes of the country where Labour has been running councils unchallenegd for decades, and that has resulted in complacency, arrogance and downright incompetence. Taking my own Council in London - Lambeth - as an example of their impact. When Labour lost outright control of Lambeth Council in 2002 the place was in a mess and bordering on Bankruptcy (it used to be called 'Loony Lambeth' as a reflection of how poorly managed the borough was) :
- The body that assesses Councils in Britain had given Lambeth the lowest possible assessment rating of 'Poor'.
- The Council had a deficit of £28m in its General Fund (i.e. it's working capital account) and an overall debt level of £840m - larger than some 3rd world countries !
- The District Auditor refused to sign-off their accounts within the legal time limit.
- The borough had the second-worst Council Tax collection rate in England and Wales.
- It had no clear record of all the property it owned, had £14m worth of property that it DID know it owned being squatted, was losing legal possession of a number of such properties to squatters in the courts, and even had to pay £1m to get rid of a group of squatters in a large mansion block next to Oval cricket ground (Oval Mansions).
- Introduced a social housing allocation scheme in July 2000, based on date of application rather than assessment of need, that was subsequently declared illegal by the High Court in 2002.
- Failed to recognise that there was a shortage of secondary school places within the borough - despite being repeatedly told so - and embarked instead upon a series of primary school closures to save money (including one reopened only 9mths earlier by David Blunkett, at a revamp cost of £1m).
- Had its Community Safety functions put under 'special measures' and the direct control of the hoem Secretary in Feb 2002, due to repeasetd failures of their provision.
- Social Services in the Borough were likewise put under Ministerial Directions as a result of 2 separate reports that damned the provision.
- The Department of Health declared that no children were safe in the care of Lambeth, as Police checks were not being conducted in-time on Council staff working with children
By March 2005, the new majority Lib Dem administration had made the following changes :
- Built-up General Fund reserves of £23.8m.
- Paid off over £150m of the ongoing debt (saving £6m p.a. in interest).
- Had the borough's accounts signed-off by the District Auditor without comment for the first time in 17 years.
- Increased council tax collection rates to 92.03% and growing (3,300% higher than the average national increase across the same period), whilst keeping the average tax rate the 7th lowest in London (out of 33 boroughs).
- The Council's overall performance rating has gone up from 'poor' to 'weak' (Dec 2004 CPA Report), with the conclusion that "“Lambeth is an improving council. The council’s functioning has improved through focused leadership, strong management, financial stability, and effective partnerships. These provide a foundation for continued improvement of services. Key services have improved since June 2002.”
- Had the Councils education provision rated as 'highly satisfactory', and the overall standard of schools approaching the national average (a 6% improvement in exam performance, versus a 1.3% average).
- Had Community Safety and Social Care provisions taken out of special measures.
- The Borough now has the 8th highest crime stats in London (down from 3rd in 2001/2)
- Seen an 87% reduction in the number of crack houses in operation at any one time (from 86 in 2002, to 10-12 at any one time now).
And all the above took place whilst a Labour Government was in place.
And what makes it worse is that Labour are still the largest party on the Council and could easily regain control at the election next may !!
I really don't like party politics myself - preferring instead to decide on issues via my conscience - but it appears to be a necessary evil. There are a lot of good people in politics as well though - particularly in smaller parties I believe, as they tend to attract less of thsoe driven by ego/power/status/glory etcQuote:
Originally Posted by SirHamish
Yeah, I remember the Lambeth situation well. For a while in the late '70s I lived right next to Lambeth Hall. My cousins had an a apartment (plus spare room) right over the Nat. West Bank (cousin worked there, weekly rent 50p:eek: - no kidding) and there was hell to pay even then.
Jesus, the racket at night had to be seen/heard to be believed.
Funny though, I and I (!) and my mates used to go across the road (remember Eddie Grant's Electric Avenue? - around that area) for a few pints and never had any hassles except for the odd bloke (usually with that Jamaican mon accent - hope that doesn't Appear passively racist) who'd ask us if we were undercover police sussing out drug pushers. LOL:D
There was another "square", just at the back of the Nat. West - fcuk it can't remember the name - something like Brighton Square or something - where there was a pub (Trinity Arms I think) we also went to and no problems with all classes/creeds/races mixing and having a laugh. Last time I was there, though, was in 1987 so I haven't a clue how things are now. My cousins (retired) have moved out to Norwood and lost contact with the area.
BTW mucho gratias for the good vibes when I was crocked.....a good bit better now but a fair road to travel yet.....no complaints though)
I think Cameron vs Brown will be gret for the next election. I'm not sure about voter turnout in Ireland at the moment but for the last UK election it was 61.3%! That's up 2% on the last one but only with more postal voting etc. If the turnout ever drops below 50% then parliament arguably lacks serious legitimacy.
Voter turnout is the big problem and a main reason for this is people hate Blair and New Labour (especially since Iraq) but weren't ready to trust the Tories again (post Thatcher/Major). Now with a new fresh young leader for the Tories and a new leader for Labour (strong anti-war feeling for example was aiemd at Blair not Labour) I think voter turnout will increase and will only be a good thing for the UK. Also (though exagerated) Brown is certainly Left of Blair and while Cameron won;t necessarily be dragging the Tories any further right I can't see him moving left. As a result the gap will widen-ending the 'consensus politics' which has ruuined the system (as has been mentioned Howard's Tories and Balir's Labour had very little difference). Furthermore the ever growing support for the Lib Dems (which I can see slowing down now-[Steve may argue but I think that a main reason for growth in support was because people didn't trust Blair or the Tories] though will still grow) will mean they could actually provide a credible second opposition which could mean the 2009 election will give the public a lot better choice.