if someone breaks into your home........

i heard some guy on the radio last eve.he happened to be in a unique situation of being both a policeman (in england) and the chairman of the "victims of crime trust" (something like that anyway).

the gist of what he was saying was that he thinks that the intruder is too well protected in this situation.
you see if you are woken up at 3.30 am by a man/men in your bedroom or your kids bedroom you are supposed to react in a "reasonable way" to the situation.he was not advocating having a machine gun or anything just being able to have the likes of a 4 iron or similar to wrap around their head/s.if you
enter my house and i'm sure most people on here would be the same well then its all bets off and i would have no pity on anybody caught doing this.

myself,i've a nice cricket bat :eek:

ya heard that on newstalk 106 with george hook.
does anyone actual know the law in this country in realation to this ??
because i think and im not sure that your allowed use reasonable force but where is the line drawn???

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Originally Posted by exile

does anyone actual know the law in this country in realation to this ??
because i think and im not sure that your allowed use reasonable force but where is the line drawn???

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well the high profile "shotgun case" in england is certainly not a runner.
apparantly the guy who used this was disqualified from having a weapon on the grounds that he was known to the police and deemed not suitable to have same.

If you come into my house uninvited then you deserve the shít kicked out of you (and I'll attempt to do it and face the consequences later). Having said that, I don't have a baseball bat, golf club etc beside the bed as I'm not that paranoid about it happening tbh.

However, if we start allowing people to shoot intruders we'll be on a slippery slope to a yank style gun culture...

I do think we should be able to protect our homes in whatever manner we like once it's on our property. I know in England people have had to remove the broken glass on the top of garden walls, as people injured themselves getting in (and in some cases doing a legger out of) houses with that security measure....

After 3 break-ins this past few years (the last being Nov last year when my Playstation, games, DVD/DVD’s etc €2,000 of stuff :( ) our rented house is like a fortress with grills on all the windows (except the front windows God help us if there is a fire :eek: ).

Anyway I now have a Baseball Bat at my bedside and by God if I or one of the other housemates catch an “intruder” in our place things will get nasty, fed up paying taxes for these scum who think they can just take what they want :mad: .

Is there not something in the law that you cannot “tackle” an “intruder” downstairs but if he’s upstairs it’s game on, something about self-defence?

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Originally Posted by Conor74

It's pretty straightforward, one can only use reasonable force to protect oneself or one's property. The law obviously could not permit someone to use unreasonable or disproportional force eg. the farmer in England who shot burglars, when he had carefully lain in wait for them, lined them up and squeezed off a few shots, was correctly imprisoned.

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Do you have sympathy for the burglars? I don't think shooting burglars is the way to go (as burglars would then start carrying guns as par for the course and so the spiral continues), however I'd say it put a few scumbags off targetting remote farmhouses for a while....

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Originally Posted by dublinharp

Is there not something in the law that you cannot “tackle” an “intruder” downstairs but if he’s upstairs it’s game on, something about self-defence?

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Pretty fcuked if you're living in a bungalow then aren't you?

i think where the law and most people go their separate ways is when the burgular decides he does'nt want to be in your house anymore (cos he just caught sight of you/me and wants out).

you can't chase them up the road and then clobber them.i think the shotgun guy did this.

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Originally Posted by Conor74

It's pretty straightforward, one can only use reasonable force to protect oneself or one's property. The law obviously could not permit someone to use unreasonable or disproportional force eg. the farmer in England who shot burglars, when he had carefully lain in wait for them, lined them up and squeezed off a few shots, was correctly imprisoned.

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Tony Martin was I my view right he was fed up getting Burgled.

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Originally Posted by Conor74

No, none whatsoever. But that doesn't mean they deserve to get a baseball bat across the head for nicking a €60 DVD player...

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If they come into my house to nick my DVD player I think they do. Let the intruder beware, not the other way around.

As a matter of interest Conor, have you ever been burgled? As I certainly think the invasion of your private space and relief of your property definitely influences how you feel about this...

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Originally Posted by Conor74

No. But the law should most certainly not be made by victims.

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It certainly shouldn't be made in favour of the criminals either...

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Originally Posted by Conor74

But that doesn't mean they deserve to get a baseball bat across the head for nicking a €60 DVD player...

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I agree with whoever said that they'd come out swinging and face the consequences later. I don't see that anyone who breaks into your house and represents a threat to your property and your person should have the right to complain if they get a kicking.

Call it an occupational hazard. :rolleyes:

My point is that these feckers have no right to enter anyone’s property, once it happens to you, it an awful feeling (my DVD also cost more than €60 there was two taken one my housmate also had one)

I arrived home from work that evening to find a table against the front door, to find your bedroom ransacked, your personal items damaged, stuff you bought with your hard-earned money taken by scum, then wait a few hours for the Gards who can’t do nothing as we were just another statistic. I have no time for these types I’m just waiting to get up some morning to find my car gone.. :(

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Originally Posted by Conor74

No. There is no difference in law depending on your height off the ground...

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I don't think it's to do with height off the ground.
I think it's about whether or not you could get out of the house.
If you felt trapped upstairs and were unable to get out via an exit downstairs there could be greater justification for "self defence."

I'm my opinion, if someone enters your home unlawfully they leave their civil rights at the door.

When I was in college some scumbag climbed 3 stories up and got in through a window while we slept. Took around IR£1,500 of stuff.
The gardaí said they couldn't get clean fingerprints and there was nothing more that we could do. They said we were lucky because in some cases the scumbags smear their faeces on the wall and trash the place.
I consider myself very lucky indeed! :rolleyes:

Some advice though, golf clubs aren't great in confined spaces because you can't get a decent swing. A police baton is handy if you can get one.

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Originally Posted by tiktok

Call it an occupational hazard. :rolleyes:

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Excellent! :D

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Originally Posted by Conor74

It's not in favour of the criminals though. What so wrong with the idea that a reasonable response is allowed? If it were any other way, we should start looking for Judge Dredd...

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What do you propose then? Cower in a bedroom while it takes the Guards hours to respond to your emergency call? As sure as night follows day, if you just chased them out of the house they would never be caught by conventional means....

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Originally Posted by Peadar

Some advice though, golf clubs aren't great in confined spaces because you can't get a decent swing.

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Sand Wedge would be my choice.....

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Originally Posted by Conor74

If the person was an asylum seeker who had just got into this country, had a wife and children to feed, and wasn't as aware of the importance of private property as we are, would you rather him club him with a baton or beat him with a golf club?

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Whichever was at hand.

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Originally Posted by Macy

Sand Wedge would be my choice.....

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Only if it has a steel shaft and you hold it short.

Conor, I genuinely hope that your home isn't violated but I can assure you that if you were a victim of such a crime, you'd be singing from our song sheet. It's a horrible feeling of utter vulnerability!
It's very easy to be pragmatic and say material things can be replaced but it's about knowing that a potentially dangerous person, without regard for the law, was within touching distance of you and your family.

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Originally Posted by Conor74

If the person was an asylum seeker who had just got into this country, had a wife and children to feed

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Are you suggesting that the government don't adequately care for asylum seekers and that they are forced to commit crime in order to survive?

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Originally Posted by Conor74

If the person was an asylum seeker who had just got into this country, had a wife and children to feed, and wasn't as aware of the importance of private property as we are, would you rather him club him with a baton or beat him with a golf club?

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Wouldn't that be the fault of the government for leaving this poor individual and his family to starve? Is this the socialism of FF?

I never did law, politics or much social geography so you'll have to help me out. In what cultures/countries is it socially acceptable to break into private property and steal things?

You must be tired because this isn't up to your usual standard of wind-up :p

bear in mind that these intruders d'ont give a toss about how you are affected financially,physically or mentally by their actions.
christ they would rob kids toys at x mas ffs................................ :mad: