United League

I know its probably come up before but maybe it can arise again to see everybodys points. If there are any reasons or answers, then lets here them.

A United Ireland/Island League has to be the way forward, it would mean bigger leagues, more competition, more interest, more money through TV etc BBC & UTV cover the League up north with roundups, Add TV3, Setanta,and RTE along with that.
The Security will have to be at its best to stop all the trouble but as you see abroad in every other league there are high risk security matches, but that doesn't stop them.

Is that Setanta cup a done deal yet ? i read about it before but never heard of a final word on it.

yeah sure lets give th city fans more travelling

few drove up yesterday but u couldnt expect that every week

I've heard the Setanta Cup is a sort of trial run for an all Ireland league and apparently the two associations have been in talks recently about this. All rumour mind you, but I for one hope it's true.

Question for the day :

Is it a coincidence that the first All-island competition in 24yrs is secured shortly into Fran Rooney's tenure, and is it likely to be followed with much enthusiasm by the FAI if Rooney gets the chop ?

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Originally Posted by dcfcsteve

Question for the day :

Is it a coincidence that the first All-island competition in 24yrs is secured shortly into Fran Rooney's tenure, and is it likely to be followed with much enthusiasm by the FAI if Rooney gets the chop ?

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Now ... that is a question of substance !!


There is no way on this earth that they are a coincidence. If Fran Rooney gets the chop .... it be one of the biggest injustices that the FAI have ever done to the people of Ireland.


If this does happen then the FAI should step down or disband.
A new association if Rooney gets the chop is the only real viable answer then.


All this episode is doing is fuelling the hatred and contempt that Irish fans have for some people in the FAI ..... they should recognise this, .... if even for their own sake.

First we have to see if it will go ahead before Mr. Rooney gets the the applause for it. Although your right before him i cant remember much thought by anybody else to move forward with it.

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Originally Posted by thecorner

yeah sure lets give th city fans more travelling

few drove up yesterday but u couldnt expect that every week

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Yes your right there would be good deal more travelling but the oppostion will have to play on your turf aswell which is a long way away for them.
In comparison to other countries Ireland isnt as big, Take for example France or Spain or even England etc, they are much bigger countries but the away supporters still make the journey.

if the leagues are imalgamated there would be alot more money pumped into the game on both sides of the boarder.don't forget that the north has a population roughly 1/3 of the pop of the south. the extra revenue provided by sponsorship from larger companies that wouldn't have even considered sponsoring either of the leagues would be of great benifit the the game in ireland. a combined league would only strengthen football on the island and cause it to grow stronger and stronger. maybe some day we won't have to rely on the football league of foreign countries to employ our players. as dev said
"No longer should should our children be brought up like our cattle for export"

Well I guess the upcoming Linfield/Derry friendlies and the Setanta Cup will give us an indication of what it will be like regrding security and crowd interest. It's hard to know where FIFA would stand on such an issue. the Swiss and Austrians had an idea to form an Alpine League but for whatever reason that has been dumped. On account of all this peace and cooperation symbolism FIFA may give it a go ahead.

Most definitely in favour of an All Ireland League. Both leagues are dying on their feet and this is the only way forward (we can mess around all we want with format and seasons).

What it would need is:
Proper Licencing - not the fudge that happened in the eL
Linked to licencing, decent grounds with proper segregation.
Proper policing - I really don't trust the guards, given they're so thick at policing Bohs v Rovers.
Proper Ticketing, and maybe total all ticket games, if Cross Border.
It would be essential to have quality media sections and sky quality camera positions.
No loss of UEFA places for the clubs to go for it. One Champions League spot maybe, but at least 2 for the UEFA from the league - Cups see below.
A Cast Iron rule book - no exemptions.
A independent controlling body that won't give into anyone.

Format (IMO):
An 18 or 20 team league - initially equal numbers from both.
Ideally based on football critea, once they properly licenced (including ground).
Personally, I'd keep both the IFA and FAI Cups as are - Guaranteed European spots for both associations teams.
All kick off's Saturday or Sunday afternoon - Friday/Monday for TV games (if there's a deal done).
Straight Home and Away
Bottom 3 Down.
Lower divisions - it would make more sense to me for there to be regional leagues rather than keeping the Northern and Republic Leagues. That would mean the likes of Sligo can reduce their travelling costs. Only problem would be that obviously they'd be in a First Division North dominated by Northern Teams.
Champions from First Division North and South straight up. Next 4 from each in the playoffs - eg 2nd from "North" plays 5th from "South" etc.
No Postponments for European Games - They can be moved in the same weekend, but that's it.

Problems:
Security - I really don't think the guards are capable. They'd have to do serious training with the English police to learn how to do it.
Grounds/Licencing - Don't believe it won't be fudged and most grounds here don't have sufficient segregation.
The most obvious one is we play different seasons. I think Summer is the way forward, as it opens up the Sky market as well as the European Benefits.

Reading some of the stories in the press about Derry and Linfield and the Sentanta Cup (it begins next year ! and of course shels are going to rip through the teams in it ;) ) It seems as though there is a lot of talk about a all Island league.

IMO I think that if all goes well in the Sentanta Cup and that meeting between Derry and Linfield goes off without a hitch there will be a meeting to discuss an all ireland league next year.

It would really beneift both sides of the island and you can expect increased attendences however it has to be kept during the summer to get the most out of it.

There should be clubs loosing out on Champions League or UEFA Cup spots if it does go ahead!!!

Would really love to see this happen.

Main Problem?
the FAI and the IFA. These two showers couldn't organise a w/-\nk in a blue movie theatre...:(

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Originally Posted by Macy

Most definitely in favour of an All Ireland League. Both leagues are dying on their feet and this is the only way forward (we can mess around all we want with format and seasons).

What it would need is:
Proper Licencing - not the fudge that happened in the eL
Linked to licencing, decent grounds with proper segregation.
Proper policing - I really don't trust the guards, given they're so thick at policing Bohs v Rovers.
Proper Ticketing, and maybe total all ticket games, if Cross Border.
It would be essential to have quality media sections and sky quality camera positions.
No loss of UEFA places for the clubs to go for it. One Champions League spot maybe, but at least 2 for the UEFA from the league - Cups see below.
A Cast Iron rule book - no exemptions.
A independent controlling body that won't give into anyone.

Format (IMO):
An 18 or 20 team league - initially equal numbers from both.
Ideally based on football critea, once they properly licenced (including ground).
Personally, I'd keep both the IFA and FAI Cups as are - Guaranteed European spots for both associations teams.
All kick off's Saturday or Sunday afternoon - Friday/Monday for TV games (if there's a deal done).
Straight Home and Away
Bottom 3 Down.
Lower divisions - it would make more sense to me for there to be regional leagues rather than keeping the Northern and Republic Leagues. That would mean the likes of Sligo can reduce their travelling costs. Only problem would be that obviously they'd be in a First Division North dominated by Northern Teams.
Champions from First Division North and South straight up. Next 4 from each in the playoffs - eg 2nd from "North" plays 5th from "South" etc.
No Postponments for European Games - They can be moved in the same weekend, but that's it.

Problems:
Security - I really don't think the guards are capable. They'd have to do serious training with the English police to learn how to do it.
Grounds/Licencing - Don't believe it won't be fudged and most grounds here don't have sufficient segregation.
The most obvious one is we play different seasons. I think Summer is the way forward, as it opens up the Sky market as well as the European Benefits.

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The guards don't handle the security, the clubs do and if they feel they need to guards there, they ask them, but they organise it. Thing is, the tiny amount of hooliganism in Ireland could've stamped out long ago if the clubs gave a toss. Everyone knows who they are but nothing's done. Like in England, it'll take a disaster to shock people into taking action, only the eL will probably be set back 10 years by such a tragedy.

Anyway, if they do unite the leagues, surely they should unite the cups too and, inevitably, unite the National Teams. If the FAI and IFA remain seperate, where would the appeals go to etc.

As for Saturday/Sunday kick-offs, I'd prefer Saturday/Sunday evening, it'll give fans a chance to get across the country, e.g. Cork-Belfast, you wouldn't want to go Friday for the Saturday game, only get back that night.

As for the lower leagues, there'ld be no draw for fans and it would kinda defeat the purpose of amalgamating the leagues. Amalgamate the entire league, not just the premiers. You could even have three divisions, with proper promotion/relegation. Then the regional leagues beneath that who would have the possibility of promotion in some way.

You couldn't help but lose european spots, the teams aren't good enough to be given more than one CL spot and more than one UEFA spot. But the more money etc. going into the league because of the union, then the better clubs will get and the better we'll do in europe and so on.

I think the currency would be a pain in the hole. Going up 4 times a season to Derry and changing currency is grand but back and forth every week would be a pain in the hole, especially considering the money you'ld lose on exchange rates.

this would be the greatest thing that could happen to soccer in Ireland. it would make teams like Cork, Bohs and shelbourne bigger also would be great for the big 2 in Belfast .........if Rovers could come back that I make it would be about at least 6 teams that could challange every year.
but I ask would the GAA like to see an all ireland soccer league that eventually may mean an all ireland international team.

would the pen pushing clerks with either the FAI or IFA like it ......what do you think

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Originally Posted by ShelsTim

The guards don't handle the security, the clubs do and if they feel they need to guards there, they ask them, but they organise it. Thing is, the tiny amount of hooliganism in Ireland could've stamped out long ago if the clubs gave a toss. Everyone knows who they are but nothing's done. Like in England, it'll take a disaster to shock people into taking action, only the eL will probably be set back 10 years by such a tragedy.

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Even if you accept that the clubs take total responsibility for security inside the ground (which I don't tbh), outside the grounds is most definitely the arena of the guards.

How they continually fail to police Doyles corner (for example) for Bohs v Rovers games shows their incompetence. If they can't police a 100 or so intent on trouble, how are they going to handle the numbers that will be out for Bohs v Linfield. They haven't a clue on crowd control, particularly with regard to football.

Clubs can only do something about hooligans if the guards are willing to charge people, which they patently are not.

I remember when this came up before that the issue of the national teams was crucial. Every national side in FIFA must have a domestic league. So if we have one domestic league that means we have one national side. Now I can't see certain parts of the football establishment going for that.

This is also not as simple as amalgamating the IL and eL. There must be one adminsitrative body - just like the other all-ireland sporting organsiations (IRFU and GAA). The FAI and IFA are not just reponsible for the senior leagues but also the junior, schoolboy etc leagues. These strucutres will also need to amalgamated - or brought under one organisation.

I don't really see much benefit in an all-Ireland league. I don't see why necessarily there will be more money. There will initially be an upsurge in interest - at least out of curiousity. But why would a Cork - Glentoran match at the cross necessarily draw a bigger gate than Cork - Drogheda? Just using these as examples. The amalgamation of the leagues would not address the fundamental reasons why the eL is poorly attended i.e. lack of proper facilities, bad administration, premiership saturation coverage.

I know nobody suggested that it would solve all problems, but I think there are less drastic actions that should be tried before joining the IFA and FAI. :ball:

If the leagues re-unite the national teams would have to as well , which could be a good thing but unlikely to happen as what would happen all the excess staff if the FAI/IFA merged , would turkeys vote for XMAS?

I dont want 1 administration or one national team ! The sentanta cup will do nicely :)

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Originally Posted by LFC in Exile

There will initially be an upsurge in interest - at least out of curiousity. :ball:

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It'll be up to the League, teams etc and Media etc to keep this interest going then. :ball:

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Originally Posted by GK for the Town

It'll be up to the League, teams etc and Media etc to keep this interest going then. :ball:

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But my point was that we just go back to the same situation we are in now. We can't rely on a one-off gesture. Interest will be maintained by proper funding, proper administration, proper marketing - but why should it be the case that a merged entity will do this when the current entity doesn't. If we could sort out those three areas then the need for a merger to boost interest is removed.

I have no objection in principle to an all-ireland league - I just think its a lot of uncertainty and difficulty for what IMO will be a marginal (at best) result. Let's get out own house in order before trying to build an extension. :ball: