Dail Independents

For many Dail terms, with small government majorities, Independents had a vital part to play in determining Ireland's future. They can make or break a government, with a variety of demands and viewpoints. The current Dail saw 17 Independents elected, which was a lot more than last time, but unlike the last time, none of them have any power and will struggle to achieve anything for their constituents in this Dail term. With little voice, and no power, who looks up to the job at howling at the moon, and who looks like they would prefer Root Canal Surgery, and may do a George Lee instead.

BOYD BARRETT, Richard

Famous protestor, on all kinds of issues. Struggling to adapt to the formality of Dail business, makes a lot of noise and interruptions, thrown out of the Chamber on one occasion, but not really suited to life in Leinster House, and may not stay another 12 months inside.

COLLINS, Joan

Famous and elected for, her public attack on Ahern at the end of the Dail term. Anonymous since, and seemingly content with it.

DALY, Clare

Another newbie to the Dail, gets her point across, but no more than that. Will see through the term, but won't pack any punches.

DONNELLY, Stephen

Non-entity.

FLANAGAN, Luke

Like RBB, not cut out for the environment. His colourful past is a rather embarrassing and laughable affair.

FLEMING, Tom

As Stephen Donnelly.

GREALISH, Noel

Ex-PD, FF head, happy with his lot, and will serve his term.

HALLIGAN, John

Has had a sleepy 4 months since his election, bar one appearance on RTE recently.

HEALY, Séamus

As Donnelly.

HEALY RAE, Michael

Continuing the Healy-Rae legacy, and continuing to be an embarrassment to the nation. I'm glad a major vote on our future doesn't hinge on him, as it did with his father.

HIGGINS, Joe

The "working people" politician. Experienced, cutting, throws punches, one of the few Indies completely suited to office. Has performed well given the limited resources he has, and will see out the term easily.

LOWRY, Michael

See Healy-Rae. The Grand Old King of the Parish Pump.

McGRATH, Finian

Done quite well. An experienced politician who knows when to probe the government, but also when to stand back and give them the opportunity to make a decision before wading in.

McGRATH, Mattie

FF gene pool. Acts like it too.

MURPHY, Catherine

Non-entity.

O'SULLIVAN, Maureen

An enigma. She had a powerful vote last time, she doesn't anymore.

PRINGLE, Thomas

See Mattie.

ROSS, Shane

Elected with a very high tally, made the transition from Seanad to Dail seamlessly. Unlike in the Seanad though, hasn't broken major news or scandals on the government yet. Has potential to do serious damage to the current government.

WALLACE, Mick

As RBB. Completely unsuitable for office. Doesn't look interested, doesn't hold clinics, doesn't like the Dail system, and doesn't look like he'll stay very long.

Thomas Pringle is definitely not FF gene pool. He's former SF, and there was word of him joining Labour at one point.

Disagree about Mick Wallace, he never pretended to be a normal local issues, parish pump guy. Haven't heard too much from him at the same time.

Joe Higgins can be great entertainment but at the same time grates on me with his constant references to working people and the like.

Ming Flanagan seems to be concerning himself mostly with turf cutting, hardly a pressing issue at this point in Ireland.

Agree with most of the OP - the more independents there are, the more it dilutes their power and influence. An awful lot of the current crop - especially ones who haven't defected from a bigger party - are going to be one-term TDs. Mattie might slink back into FF when it's politically useful for him. Not so sure that I'd call Catherine Murphy a non-entity: she's on her second term, having won the McCreevy bye-election, and might be capable of something.

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Originally Posted by Mr A

Ming Flanagan seems to be concerning himself mostly with turf cutting, hardly a pressing issue at this point in Ireland.

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ah come on now Mr A its a huge issue in the midlands:D

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Originally Posted by Mr A

Thomas Pringle is definitely not FF gene pool. He's former SF, and there was word of him joining Labour at one point.

Disagree about Mick Wallace, he never pretended to be a normal local issues, parish pump guy. Haven't heard too much from him at the same time.

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Point taken on Pringle.

Wallace may do what he says on the tin, but he is neglecting a very important key to getting re-elected. Looks bored in the Dail, and usually lets rip on Vinny Browne rather than in the chamber.

Collins is still living over the profile her outburst got. It was electoral Gold for her. Done nothing since.

RBB doesn't understand that giving a speech in Parliament isn't the same as lambasting the Americans over foreign policy in front of 500 like-minded fanatics. Can't see him lasting the pace.

Why do you have Boyd Barret, Joan Collins, Clare Daly and Joe Higgins in as independents? Just continuing the dismissive crap of the right wing media who wouldn't dream of giving them any legitimacy? The former two are Socialist Workers Party/ People Before Profit, and the later two are Socialist Party. They are, as well as Seamus Healy, elected as members of the United Left Alliance.

Of the newbies, the most disappointing for me has been Flanagan. The more he speaks out, the bigger the advert against long term use of cannabis. His opponents should've just given him as much airtime as possible during the election. I've gone from thinking he was good, to thinking he's a total knob in just a few months (and that's with agreeing with him on many issues!)

Totally disagree about Donnelly - I think he's been really good anytime I've heard him. I wouldn't have been on his bandwagon, and was a sceptic, but he's won me around. Wasted as an independent, but would be wasted as a backbencher too, so caught between a rock and hard place.

Shane "two jobs" Ross - as expected, a lot of hot air. How much "scandal" did he ever break in the seanad? Didn't he save them for his newspaper columns, or more recently to cash in with books? He should've been breaking it in seanad and committee's, he mainly chose not to.

As has been said, Wallace always said he wouldn't hold clinics. I don't see what his re-election chances have to do with his Dail performance.

O'Sullivan - Tony Gregory she aint.

Pringle - ex-SFer, should perhaps have made the jump into Labour to have a chance of better profile. Maybe possibly after the next election, if Labour gets hammered.

Finian McGrath - lost a lot of respect when he supported FF the last time, even if he did ultimately walk. Wasn't strong enough on bringing them down.

Lowry, Mattie McGrath, Tom Fleming, Healy Rae, Grealish - damning indictment of the Irish electorate.

Anyone who is "suited to life in Leinster House" shouldn't be in Leinster House. Some of the ones who have been bred for the Dail have been the worst possible public representatives (across parties).

Personally, I think the independents (and the others in their technical group) are offering the strongest opposition to the government. With such a huge majority, it's going to be impossible for the opposition to ever defeat a government vote (we knew this before the election), but it is important for them to highlight issues and take the government to task even if that's just by publicly shaming them at times. Fianna Fail can't provide any substantive opposition and are the most pointless part of the current Dail - wasted votes for the few clowns who stuck with them. It's pathetic watching them being swatted away as every FF attack can be so easily dismissed with "you got us into this mess", "this is your fault" or "it was worse when you were in charge". They have nothing to offer and rather than clinging on to 'the big room upstairs', they should have accepted a darkened broom closet to hide away in. It's up to Sinn Fein and the technical group to provide opposition and, in mind, they're doing a reasonable job of this. They can't win a vote, but politics is all about perception these days so their best weapon is to shame the government when necessary, ***** Labour's conscience and remind Fine Gael that they could go the way of Fianna Fail.

I've said before that I like curmudgeons in public office. Those who oppose groupthink and are not afraid to fight on behalf of the electorate. So, while I mightn't agree with their position on everything, I like a spread of independent-minded TDs. I would hate to have Richard Boyd-Barrett as a next door neighbour, I wouldn't want to go for a pint with him, but I do want him in the Dail. At times I think he's smug, sometimes I think he's an embarrassment, but he'll be a pain in the coalition's a**e which is exactly what's needed. I'm delighted he's struggling to adapt to the formality of the Dail. I hope he never adapts and I can't see any way that he would resign his seat and hand it over to the government in a by-election. He might tear his hair out, but I don't see him quitting.

I've been very impressed with Clare Daly both in the Dail and on current affairs shows.Again, I don't always agree with her, but I think she's very capable of asserting herself and presenting a view to counterbalance that of the larger parties. For the same raesons, I'm delighted Joe Higgins is back in the Dail. Sometimes I want to scream at him to shut up, but so do the government which again is a good thing. I haven't heard much from Seamus Healy or Joan Collins yet.

Bit disappointed with John Halligan so far on a national level. I voted for him and have a lot of trust in him, but he hasn't made himself heard yet. He is, however, very active on a local level and I hope he'll be able to represent the constituency well when necessary while maintaining his integrity on national issues. Mick Wallace looks to me the most likely to walk out and resign. I hope not. One thing I'll say is that his attendance record must be good because he always seems to be there whenever I watch.

Stephen Donnelly is not somebody whose politics I feel represent me personally, but I'm always impressed with him. He comes across as intelligent, honest and determined. I think he'll grow to be a very important voice in the future. Thomas Pringle strikes me as intelligent and articulate too although I haven't seen a great deal of him.

Tom Fleming and Mattie McGrath may as well still be in FF to all intents and purposes. Lowry belongs in jail, not the Dail in my opinion. Healy-Rae belongs in a different century.

I've met Maureen O'Sullivan and couldn't help but like her. She's no Gregory true enough, but I think she's a great representative for her constituency. I don't agree with 'parish pump politics' but you know what, the likes of Sean McDermott Street need someone to represent them and I would feel that she would also stand up for disadvantaged areas throughout the country. I really don't know what to make of Ming yet, but I'd rather have him in their than some faceless backbencher.

The independents are a more diverse group than any other in the Dail which has to be a good thing. As I said, defeating such a huge majority in any vote is an impossibility so their purpose is to harangue the government when appropriate and keep their failings in the minds of the public.

I'd agree about Daly and Donnelly, any time they're on television they seem well-informed and well able to defend their arguments. Ming Flanagan, disappointingly, has turned out little more than a parish-pump TD, Higgins and Boyd-Barrett need to move on from being anti-everything and put forward their own views and the Grealish/Healy-Rae style independents remain as pointless as ever.

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Originally Posted by Macy

Why do you have Boyd Barret, Joan Collins, Clare Daly and Joe Higgins in as independents? Just continuing the dismissive crap of the right wing media who wouldn't dream of giving them any legitimacy? The former two are Socialist Workers Party/ People Before Profit, and the later two are Socialist Party. They are, as well as Seamus Healy, elected as members of the United Left Alliance.

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In the Dail, they are classified as Independents, forming the "Technical Group".

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As has been said, Wallace always said he wouldn't hold clinics. I don't see what his re-election chances have to do with his Dail performance.

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We know that's what he said, but the Independents did very well in the last election, they won't do quite so well at the next. Holding clinics gives you direct contact with your constituents, and is a critical tool in getting re-elected.

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Originally Posted by bluemovie

Anyone who is "suited to life in Leinster House" shouldn't be in Leinster House. Some of the ones who have been bred for the Dail have been the worst possible public representatives (across parties).

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You then go on to state you're delighted with Higgins back in.

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Personally, I think the independents (and the others in their technical group) are offering the strongest opposition to the government. With such a huge majority, it's going to be impossible for the opposition to ever defeat a government vote (we knew this before the election), but it is important for them to highlight issues and take the government to task even if that's just by publicly shaming them at times. Fianna Fail can't provide any substantive opposition and are the most pointless part of the current Dail - wasted votes for the few clowns who stuck with them. It's pathetic watching them being swatted away as every FF attack can be so easily dismissed with "you got us into this mess", "this is your fault" or "it was worse when you were in charge". They have nothing to offer and rather than clinging on to 'the big room upstairs', they should have accepted a darkened broom closet to hide away in. It's up to Sinn Fein and the technical group to provide opposition and, in mind, they're doing a reasonable job of this. They can't win a vote, but politics is all about perception these days so their best weapon is to shame the government when necessary, ***** Labour's conscience and remind Fine Gael that they could go the way of Fianna Fail.

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I don't think they've provided much opposition tbh. RBB is lost in there, Wallace doesn't want to be there, while Lowry, Flanagan, and MHR have made them look a laughing stock. That's before I start talking about the anonymous ones. I think Sinn Fein have provided what little opposition there is, even though the "Pantene Provo" who takes their OB on Thursdays has an annoying, disruptive whine, and GA rarely if ever represents his local constituents those who voted for him. But their past will always be thrown back at them, and they will never be in a position of power in the state. FF are (the leader apart) non-existent atm, and now with no Dublin TDs, still getting used to their new position as the third party in Irish politics.

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Originally Posted by mypost

In the Dail, they are classified as Independents, forming the "Technical Group".

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The Dail doesn't classify them as anything - if they don't have 7 elected members they don't get speaking rights, hence the technical group. Nothing more, nothing less and no classification. By your logic the Greens and SF, as well as the socialist party, were not parties but independents in the 29th Dail, given they were members of that technical group.

Ming getting plenty of air time. The point he's trying to make gets lost in all the shouting. He needs to roll a few and calm the feck down when being interviewed - classic by Sean O'Rourke asking him to move back from the microphone.

Again, I think he has some valid points, particularly on some blatant pre-election promises. And there's also a debate to be had about resources to smaller hospitals, and the impact on outcomes - However, I'm not sure I agree with what he wants on this, but the debate should at least be full and honest (which he doesn't seem to be realistic about). But his presentation is awful.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/0708/politics.html

At least it's got Micko interested in something.

Mick Wallace has fallen foul of the live mikes in the Dáil! He was caught referring to Mary Mitchell O’Connor as “Miss Piggy” yesterday, with Ming and Shane Ross getting in on the act. http://www.thejournal.ie/mick-wallac...75763-Jul2011/

Maybe he doesn’t like the competition from blondes wearing pink.

Meanwhile, the FG chief whip, Paul Kehoe, is doing his best Statler, or Waldorf, impersonation, and seeing whether he can report the matter to a Dáil committee. Good to see the Dáil getting troubled over the big things the day after Moody’s reduce us to junk status...

Harsh comments.... on Miss Piggy.

Feck all influence the Dail can have on the ratings agencies though, to be fair. Wasn't anything that was or wasn't done yesterday in Ireland that influenced, or could influence, that downgrade.

You’re very literal, Macy.:) I was pointing out how ridiculous the story was compared with real political stories. It’s easy know we’re in the silly season when pol corrs have to hunt to come up with somthing of great national importance to fill column inches.:rolleyes:

Mitchell O’Connor has been on NewsTalk and Radio 1 asking for the whole matter to be dropped. Doesn’t want an apology (Wallace did try, the others haven’t), just wants to forget about it. She seems genuinely hurt by it, and by some of the unflattering photos used to report the story. Which, you could say, is worse than the original remark because it implies premeditation on framing the story by a photo ed.

Wallace needs to keep his head down for a while. He’s had a poor start, and this and the dress code (whatever you think about the rights and wrongs of it) do him no favours.

I actually think the transcript reads worse for Ross than it does for Wallace or Ming. You'd kinda expect it from a builder and a pothead...

No time for Mitchell O'Connor - witnessed her in action, while she was still a PD, when I was involved in a campaign. The people of Dun Laoghaire went down in my estimation when they elected her.

Went down?

How low were they when they voted in RBB or the stickie? Or Victor Boyhan or Marie Baker? And let's not forget Hanafin it Cosgrave Jr! Working in the Borough I've learned to have little faith in the citizens tbh. Mmoc is small fry.

Don't agree with the implication re: Boyd Barret, or Gilmore. But I guess you're right looking at some of the rest of the list.

Really? Roll on tomorrow night in the graduate so. RBB will be back doing what he does best. Coherent arguments...

I can't stomach Gilmore. Never could and the 3 years dealing with him professionally have made it worse.

Oh. My. God. Absolutely horrendous stuff.
It's quite annoying having to sit there and bite your lip whilst everyone talks inanely about things they've heard 5th hand.