Taxi Driver Protests

Printable View

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

09/03/2009, 4:41 PM
pete

Taxi Driver Protests

Irish Times

Quote:

A report on the taxi industry has recommended that a moratorium should not be placed on the issuing of new licences.

The Goodbody report entitled Economic Review of Small Public Service Vehicle (SPSV), published by the Taxi Regulator Kathleen Doyle today, said the current regulatory structure in the taxi industry was �the most appropriate and successful model and should be continued.�

Earnings in the taxi industry have not collapsed and while drivers have to work harder to meet their income expectations, there is evidence that demand still exceeds supply at peak times, the report found.

Bit of blow for taxi drivers looking to stop other people enetring their industry. Would be crazy for a government to stop people joining that trade with current unemployment numbers.
09/03/2009, 5:26 PM
Bald Student

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete

Irish Times

Bit of blow for taxi drivers looking to stop other people enetring their industry. Would be crazy for a government to stop people joining that trade with current unemployment numbers.

True but I wouldn't trust those consultant reports. From what I can gather, they're mostly used to add 'independent' verification to whatever decision has already been made.
09/03/2009, 5:26 PM
brianw82

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete

Irish Times

Bit of blow for taxi drivers looking to stop other people enetring their industry. Would be crazy for a government to stop people joining that trade with current unemployment numbers.

The Gov seem to like this as an easy answer.

Unemployed? No problem! Just start driving a taxi, that'll sort you out!

I'd like to know where their 'evidence' comes from. Everyone I know is always saying how easy it is to get a taxi now after a night out.
09/03/2009, 5:46 PM
OneRedArmy

The taxi drivers deserve no sympathy. They resisted:
1) any increase in taxi numbers at all for years, even when you had to wait hours for a taxi during business hours
2) the Aircoach service - and blocked the coaches for a few days when it started
3) minimum standards in relation to size and age of car - is a 15 year old hatchback really a taxi?

Glad to see them feel the pain.
09/03/2009, 6:19 PM
John83

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bald Student

True but I wouldn't trust those consultant reports. From what I can gather, they're mostly used to add 'independent' verification to whatever decision has already been made.

I have no confidence in these reports either. I've been looking for it on the internet, to see what they did. It's here.
09/03/2009, 6:39 PM
John83

Quote:

Originally Posted by John83

I have no confidence in these reports either. I've been looking for it on the internet, to see what they did. It's here.

The numbers are based on a telephone survey of 1022 people and show a big increase on 2005 - 28 million journeys to 40 million in Dublin alone (Fig. 3.3). I'd be a little suspicious of the statistical value of a thousand people (especially in a telephone survey).

I wonder did anyone consider that their Fig 3.4 is distorted by the time of day and the day of the week they phone people? (I really doubt they were ringing people at 2am on a Sunday morning.) It's not a big deal since the changes in the percentages are the important bit. Thing is, they've shown that the total number of trips has changed substantially, and then they start comparing percentages of different numbers. That's retarded. You have to start multiplying numbers to see what's going on.

Take for example the period 1-3am. The percentages of journeys taken in that window are:
2005: 28%
2008: 21.7%

But total journeys:
2005 77M
2008 100M

Multiplying the numbers gives almost exactly the same answer.

Anyway, I'm not going to spend any more time reading this. I'm left with the feeling that whoever wrote this scraped a pass in statistics in his business course.
09/03/2009, 6:48 PM
Bald Student

Quote:

Originally Posted by John83

Anyway, I'm not going to spend any more time reading this. I'm left with the feeling that whoever wrote this scraped a pass in statistics in his business course.

Are the mistakes directed towards a particular conclusion or is it simple incompetence?
09/03/2009, 7:14 PM
dahamsta

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

The taxi drivers deserve no sympathy.

Absolutely. The "we're all starving" rubbish wore thin a long time ago, these guys need a lesson in basic market forces: If you can't afford to live on the revenue, get out of the business and leave it to people who can. After a while, the market will settle and everyone'll be better off. Apart from them obviously, because they'll just find something else to bitch about, obviously.
09/03/2009, 7:26 PM
John83

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bald Student

Are the mistakes directed towards a particular conclusion or is it simple incompetence?

No bias that I saw, but I only read a portion of it thoroughly.
10/03/2009, 7:22 AM
Ringo

Quote:

Originally Posted by dahamsta

Absolutely. The "we're all starving" rubbish wore thin a long time ago, these guys need a lesson in basic market forces: If you can't afford to live on the revenue, get out of the business and leave it to people who can. After a while, the market will settle and everyone'll be better off. Apart from them obviously, because they'll just find something else to bitch about, obviously.

I have little sympathy for Taxi drivers after the way they bullied people & still continue to. I�m sick of listening to �we live in a democracy� crap. These guys have openly said their going to close down the city. We have a right to be able to get to work & a right to earn a living. These guys are just thugs trying to intimidate people into giving in to them. The Gardai need to enforce the law to them as to anyone else. Last weeks protest saw them breaking the law & nothing happening. Parking at ranks while not available for work, driving in bus lanes while not available for work. This needs to be nipped in the bud now.
10/03/2009, 8:07 AM
Macy

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

3) minimum standards in relation to size and age of car - is a 15 year old hatchback really a taxi?

I thought that was one of the taxi drivers complaints about the new entrants?

Quote:

Originally Posted by brianw82

The Gov seem to like this as an easy answer.

Unemployed? No problem! Just start driving a taxi, that'll sort you out!

There appears to be cases where Social Welfare are giving supports to people to get licences.

I do have a degree of sympathy for some of the drivers. I know a lad who used to work with the missus who took a massive loan to buy a plate and gave up the day job to be a taxi driver, and is probably still trying to pay it of now (even though since deregulation it's worthless). However, some of the real old school ones who facilitated the "cosying" method of ripping off the young guys I have no sympathy for. However, I would say it doesn't really make me comfortable thinking of guys doing stupid hours driving around all day and all night - at the very time the RSA is running ads about driving when tired.

If it can be shown that you can't make a living whilst being in compliance with the working time directive, then imo it is reasonable to ask for a halt on numbers of licences.

btw, No report is ever independent. By definition, whoever comissions it has an agenda, and that inevitably comes through in the final report. The ones that don't follow that, never get published.
10/03/2009, 11:06 AM
pete

Taxi driving is an unskilled trade so I am unsure how much they expect to earn. It is also an almost exclusively cash only business so I wouldn't trust their declared incomes. Even before deregulation their decalred incomes were a joke. Just like working in a bar the busy times are unsocialable hours so taxi drivers need to accept that.

It should be remembered that taxi drivers caused deregulation by trying to stop the Minister issuing 300 new plates but the courts ruled Minister could not restict numbers in any way. Given the way they behaved up to that point I don't have any sympathy for the collective.

While I don't favour a cap on numbers there should be a big improvement in minimum standards of vehicles etc...
10/03/2009, 11:24 AM
noby

I don't know the full story, and haven't read the report, but on the news lastnight they said applications for licences have dropped from 250ish for March '08 to 33 for Feb '09, so they didn't see the point in a moratorium, when there just isn't a big demand there any more.
It was also mentioned that a taxi driver now has to work 52 hours a week to come out with the same money (whatever that is), which, if you ask any other self-employed person, seems fair enough.
10/03/2009, 1:48 PM
Macy

Quote:

Originally Posted by noby

It was also mentioned that a taxi driver now has to work 52 hours a week to come out with the same money (whatever that is), which, if you ask any other self-employed person, seems fair enough.

I'm not self employed, but surely depends on the business. Isn't the limit for transport drivers 48 hours a week, due to increased dangers to themselves and other road users of fatigue?

btw you could look at it another way, if demand is so low, a stop on issuing them would also matter little.
10/03/2009, 2:03 PM
noby

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macy

Isn't the limit for transport drivers 48 hours a week, due to increased dangers to themselves and other road users of fatigue?

I have no idea. Is that 48 hours driving? If it is, I wonder how much of the taxi drivers' 52 hour week is spent at ranks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macy

btw you could look at it another way, if demand is so low, a stop on issuing them would also matter little.

True.
10/03/2009, 6:13 PM
dahamsta

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macy

I'm not self employed, but surely depends on the business.

Of course it does. Al Pacino is self-employed, and he hardly has to work the same hours as the local window cleaner.
13/03/2009, 4:19 PM
Billsthoughts

I agree with Macy. a bit of common sense with no pre ordained agenda wouldnt go astray at the moment in relation to taxis. we cant return to the situation of a few years back but the situation at the mo is ridiculous. I read during the week that there are more taxi licences in dublin than new york. a walk down the street any nite will tell you there are tons of them knocking around. I actually stayed after hours in a bar last weekend only to come out to a row of taxis at 6 in the morning..!!!
13/03/2009, 7:01 PM
Mr A

Anybody who has a demonstrated knowledge of their area and a car that meets decent standards should get a license.

I have damn all sympathy for the taxi drivers, but there's people using bangers as taxis and who don't even know where whole areas of Galway are, never mind estates within them.
13/03/2009, 7:50 PM
Lionel Ritchie

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

a walk down the street any nite will tell you there are tons of them knocking around.

...except, as this report stated, supply still isn't meeting demand at peak times.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

I actually stayed after hours in a bar last weekend only to come out to a row of taxis at 6 in the morning..!!!

In fairness the night is just about over at 6am and most drivers would be getting ready to head home. If you'd been looking for one 2-3 hours earlier you may not have had such ready access.

Here in Limerick there does indeed appear to be over-supply during the day. But I encountered problems recently trying to get one after midnight on a friday. Also -over the Christmas holidays it was apparent that they're also still cherry-picking the fairs they'll pick up.

Friends of mine who live in Clonlara (six miles from Limerick) were told at 3.30AM they should call back at 5AM as they'd not get anyone to take them out of the city centre at that time. They were deadly serious -expected people to stand around in the sleet for an hour and a half.

Slap it up 'em if that's their attitude.

As for standard of cars etc... the cars should be clean, NCT'd and subject to inspection. I've no time for this nonsense that cars should be under seven or six years old or whatever it is. Frankly I'm more concerned about the standard of driver -which has a wide degree of competence and compliance at present I reckon.
14/03/2009, 12:18 AM
mypost

Quote:

Originally Posted by dahamsta

Absolutely. The "we're all starving" rubbish wore thin a long time ago, these guys need a lesson in basic market forces: If you can't afford to live on the revenue, get out of the business and leave it to people who can. After a while, the market will settle and everyone'll be better off. Apart from them obviously, because they'll just find something else to bitch about, obviously.

I was in two well-known South Dublin coastal suburbs a few weeks ago, in the centre of them, and there were 0 taxis. There's plenty of work available if the drivers look hard enough for it.

Some Senator pointed out in the Seanad last week, that when he was in a taxi with a non-national driver, the driver attempted to drive up Grafton Street!! Basic geography knowledge should be expected of someone wanting to get into the taxi business.

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page