Polish FA (PZPN) suspended by Polish Government

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01/10/2008, 10:09 PM
HarpoJoyce

Polish FA (PZPN) suspended by Polish Government

The Chair of the Polish FA (PZPN) Mr. Michal Listkiewicz was suspended by a Polish Government sports arbitration court this week.
http://www.enews20.com/news_Polish_f...uro_12172.html
"....The court appointed Robert Zawlocki temporary head of the PZPN on Monday after a motion from the sports ministry which has long been dissatisfied with the PZPN's handling of corruption in Polish football. "
"...Zawlocki has reportedly written to UEFA boss Michel Platini that the suspension of the leadership will not harm the Euro preparations, in which Listkiewicz will continue to be involved.

UEFA must consult with FIFA about the situation, UEFA spokesman William Gaillard told the Polish Press Agency.

Polish football has been plagued by corruption in recent years, with more than 20 clubs, referees, federation and club officials as well as players allegedly involved in fixing schemes. "

Obviously, UEFA and FIFA don't recognise this. Joint Statement.
http://www.fifa.com/aboutfifa/federa...atement+poland
"FIFA and UEFA do not recognise either the decision by the arbitration court of the Polish National Olympic Committee, or the appointment of an "administrator" of the PZPN.

FIFA and UEFA continue to recognise the current leadership of the PZPN chaired by Michal Listkiewicz as the only legitimate authority to run football in Poland and to represent it internationally....... "

Poland.pl. Polish press agency
http://www.poland.pl/news/article,Su...,id,348070.htm
"...Polish Sports Minister Mirosław Drzewiecki has expressed conviction that both FIFA and UEFA will no longer tolerate violations of the law by Polish officials. He said the suspension of the Polish Association board will not affect preparations for the Euro 2012 tournament in Poland, but FIFA and UEFA say that any correspondence that is not signed by Mr Listkiewicz will be ignored.

The four candidates named to replace Michał Listkiewicz are Zbigniew Boniek, Tomasz Jagodziński, Zdzisław Kręcina and Grzegorz Lato. The suspended board of the Football Association planned new elections on 30 October. Current administrator Robert Zwałocki has not agreed to this. "

Poland are due to play Czech Republic and Slovakia in October.
Also, there is a bunch of Uefa Cup 1st rd. games tomorrow including Wisla Krakow and Spurs. FIFA/UEFA promise dialogue so I don't know if they will suspend the Association themselves because they don't like the transfer of power.

(Ethiopia (EFF) are out of the World Cup for something similar, but it took FIFA/CAF about 8 months, incl. a suspension in the summer, because FIFA felt EFF were not moving to revert back quick enough.)
01/10/2008, 10:29 PM
DonO'Bate

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarpoJoyce

The Chair of the Polish FA (PZPN) Mr. Michal Listkiewicz was suspended by a Polish Government sports arbitration court this week.
http://www.enews20.com/news_Polish_f...uro_12172.html
"....The court appointed Robert Zawlocki temporary head of the PZPN on Monday after a motion from the sports ministry which has long been dissatisfied with the PZPN's handling of corruption in Polish football. "
"...Zawlocki has reportedly written to UEFA boss Michel Platini that the suspension of the leadership will not harm the Euro preparations, in which Listkiewicz will continue to be involved.

UEFA must consult with FIFA about the situation, UEFA spokesman William Gaillard told the Polish Press Agency.

Polish football has been plagued by corruption in recent years, with more than 20 clubs, referees, federation and club officials as well as players allegedly involved in fixing schemes. "

Obviously, UEFA and FIFA don't recognise this. Joint Statement.
http://www.fifa.com/aboutfifa/federa...atement+poland
"FIFA and UEFA do not recognise either the decision by the arbitration court of the Polish National Olympic Committee, or the appointment of an "administrator" of the PZPN.

FIFA and UEFA continue to recognise the current leadership of the PZPN chaired by Michal Listkiewicz as the only legitimate authority to run football in Poland and to represent it internationally....... "

Poland.pl. Polish press agency
http://www.poland.pl/news/article,Su...,id,348070.htm
"...Polish Sports Minister Mirosław Drzewiecki has expressed conviction that both FIFA and UEFA will no longer tolerate violations of the law by Polish officials. He said the suspension of the Polish Association board will not affect preparations for the Euro 2012 tournament in Poland, but FIFA and UEFA say that any correspondence that is not signed by Mr Listkiewicz will be ignored.

The four candidates named to replace Michał Listkiewicz are Zbigniew Boniek, Tomasz Jagodziński, Zdzisław Kręcina and Grzegorz Lato. The suspended board of the Football Association planned new elections on 30 October. Current administrator Robert Zwałocki has not agreed to this. "

Poland are due to play Czech Republic and Slovakia in October.
Also, there is a bunch of Uefa Cup 1st rd. games tomorrow including Wisla Krakow and Spurs. FIFA/UEFA promise dialogue so I don't know if they will suspend the Association themselves because they don't like the transfer of power.

(Ethiopia (EFF) are out of the World Cup for something similar, but it took FIFA/CAF about 8 months, incl. a suspension in the summer, because FIFA felt EFF were not moving to revert back quick enough.)

Methinks you have put this in the wrong forum, can't see how this affects the Irish League
01/10/2008, 10:57 PM
HarpoJoyce

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonO'Bate

Methinks you have put this in the wrong forum, can't see how this affects the Irish League

You deserve a reply. Poland are in NI's World Cup group. There's a steady stream of Threads relating to the Northern Ireland team here.

I am presuming some NI fans poke their noses in here for anything new/interesting rather than go into every sub-forum on this web-site. It may get more traffic than the other 'World' sub-forums/fora.

But as you know, it won't be my decision if its moved.
02/10/2008, 8:07 AM
gspain

Seems in the right forum to me.

This would be a huge boost for Northern Ireland's chance sof making the World Cup. However these threats have been issued many times before and normally get resolved before drastic action is taken. The thrat of being kicked out of the World Cup and losing Euro2012 is huge.
02/10/2008, 7:49 PM
geysir

I don't know about huge boost, that's what you'd call getting carried away on a wave of unbridled optimism. A teeney weeney bit would be more like it.
Even in the extremely unlikely scenario that Poland would be kicked out and all results against them rendered void, NI would still be behind both Slovenia and Slovakia in the running for second place.
Maybe at a stretch, the odds on 'not to qualify' would be reduced from a current 1/33 to 1/28.

The Group 3 second place team will have its work cut out to win their play off.
As we all know, even if FIFA will not seed the play off draw, it will inevitably have the look and feel of a seeded draw.
03/10/2008, 9:56 AM
Gather round

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

I don't know about huge boost, that's what you'd call getting carried away on a wave of unbridled optimism. A teeney weeney bit would be more like it...in the extremely unlikely scenario that Poland would be kicked out and all results against them rendered void

Agreed. A silly season non-story, like the one about Spain being kicked out of Euro 08 before the finals.

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

NI would still be behind both Slovenia and Slovakia in the running for second place. Maybe at a stretch, the odds on 'not to qualify' would be reduced from a current 1/33 to 1/28

The odds to qualify are currently 10/1. They may change after next week's games: I'd be surprised if Slovenia particularly maintain their good form. They managed only 11 points in Euro 2008 qualifying, to our 20.

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

The Group 3 second place team will have its work cut out to win their play-off

Why significantly more so than any other group? The big boys, even England, are likely to win their groups. There may be some quality in the play offs, but mediocre teams too.
03/10/2008, 10:38 AM
gspain

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

I don't know about huge boost, that's what you'd call getting carried away on a wave of unbridled optimism. A teeney weeney bit would be more like it.
Even in the extremely unlikely scenario that Poland would be kicked out and all results against them rendered void, NI would still be behind both Slovenia and Slovakia in the running for second place.
Maybe at a stretch, the odds on 'not to qualify' would be reduced from a current 1/33 to 1/28.

The Group 3 second place team will have its work cut out to win their play off.
As we all know, even if FIFA will not seed the play off draw, it will inevitably have the look and feel of a seeded draw.

I don't think Poland will be kicked out as I said in my post.

They are the 2nd seed in the group and arguably the best team. They are certainly in the top 2. If they were kicked out it would give NI/Slovakia and Slovenia a great shot at 2nd place.

Can you provide a link to those odds? 1/33 seems very generous. I don't think they will qualify but the odds should be better than that.
03/10/2008, 10:51 AM
Gather round

I saw the odds on Sky.bet, similar to those Geysir quoted. 1/33 (97.1%) that we won't qualify, 10/1 (9.1%) that we will. Those odds add to 106.2% to allow the bookie's margin. Reduce it proportionately to 100% and you get 91.4%- 8.6%. Or roughly 1/11 that I'll not be there buying youse a drink in Kaapstad :(
03/10/2008, 11:28 AM
geysir

Quote:

Originally Posted by gspain

I don't think Poland will be kicked out as I said in my post.
They are the 2nd seed in the group and arguably the best team

As I said, even if Poland are kicked out, it is only a very small boost to NI's chances of a top 2 spot.
As the bookies have noticed, NI are performing like 5th seeds.
Anything can change in the future.
We will not have long to wait to find out.
Lose this next away game, then the gap increases between the top 4 and the bottom 2.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gspain

They are certainly in the top 2. If they were kicked out it would give NI/Slovakia and Slovenia a great shot at 2nd place.

In the absence of evidence, I don't share your certainty.
Of those 3 teams, NI would be third in line after Slovakia and Slovenia to claim second place.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gather round

Why significantly more so than any other group?
The big boys, even England, are likely to win their groups. There may be some quality in the play offs, but mediocre teams too

Read all of my last whole paragraph a bit more slowly.
I did not say anything about Group 3 having significantly more or less than other Group 2nd place teams.
In the play off draw, seeding will ensure that weaker teams like Poland/Slovakia or Ireland/Bulgaria or Scotland/Macedonia will be pitted against teams like Croatia, Turkey. Russia or Serbia.
03/10/2008, 11:40 AM
Gather round

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

Read all of my last whole paragraph a bit more slowly. I did not say anything about Group 3 having significantly more or less than other Group 2nd place teams.
In the play off draw, seeding will ensure that weaker teams like Poland/Slovakia or Ireland/Bulgaria or Scotland/Macedonia will be pitted against teams like Croatia, Turkey. Russia or Serbia

I understood your point perfectly well, thanks, quickly read or not. "The Group 3 second place team will have its work cut out to win their play-off", implies pretty obviously that you think the G3 R/U will have less chance than other second placers. I disagree- even if the play offs are seeded, which is not certain, why would Serbia, say, necessarily have a greater chance than NI (or RoI)? Or Poland, or the Czechs? The Serbs were no more than an ordinary third place last time.
03/10/2008, 12:13 PM
geysir

We are talking about second place in Group 3.
Isn't that bit obvious?

The next bit is -
The second place in Group 3 will have its work cut out in a seeded play off because they will be playing better teams.

Poland and Slovakia are weaker that the other 4 possible teams I mentioned.
if Serbia get ahead of Romania and Austria then I would regard that as a good team.
if Romania get 2nd place I would still regard them as a superior team to Poland/Slovakia.
I would even expect Austria to beat Poland, although it would be closer.
03/10/2008, 12:26 PM
Gather round

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

We are talking about second place in Group 3.
Isn't that bit obvious?

Er, no. None of it's obvious, because you are simply ignoring many possible situations at the end of qualifying. We've all agreed the possibility of Poland getting kicked out is a red herring; but their dropping points against Slovenia lessens the likelihood of the Poles finishing first or second. On the other hand, three of the other teams in the group have also dropped points already against lower-seeded opposition. The group is still in flux.

If the Czechs finish second in this group, I would expect them to be favoured were there any seeding in the play offs.
03/10/2008, 12:59 PM
geysir

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gather round

Er, no. None of it's obvious, because you are simply ignoring many possible situations at the end of qualifying. We've all agreed the possibility of Poland getting kicked out is a red herring; but their dropping points against Slovenia lessens the likelihood of the Poles finishing first or second. On the other hand, three of the other teams in the group have also dropped points already against lower-seeded opposition. The group is still in flux.

If the Czechs finish second in this group, I would expect them to be favoured were there any seeding in the play offs.

As I said,
the obvious thing is that we in this thread are talking about second place in group 3, that bit is obvious? That bit is obvious, isn't it?

The only team contradicting a group 3 second place being unseeded in a play off is if the Czech Rep finish in second place.
Slovak Pol Slov and NI would all be unseeded.
03/10/2008, 1:06 PM
Gather round

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

As I said

I know what you said, Geysir. I can even make a stab at what you mean. All of it- who'll finish where, whether there'll be seedings, which group is stronger or weaker is pure conjecture. Like I said, we'll have a better idea of relative ranks after the fourth round of games in the next fortnight.
03/10/2008, 3:40 PM
EalingGreen

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

As the bookies have noticed, NI are performing like 5th seeds.

Two matches. And whilst one point from six might appear 5th Seed form, our actual performances have been better than that.

We were clearly the better team in the first half and last 10-15 minutes out in Slovakia, but turned off for two set pieces, normally a strong point of ours, in between.

As for our home game versus a decent Czech team (the best in the Group, I'd say), we were the better team, especially in the second half.

I personally feel we are as strong generally as we were in the Euro Qualifiers, when we established our 3rd Seed status.

In fact, if anything, we could get stronger, as a predominantly young team gains experience. As against that, we need (the off-form) Healy and (injured) Lafferty back scoring goals again soon, otherwise the Group could slip away from us.

Conclusion? Still all to play for, never mind the Bookies!