A bit of perspective

Been reading a number of threads and do admit to partly agreeing with the posters who say it was 2 points lost rather than one gained. However, by and large, the positives far outweigh the negatives. We got a draw against a team that look like they'll become a 3rd/4th seed in no time and who have several players that would get into the teams of most 2nd seeds. Our defence is beginning to look like it did in away games under Jack and we now have selection headaches all over the pitch of a positive nature:).

Trap has shown me (I was worried about Whelan starting these games) that it isn't necessarilly the best players that make the best team. I am over the moon at Whelan and from what I have seen he looks like he could do a job for a solid premiership team and how he is on the bench for Stoke is baffling. Personally, I feel that it is time to release A.Reid for the next 2 home games. Against Bulgaria at home, I would start with him as it shows our intent to collect all three points.

Also, it is now Bulgaria and Italy who have it all to do, rather than us. We have played 2 banana skin games and come away with 4 points comfortably. At best, Bulgaria can only equal that but I personally wouldn't be suprised if Georgia beat them if the game was played in Tiblisi. I also wouldn't be at all suprised if Italy dropped points in these fixtures.

At the start of the campaign, I would have been targeting 8 points from away games and twelve from home games as enough to get second place. I then would have seen going into the Italy home game hoping for a performance like Holland 2001 (if you don't have dreams) to nick 1st from under the noses of them in the knowledge that we had 2nd place wrapped up. A win in Cyprus and hopefully a draw in Bulgaria (lets face it we're due a major away win in a copetitive game) is not out of the question at all.

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Originally Posted by Bungle

A win in Cyprus........

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Not easy these days.

i think montenegro are better than cyprus and i expect us to beat cyprus in both games. no repeat of the 5-2 debacle. :eek:

There shouldn't be with Trap at the helm but if anything it'll be a tight 1-0 to us hopefully.

I know Cyprus have some very good players and have a team playing in the Champion's League but I would expect 3 points. Hopefully, Cyprus take a few beatings between now and then. Certainly, I would have been worried facing them after their game against Italy the other night.

Just looked at some of the other groups and we definitely must have the hardest all round group. There are harder 2nd seeds than Bulgaria but a bottom three of Cyprus, Georgia and Montenegro is very very tricky compared to other groups.

Long gone are the days when nothing less than 3 away wins in Albania, Latvia and Lithuania would be acceptable such as in 94 qualification.

I dont think any of the groups are easy in fairness, im happy enough with our group.

I'd be happy with 4 points from Cyprus but I think the game in Croker will be a fair barometer of how good or bad they are.

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Originally Posted by Duggie

i think montenegro are better than cyprus and i expect us to beat cyprus in both games. no repeat of the 5-2 debacle. :eek:

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Cyprus are improving every year & I expect them to be unbeaten at home for the remaining games. If they could get results away could challenge for second place.

It should be remembered from last night that we have never previously gotten a point in Montenegro.

Cyprus is a huge game for us. Anyone who thinks they are going to roll over is deluded. They were unlucky not to get anything out of the Italy game and are improving all the time.

Fingers crossed none of the starting 11 get injured and Duff is available again. Our bench over the last two games looked very weak, with the exception of Andy Reid. The only other players I can think of, off hand, who could make a decent contribution is Joey O’Brien or Owen Garvan.

2nd place no way. cyprus would be at montenegro's level but not as good IMO. im confident we will have 6 points from them.

Cyprus are definitely improving, but their away record is still atrocious, they only won 2 away competitive games since 2005, against the Faroes (2-0) and San Marino (1-0). They've conceded in every other game, which they went on to lose. I'd definitely expect us to beat them in October.

i think its worth mentioning that both jack charlton and trapattoni were center backs, that would explain why we are seeing a distinct improvement in our defense like under charlton. i think like any team, you build a team from the back up, id far rather us not concede many than having to try and score more goals than the opposition like montenegro and cyprus play. we can contain them now when over the last few years we couldnt. the goals will come for us at some stage.

It should be remembered from last night that we have never previously gotten a point in Montenegro.[/QUOTE]

Considering they have only recently seperated politically from Serbia they are definitely one of the newest countries in the world - they have played only a handful of games so practically every country out there has never previously got a point or even 3 out in Montenegro.

Similarly South Ossetia record sees them unbeaten by the likes of Brazil, Holland, Italy, Spain and Laois. :D

Overall I am happy. Remember, he's only been in charge for a few months and this is what, his fifth game in charge of the team?

We are seeing something that we have not seen in more than 10 years, an Irish team with an actual game plan. An actual style of playing that they will impose on the other team. We may not agree with it, indeed we may not agree with all of his selections but Trapp is actuall developing a method for the Irish team. That, in an of itself, is massive progress.

We have two home games upcoming. If we win both of those then we're at 10 points heading into the new year. Not a bad place to be at all. If we beat Bulgaria at home and don't lose away to either Italy and Bulgaria (drawing Italy at home) then I think we can get second even without a win in Cyprus.

Watching Ireland under Trap compared to Ireland under Stan is a real lesson is how a manager can have a huge effect on a teams performance. We were a shambles and clueless under Stan, anyone could see that. But in the last few months, the change in team, albeit stuble, has been immense. The shape, the confidence on the ball, the patience, the sense of purpose in what we are doing, slow build up play.......I could go on and on. It is the most structured, composed displays we have had in a long time. And in truth it is only going to get better. Up front and on the attacking front there is room for improvement but lets remember where we were a few months ago. First and foremost a good manager comes up and starts the team conceding and losing, once this is achieved, emphasis can be placed on scoring more etc. That is the path we are on. Already we are much stronger defensively and in time we will create more as well. I believe for the first time in years we have a manager who knows what he is doing and how to get results. We're safe in Traps hands in my opinion and on the early signs at least look like we have a fighting chance of getting to this WC, something I thought impossible a few months ago.

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Originally Posted by elroy

But in the last few months, the change in team, albeit stuble, has been immense.

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Yes, not shaving can have a big effect.

I agree with the post though.

i know its early days but is anyone worried lets say we miss out on qualification (God forbid) that trap will leave and were back to square one again ?

Not worried - we have the potential to get 2nd place - Trap seems to have the players singing from the same hymn sheet and they definitely seem a more solid and compact unit - no point in worrying abuout what might or might not happen later.

We're like Denmark or Noraway - out in the international wilderness for a few tournaments but will qualify for one every so often. Whatever happens it seems like we are definitely on the up and I for one am going to enjoy the ride (no pun intended etc!) :p

Also I think Trapp is engedering tremendous loyalty from a number of players like Whelan and perhaps even O'Shea. They look like they are willing to put in the exta mile for him and the team. That's worth an awful lot.

Duggie i know its early days but is anyone worried lets say we miss out on qualification (God forbid) that trap will leave and were back to square one again ?

Hopefully what this highlights to the FAI is what a good/great manager can do for a team and they take heed of that fact. When Trap goes, I would hope that Tardelli with Brady as assistant stay on if they have the respect of the players which I would imagine that they will have. If they don't, the hope would be that the job is a hell of alot more attractive for managers worth their salt than it was 10 months ago!!!

Fingers crossed none of the starting 11 get injured and Duff is available again. Our bench over the last two games looked very weak, with the exception of Andy Reid. The only other players I can think of, off hand, who could make a decent contribution is Joey O’Brien or Owen Garvan.

Really excited by Garvan. All the Ipswich fans I've talked too say he will at the very least end up being a fixture at clubs of the standard of Blackburn, Newcastle, Tottenham, Everton etc in the next year or 2 and most have said he could eventually be a "big 4" player if he progresses further at those clubs.

Other lads like McCarthy, Scannell and Treacy could be playing an important role by the end of the campaign.