RTE Poll

[monutdfc]

I though this was a joke when I heard about it, but it is true:
http://www.rte.ie/news/index.html

Should immigrant students be segregated until they can speak English?
Yes, it's not fair to the other kids
No, what kind of racist Blueshirt idea is that?
> View Results

I've taken a screen shot before it's changed!

[monutdfc]

ps I agree with the sentiments to an extent* - in that it was typical of Brian Hayes who is somewhere alongside Norman Tebitt on the political right-left axis - but for the supposedly impartial state broadcaster to use this wording this on their website is unbelievable. (But admittedly funny.) Student on their last day perhaps?

*Edit: by "agreeing with the sentiments" I mean...well, what sort of a fascist idea is that?

pps: my post is about the wording of the poll; I'm not getting involved in an immigration/education debate

[centre mid]

RTÉ.ie News Poll
Should immigrant students be segregated until they can speak English?
Yes, it's not fair to the other kids 61% (693 votes)
feedback bar
No, what kind of racist Blueshirt idea is that? 39% (446 votes)


the results so far are far more worrying

[Dodge]

The word segregation is wrong. Immigrant children should have more English lessons though

[Macy]

Very funny, apart from the fact it's supposedly from the impartial state broadcaster. They don't even bother to keep the pretence that their anything other than Government mouthpiece at this stage.

[anto1208]

Im surprised that the 2nd option is 40 %

What maniac wants to put kids in to schools where they wont have a bloody clue what is being said.


Screw it not being fair on the other kids its not fair to the incoming kids imagine you where put into a chinnese school tomorrow and expected to know what is going on and they wont give you special chineese classes to help you out because that would be "rasict"!

[shantykelly]

its funny. a lot of the other poll options are also tongue in cheek. someone in rte's it dept. keeping themselves amused.

[micls]

they wont give you special chineese classes to help you out because that would be "rasict"!

??

Im a bit confused by the phrasing. All non native english speakers already get extra english classes.

My reading of it is that they are asking if they should be completely segregated from the class until they can speak english. If that's the case its the most ridiculous , and yes racist, thing Ive heard in a while

[anto1208]

??

Im a bit confused by the phrasing. All non native english speakers already get extra english classes.

My reading of it is that they are asking if they should be completely segregated from the class until they can speak english. If that's the case its the most ridiculous , and yes racist, thing Ive heard in a while

Speak it at a satifactory level

How prey tell can you learn anything if you cant understand what is being said by the teacher. Could you learn history science etc through chineese ? when you dont know any chineese.

So the poor kid has to sit in a class without a clue about what is going on wasting his time and putting back his education, because you think its racist to keep him in a seperate class teaching him english untill he is able to join the main class

[micls]

Speak it at a satifactory level

How prey tell can you learn anything if you cant understand what is being said by the teacher. Could you learn history science etc through chineese ? when you dont know any chineese.

So the poor kid has to sit in a class without a clue about what is going on wasting his time and putting back his education, because you think its racist to keep him in a seperate class teaching him english untill he is able to join the main class

Firstly where are teh teachers going to come from to teach these separate classes?

Secondly, the best way a child learns any language is being immersed in it. In a class this happens. They communicate with other children initially with gestures etc, and then pick up the english. They pick up most of their english from other children not from the teachers.

Also, the teachers will integrate the children into the class, within a class theres not just one group all beign taught the same stuff. All work is differentiated for the different levels in the class so that they can be successful and improve. If the teacher is teaching history she/he must differentiate for this child as well as any other groups in the class. This might mean using more gestures/drama pictures etc.

but the children DO manage to pick it up, and pick up english very quickly.

of course they need extra tutoring in english, but as part of their day. Not the sum of the day. You dont have to be able to speak or even hear to integrate and learn in a class.

[anto1208]

Firstly where are teh teachers going to come from to teach these separate classes?

Secondly, the best way a child learns any language is being immersed in it. In a class this happens. They communicate with other children initially with gestures etc, and then pick up the english. They pick up most of their english from other children not from the teachers.

Also, the teachers will integrate the children into the class, within a class theres not just one group all beign taught the same stuff. All work is differentiated for the different levels in the class so that they can be successful and improve. If the teacher is teaching history she/he must differentiate for this child as well as any other groups in the class. This might mean using more gestures/drama pictures etc.

but the children DO manage to pick it up, and pick up english very quickly.

of course they need extra tutoring in english, but as part of their day. Not the sum of the day. You dont have to be able to speak or even hear to integrate and learn in a class.

The country is full of teachers that are on temp contracts or cant get into a school so thats not a problem.

the kids will pick it up quickly , they will pick it up even quicker in a dedicated class and they will be able to be included in the other class even faster.

also kids arent aloud talk in class anyway, they do that at lunch time playing the faster a kid can get up to speed the faster he can get involved with the other kids and make friends.


I love the idea that you should dump a kid into a class to figure it out by himself by using hand gestures rather than just teach them properly.

[micls]

The country is full of teachers that are on temp contracts or cant get into a school so thats not a problem.

You are joking right? There is a big shortage of primary schools teachers, and its impossible to get a qualified sub during the year


the kids will pick it up quickly , they will pick it up even quicker in a dedicated class
A dedicated class full of other people who cant speak english? How would they pick up english quicker there?


and they will be able to be included in the other class even faster.
Faster than immediately?


also kids arent aloud talk in class anyway, they do that at lunch time playing the faster a kid can get up to speed the faster he can get involved with the other kids and make friends.
I dont know what kind of class you were in, but the kids in my class spend most of the day talking, group work-paired work etc.



I love the idea that you should dump a kid into a class to figure it out by himself by using hand gestures rather than just teach them properly.
You really dont have a clue do you?

Ok try this: Go to french classes every day for a few weeks.
Go to france for a few weeks with no french.

After which will you have more French?

[anto1208]

You are joking right? There is a big shortage of primary schools teachers, and its impossible to get a qualified sub during the year

A dedicated class full of other people who cant speak english? How would they pick up english quicker there?

Faster than immediately?

I dont know what kind of class you were in, but the kids in my class spend most of the day talking, group work-paired work etc.


You really dont have a clue do you?

Ok try this: Go to french classes every day for a few weeks.
Go to france for a few weeks with no french.

After which will you have more French?

Kids in my class spent most of the day learning rather than chatting.

Would you learn more speaking french and english for 5-6 hours a day with a teacher that can teach you proper words and grammer etc

or from standing in a shop pointing at a jar of jam saying Oui Oui

your best bet would be do a class get a little french so you can interact with the people then go to france.

[micls]

Kids in my class spent most of the day learning rather than chatting.
Oh my God. Absolutely clueless.

Im goign to spare you going into the mountains of evidence which supports how children learn better when active and using group work.

You obviously just dont know what you're talking about


Would you learn more speaking french and english for 5-6 hours a day with a teacher that can teach you proper words and grammer etc

or from standing in a shop pointing at a jar of jam saying Oui Oui

your best bet would be do a class get a little french so you can interact with the people then go to france.

Similarly we'l ignore all the evidence of language being learned far better when immersed in it.

So long

[anto1208]

Oh my God. Absolutely clueless.

Im goign to spare you going into the mountains of evidence which supports how children learn better when active and using group work.

You obviously just dont know what you're talking about


Similarly we'l ignore all the evidence of language being learned far better when immersed in it.

So long

Love that responce "you dont have a clue" brilliant

They also learn better when they know what the flip is going on.I understand the concept of learning faster when you are imerssed in it but that could take 6 months to a year to learn enough.

it makes perfect sense to spend 3 or 4 weeks teaching them english then they can jump in and start learning rather than force them to spend 6 months trying to learn a completly new language on there own while at the same time falling further and further behind the rest of the class because they only understand 2% of what is said . They could even hold the class in august that way whne the kids get back they are all in together. That sounds perfectly fine to me and if you think that is rasist you should prob look up some study thats been done on rasisim coz i never heard of the KKK teaching imigrant kids english.