The Shay Given situation

[Noelys Guitar]

If Given fails to regain his place (and I don't believe he will start the season as first choice at Newcastle) he has to move to a new club pronto. He must be playing first team football come the Georgia game otherwise Kiely must start.

[Razors left peg]

If Given fails to regain his place (and I don't believe he will start the season as first choice at Newcastle) he has to move to a new club pronto. He must be playing first team football come the Georgia game otherwise Kiely must start.

Personally I dont think there will be an issue, as long as he is fit he will prove himself to be a much better keeper than Harper during preseason and will be first choice come start of season

[bellavistaman]

No issue what so ever IMO, shay will always be irelands no1, and newcastles when hes fit

[SilkCut]

If Given fails to regain his place (and I don't believe he will start the season as first choice at Newcastle) he has to move to a new club pronto. He must be playing first team football come the Georgia game otherwise Kiely must start.

Would'nt worry too much about Kiely starting. We are fortunate to have him back he is a top class keeper and deserves to be back in the premiership. Good for given to have the competition again.

[seanfhear]

people seem to forget that shay given has been dropped a few times during his time at newcastle.Mind you he has always managed to reclaim the number one spot.It looks as if newcastle will be going nowhere fast unless they get a sugar daddy that is willing to spend. Maybe keegan can work some magic but it is going to be very dificult without money.If given regains full fitness then a move to genunine competitive premier club or even abroad would be worth considering.It surprises me that clubs such as aston villa or spurs would not be interested in given.He will have to prove his longterm fitness first

[Greenforever]

Shay Given or Dean Kiley, couldn't care less which plays, both great keepers. Also 2 true gentlemen, if only we had the same problem in centre midfiled, centre back, etc, etc,

[Razors left peg]

Shay Given or Dean Kiley, couldn't care less which plays, both great keepers. Also 2 true gentlemen, if only we had the same problem in centre midfiled, centre back, etc, etc,

Very true

[shakermaker1982]

Since that Harweood incident he has been very injury prone. Fingers crossed the rest this summer will let the body heal.

[Maroon 7]

If Given fails to regain his place (and I don't believe he will start the season as first choice at Newcastle) he has to move to a new club pronto. He must be playing first team football come the Georgia game otherwise Kiely must start.

If he's fully fit he'll be first choice at Newcastle.

[Seagull-4-life]

The day newcastle drop given is the day we win the league!!!

[Irish Magpie]

As a newcastle fan i can honestly say that very few ppl realise just how good steve harper is!! very little between him and shay and i would not be surprised if he kept shay out of the team.

[zenokelly]

Shay Given or Dean Kiley, couldn't care less which plays, both great keepers. Also 2 true gentlemen, if only we had the same problem in centre midfiled, centre back, etc, etc,

I really have to disagree with you there. I would find it hard to pick 2 from 4 very decent players, if A. Reid, S.Reid, Carsley and Ireland were all available in September.

My preference would probably be the two Reids but Carsley had a very strong season for the 5th place team in the premiership and Ireland didn't let himself down at all for City, with a pretty much a guaranteed spot all season for a good outfit.

Then if J. O' Brien stays injury-free for a while you could throw him in to the mix.

So 5 strong players available in the centre IF ALL FIT!:ball:

[Greenforever]

I really have to disagree with you there. I would find it hard to pick 2 from 4 very decent players, if A. Reid, S.Reid, Carsley and Ireland were all available in September.

My preference would probably be the two Reids but Carsley had a very strong season for the 5th place team in the premiership and Ireland didn't let himself down at all for City, with a pretty much a guaranteed spot all season for a good outfit.

Then if J. O' Brien stays injury-free for a while you could throw him in to the mix.

So 5 strong players available in the centre IF ALL FIT!:ball:


First I'll learn to spell:D

Andy Reid and Stephen Reid i'd agree with if both fit

Carsley I dont expect to be around much longer,

The less said about S Ireland the better

O'Brien has potential but time will tell.

So I'd say 2 possibly 3 for 2 postitions.

[Maroon 7]

As a newcastle fan i can honestly say that very few ppl realise just how good steve harper is!! very little between him and shay and i would not be surprised if he kept shay out of the team.

Harper is a decent backup keeper.

To even compare him to Given on talent terms is a bit of a nonsense. Then again leaving him in goal would be a typically Newcastle move.

That said not a bad keeper at all but not in Shay's class.

[SkStu]

Harper is a decent backup keeper.

To even compare him to Given on talent terms is a bit of a nonsense. Then again leaving him in goal would be a typically Newcastle move.

That said not a bad keeper at all but not in Shay's class.

to be fair its pretty common knowledge that Harper is one of, if not the best back up keeper in the premiership - and would be good enough to start for most Premiership teams.

[Noelys Guitar]

According to a couple of Sunday papers Newcastle want to sign Westwood from Carlisle.

[paulie_walnuts]

It'd be unthinkable for Newcastle to drop Given. Out of the question.

Obviously you don't watch Newcastle much.

Harper has proven himself to be a very good goalkeeper, both late last season and a few seasons ago, when he kept Given out of the team for most of the 98/99 season, even a cup final.

Given will have his work cut out to get back in, rightly so, he was in a bit of a comfort zone at Newcastle. He's more than capable of getting back into the side, but to indicate that it would be unthinkable for him to be dropped is slightly blinkered.

[Irish_Praha]

If Shay is fit at the start of the season but Harper keeps him out of the Newcastle team then I think Kiely should start for us at least until Shay is getting some games and maybe longer if he keeps putting in solid performances. If Kiely wasn't available I would play Given without match fitness ahead of all the other options. This shows that is was important to get Kiely back.

[Noelys Guitar]

If Shay is fit at the start of the season but Harper keeps him out of the Newcastle team then I think Kiely should start for us at least until Shay is getting some games and maybe longer if he keeps putting in solid performances. If Kiely wasn't available I would play Given without match fitness ahead of all the other options. This shows that is was important to get Kiely back.

I'd agree with that

[Greenforever]

I'd agree with that

me too

[Paddy Garcia]

me too

and so would I.

[ofjames]

if given getting dropped means that he finally extricates himself from the career graveyard that is NUFC, then i for one will be an extremely happy man.

he's a far better keeper than harper. a fit given is one of the top 10 keepers in the world without a doubt. harper is nowhere near that level, good keeper that he is.

given is the prime example of a player who was let loyalty to a club overrule personal ambition. tends to be very common with irish players who seem more reluctant than other nationalities in terms of pushing to play at the very highest level possible that their talent permits. other examples.... kenny cunningham wasting the best years of his career at wimbledon in the championship, gary breen turning down barcelona and inter milan to play for west ham.

[endabob1]

gary breen turning down barcelona and inter milan to play for west ham.

:eek: I know cash strapped Parma were keen but Inter & Barca is news to me....

[paulie_walnuts]

if given getting dropped means that he finally extricates himself from the career graveyard that is NUFC, then i for one will be an extremely happy man.

he's a far better keeper than harper. a fit given is one of the top 10 keepers in the world without a doubt. harper is nowhere near that level, good keeper that he is.

given is the prime example of a player who was let loyalty to a club overrule personal ambition. tends to be very common with irish players who seem more reluctant than other nationalities in terms of pushing to play at the very highest level possible that their talent permits. other examples.... kenny cunningham wasting the best years of his career at wimbledon in the championship, gary breen turning down barcelona and inter milan to play for west ham.

He handed in a transfer request the last time he was dropped, but won his place back. He will be playing in Spain in a couple of years time. He has stayed, IMO, because Newcastle have a new manager almost every season, which brings new hope, new expectations, and some players who love the club they're at so much and want so bad to win something with them.

Who are your top 10 keepers in the world btw?

[ofjames]

He handed in a transfer request the last time he was dropped, but won his place back. He will be playing in Spain in a couple of years time. He has stayed, IMO, because Newcastle have a new manager almost every season, which brings new hope, new expectations, and some players who love the club they're at so much and want so bad to win something with them.

Who are your top 10 keepers in the world btw?

i didnt have a definitive list in mind to be honest. but i rate him up there with cech, buffon and cassilas. if you look at some of the biggest clubs around in the champions league, id take Shay over the following any day of the week

barca - valdes
milan - dida
liverpool - reina
arsenal - almunia
inter - cesar
roma - doni
sevilla - palop

[irishfan86]

i didnt have a definitive list in mind to be honest. but i rate him up there with cech, buffon and cassilas. if you look at some of the biggest clubs around in the champions league, id take Shay over the following any day of the week

barca - valdes
milan - dida
liverpool - reina
arsenal - almunia
inter - cesar
roma - doni
sevilla - palop

I watched the Canada vs Brazil friendly the other day, and Cesar was absolutely brutal.

Probably the worst professional keeper I've ever seen when it came to catching crosses into the box.

[Tenderloins]

Was talking to a Newcastle fan (from Newcastle) last week about Given.
He reckoned that they'd be prepared to sell Given for a number of reasons.

Firstly they need the money if they are to have a decent transfer budget.
Also it looks like an optimum time to sell as there are a good few Premier League teams looking to buy a first choice goalkeeper. Villa, Middlesborough and Spurs were 3 teams that sprung to mind.

Secondly Harper is as good a replacement as you'd get. Many fans think he may be better than Given.

Thirdly theres a young keeper called Fraser Forster who is very highly thought of who is supposedly good enough to provide cover for Harper.

A move to Villa or Spurs would be a step up from Newcastle.

[irishultra]

Was talking to a Newcastle fan (from Newcastle) last week about Given.
He reckoned that they'd be prepared to sell Given for a number of reasons.

Firstly they need the money if they are to have a decent transfer budget.
Also it looks like an optimum time to sell as there are a good few Premier League teams looking to buy a first choice goalkeeper. Villa, Middlesborough and Spurs were 3 teams that sprung to mind.

Secondly Harper is as good a replacement as you'd get. Many fans think he may be better than Given.

Thirdly theres a young keeper called Fraser Forster who is very highly thought of who is supposedly good enough to provide cover for Harper.

A move to Villa or Spurs would be a step up from Newcastle.

What do you call this? Something about ....when the horse is down....the phrase escapes me, but Given has been voted in the PFA team of the season twice in his career. Everytime Harper has gotten a chance, Given has eventually taken back the number one shirt. If Harper was better, Given would be the one sitting on the bench for all these years.

There is no way Newcastle fans can just say Harper is better after (according to wikipedia) just over 70 games.

[Razors left peg]

Was talking to a Newcastle fan (from Newcastle) last week about Given.
He reckoned that they'd be prepared to sell Given for a number of reasons.

Firstly they need the money if they are to have a decent transfer budget.
Also it looks like an optimum time to sell as there are a good few Premier League teams looking to buy a first choice goalkeeper. Villa, Middlesborough and Spurs were 3 teams that sprung to mind.

Secondly Harper is as good a replacement as you'd get. Many fans think he may be better than Given.

Thirdly theres a young keeper called Fraser Forster who is very highly thought of who is supposedly good enough to provide cover for Harper.

A move to Villa or Spurs would be a step up from Newcastle.

I wouldnt particularly take the word of any Newcastle fan on anything to do with football,they seem to be as a collective the least knowledgable of any football fans.The fact that they look upon Kevin Keegan as the Messiah,even though he has never won anything, should be proof enough.
Harper is a good keeper and he does deserve to be first choice keeper at some club but Shay Given is on a different level to him. As has been said already,the 2 keepers have been at Newcastle for long enough under a number of different managers and Shay Given has been first choice for the vast majority of that time

[alkev]

I wouldnt particularly take the word of any Newcastle fan on anything to do with football,they seem to be as a collective the least knowledgable of any football fans.The fact that they look upon Kevin Keegan as the Messiah,even though he has never won anything, should be proof enough.
Harper is a good keeper and he does deserve to be first choice keeper at some club but Shay Given is on a different level to him. As has been said already,the 2 keepers have been at Newcastle for long enough under a number of different managers and Shay Given has been first choice for the vast majority of that time

Harper is a geordie, that colours their thinking, and yes you won't find a thicker lot of football fans on the planet.

[seanfhear]

I wouldnt particularly take the word of any Newcastle fan on anything to do with football,they seem to be as a collective the least knowledgable of any football fans.The fact that they look upon Kevin Keegan as the Messiah,even though he has never won anything, should be proof enough.
Harper is a good keeper and he does deserve to be first choice keeper at some club but Shay Given is on a different level to him. As has been said already,the 2 keepers have been at Newcastle for long enough under a number of different managers and Shay Given has been first choice for the vast majority of that time

I do believe that Given is a good goalkeeper but even using your own argument these different managers have had doubts about him .Amittedly he has always managed to reclaim the number 1 spot.Having said that none of the big four have ever made any effort to sign him even when there have been times when they have been in the market to replace what would appear to be lesser goalkeepers[man utd before van der saar,arsenal now,liverpool for quite a few years,fair enough chelsea have 1 very good goalkeeper and a good backup.hard to believe that cudicinni could not be a number 1 at a big club on very good wages.I wonder will he look back in a few years and regret wasting some of the best years of his career sitting on the bench at chelsea.I suppose he will just look at his bank balance.

[Irish Magpie]

I wouldnt particularly take the word of any Newcastle fan on anything to do with football,they seem to be as a collective the least knowledgable of any football fans.The fact that they look upon Kevin Keegan as the Messiah,even though he has never won anything, should be proof enough.
Harper is a good keeper and he does deserve to be first choice keeper at some club but Shay Given is on a different level to him. As has been said already,the 2 keepers have been at Newcastle for long enough under a number of different managers and Shay Given has been first choice for the vast majority of that time

That is a ridiculous comment! How are they the least knowledgeable football fans? If u supported a club and they were on the brink of relegation to the old second division and within 3 seasons the manager had u finishing 2nd in the premier league i think you would be quite fond of that manager too!

Shay Given handed in a transfer request a few yrs back and the only way he got back in to the team was an injury to harper! Given had a MOTM display against leeds and went on to set a record for the number of continous appearances! The fact that he never got injured until these last two yrs meant harper did not have a chance to get back in!

Fraser Forster is a good back up keeper for harper but we also had a keeper on loan at Fakirk last yr who is the dutch under 21 keeper, tim Krul! Italian scouts have labelled him the next Buffon and he is very highly thought of!

[sligofan4ever]

i didnt have a definitive list in mind to be honest. but i rate him up there with cech, buffon and cassilas. if you look at some of the biggest clubs around in the champions league, id take Shay over the following any day of the week

barca - valdes
milan - dida
liverpool - reina
arsenal - almunia
inter - cesar
roma - doni
sevilla - palop

I consider Shay Given one of the most gifted keepers too ever play in the premiership but i wouldnt rate him as a better keeper than reina. but he is a better keeper thanthe rest of them though.

[aidz1]

If given is fit, he deserves the no. 1 jersey.
Cant see how any irish fan could build an arguement against that given his performances for us over the last 10 years.

[brine3]

What do you call this? Something about ....when the horse is down....the phrase escapes me, but Given has been voted in the PFA team of the season twice in his career. Everytime Harper has gotten a chance, Given has eventually taken back the number one shirt. If Harper was better, Given would be the one sitting on the bench for all these years.

There is no way Newcastle fans can just say Harper is better after (according to wikipedia) just over 70 games.

Harper is, of course, a Geordie.

Apparently Arsenal are offersing 3.5 million for Given. A steal for goalkeeper of his class.

Keegan has never been one to invest in defence, and will probably start selling off defenders and Given, apparently, to go out and buy a load of Tino Asprillas.

Given must be worth about 10 points a season at NUFC, could see them going down without him.

[tetsujin1979]

Would be an absolute savage move for Given, would he be first choice ahead of Almunia? And Wenger definitely considers Fabianski one for the future, but Given could easily have 3-5 years with Arsenal, which would more than likely include Champions' League games in every season

[Irish Magpie]

Harper is, of course, a Geordie.

Apparently Arsenal are offersing 3.5 million for Given. A steal for goalkeeper of his class.

Keegan has never been one to invest in defence, and will probably start selling off defenders and Given, apparently, to go out and buy a load of Tino Asprillas.

Given must be worth about 10 points a season at NUFC, could see them going down without him.

Keegan is'nt a complete nutter!! Even in 1996 we had the 3rd best defensive record in the league. At Man city he helped Richard Dunne a lot while he was also responsible for the signing of Distin to the best of my knowledge!

He realises this may be his weakest area so he has hired stuart pearce for man city and this yr hired hughton to sort out the defense which he has done!

As for buying a host of tino asprilla's maybe he will by a load of phillip albert's (one of the classest defenders in the premiership at the time)

As for Given to Arsenal, i would be devastated to see him go! He is treated like a god in Newcastle and the reception he gets as he approaches the goal before a match is unbelievable! I definitly would be sorry to see him go! However, i would not be surprised if he left as ashley seems to be intent on cutting wage bill! We also have some very good cover so it would not be the strangest decision in the world although i thought u'd get at least 6m 4 him

As an Irish fan i think this would be a great move for him!! He is unbelievably consistent and i think he is the best keeper in the premiership! Somebody said that reina was better than given? Try to remember the last time shay made a mistake? U will probably have to go as far back as the dion dublin incident! The one thing he is brutal at is saving penalties...reina wins hands down in that dept

[DmanDmythDledge]

I consider Shay Given one of the most gifted keepers too ever play in the premiership but i wouldnt rate him as a better keeper than reina. but he is a better keeper thanthe rest of them though.
Reina is crap, there's at least a dozen keepers in the Premiership better than him.

[tetsujin1979]

Reina is crap, there's at least a dozen keepers in the Premiership better than him.
that's a massive sweeping statement, Reina has kept the most clean sheets in the Premiership for 3 seasons in a row, and reached 50 clean sheets faster than any keeper in Liverpool history. He's one of the best keepers in the Premiership.

[Dr. Ogba]

that's a massive sweeping statement, Reina has kept the most clean sheets in the Premiership for 3 seasons in a row, and reached 50 clean sheets faster than any keeper in Liverpool history. He's one of the best keepers in the Premiership.


Ah come on Tets, stats don't tell the whole story though. Reina is a decent shot-stopper (no more) but is incredibly dodgy at coming for crosses. Even without the green-tinted specs on, I'd still rate Given as a far more accomplished keeper than Reina. If he had that Liverpool defence in front of him the whole time he'd have a hell of a lot more clean sheets...

[tetsujin1979]

Ah come on Tets, stats don't tell the whole story though. Reina is a decent shot-stopper (no more) but is incredibly dodgy at coming for crosses. Even without the green-tinted specs on, I'd still rate Given as a far more accomplished keeper than Reina. If he had that Liverpool defence in front of him the whole time he'd have a hell of a lot more clean sheets...
I never said he was better than Given, just that to say there are at least 12 keepers in the Premiership better than Reina is way over the top. Reina would get in ahead of most keepers in last season's top 12, bar possibly James, Van der Sar and Cech

[EAFC_rdfl]

Given is miles and miles more gifted than Almunia
Don't think you needed to go to the bother of reading an arsenal forum to figure that one out in fairness. Almunia is much like Reina and to a lesser extent Van Der Saar, they have a pretty decent back 4 in front of them which is a big help, whereas the likes of Freidel at Blackburn and Given/Harper at Newcastle will be a lot busier due to the lack of quality in front of them

[seanfhear]

Reina is the best keeper in the premiership and probably the only keeper in that league I'd certainly rate above Given. That statement is just nuts, Reina is supurb.

Anyway, I checked out an Arsenal forum to see what they make of the situation. It's unanimous that Given is miles and miles more gifted than Almunia and the general feeling is that at 3.5m it's a steal. They're concerned about his injury record but otherwise it would seem to be a popular transfer among the supporters.
I have to disagree with you about reina.He definetly has the dracula syndrome although he is a good shot stopper and penalty saver.
Anyway to much more important stuff is there much substance to given going to arsenal.This would be a fantastic move for him if he fully recovers from his injury and would give him the opportunity to show doubters[even people with minor doubts]his true standing as a premiership/world goalkeeper

[carloz]

Reina is the best keeper in the premiership and probably the only keeper in that league I'd certainly rate above Given. That statement is just nuts, Reina is supurb.
Cech, Van Der Sar and Friedel are much more impressive than Reina. You cant say a keeper that is awful at crosses is the best in the Premiership. Personally i prefer Given, he has no obvious weakness unlike Reina

[Dr. Ogba]

Cech and Van der sar have had very poor seasons, that may have been true in the past, not anymore.
Friedel? odd choice, I'd say he's at least 3 years past his best.

I don't think I'm overrating Reina when I say that he's top 5 in the world. Coupet, Buffon, Casillas and Frey are the only ones that I'd say are undoubtedly better than Reina.


being a keeper is not just about being a decent shot-stopper. Assuredness under a high-ball is arguably more important and Reina is just pure dodge in dealing with crosses. I'd love to see how he would perform with that Newcastle defence in front of him...

[DmanDmythDledge]

that's a massive sweeping statement, Reina has kept the most clean sheets in the Premiership for 3 seasons in a row, and reached 50 clean sheets faster than any keeper in Liverpool history. He's one of the best keepers in the Premiership.
Well firstly I meant crap relative to the level he is considered to be. As others have pointed out already he is brutal in the air. He is a good shot stopper but you wouldn't make it as a keeper at U12s without being a good shot stopper.

Liverpool's defence was excellent before he arrived. Yes, he has improved it a bit but enough to be considered one of the best in the Premiership.

As for the dozen keepers I rate ahead of him (in no order):

James
Cech
van der Sar
Friedel
Niemi
Cudicini
Green
Given
Jaaskelainen
Howard
Lehmann (although he's gone now)
Gordon
Robinson

Also a couple others I would possibly consider better but haven't seen enough of them to judge properly.

[seanfhear]

Cech and Van der sar have had very poor seasons, that may have been true in the past, not anymore.
Friedel? odd choice, I'd say he's at least 3 years past his best.

I don't think I'm overrating Reina when I say that he's top 5 in the world. Coupet, Buffon, Casillas and Frey are the only ones that I'd say are undoubtedly better than Reina.
cech is not as assured as he was before the incident with hunt and another incident in training[not as serious] but probably still the best in the world.I havent seen much of buffon recently

[jmurphyc]

As for the dozen keepers I rate ahead of him (in no order):


So you're saying he's one of the worst goalkeepers in the Premiership. :eek: If he was that bad he would have been sold a long time ago. IMO he's one of the best in the world and still very young. He has the ability to become the very best as well as he's only 26 (I think he's younger than Cech). All goalkeepers make mistakes; Cech and Van Der Sar have all made a fair few this season. He is also by far the best "sweeper keeper" in the Premiership and his weakness on crosses is overstated. He has improved a lot on them. As for stats not meaning everything, there's no way his stats would be that good without him being an excellent goalkeeper.Anyway, Given is still IMO one of the best in the league nd he'd be a worthy addition to Arsenal. If they're interested, I really hope he goes to them.

[kingdomkerry]

Given should be with a top four club in the EPL. He is wasted at Newcastle.

[ShamrockIreland]

Given should be with a top four club in the EPL. He is wasted at Newcastle.

I heard Arsenal were looking at him as their first choice next season and would bid around 3.5 M for him. Anyone else here this?