Under 21 Tournament thread

[Greenforever]

http://www.fai.ie/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3180

[Jicked]

Well done again Don, keep working hard.

[Greenforever]

Well done again Don, keep working hard.


Well they beat Malaysia 3-1 in their 1st game and Nigeria are the tournament favourites, what do you expect?

[ramsfan]

iraq next, if we let them win would this be seen as us doing our bit for world peace;)

[Jicked]

Well they beat Malaysia 3-1 in their 1st game and Nigeria are the tournament favourites, what do you expect?

Just noting that Don's managed to get back to his consistent form is all. I think they'll do quite well in the tournament, but that doesn't change things about Don... as for what I want? A manager who gives a feck or is somewhat competent tbh.

[geysir]

Change the thread title
Its an u23 tournament
Ireland are just fielding their u21´s

[TheBoss]

With Stephen Ward, he is 22 or 23.

[finnpark]

Great stuff Don, you are doing a great job with those class UK players. Heres to another 20 years with you as manager :)

[Greenforever]

Just noting that Don's managed to get back to his consistent form is all. I think they'll do quite well in the tournament, but that doesn't change things about Don... as for what I want? A manager who gives a feck or is somewhat competent tbh.


How do you reckon he doesn't give a feck when he throws a wobbly about players who don't have any interest in playing for their country.

Whatever about him being competent or not, he certainly is passionate about his country.

[Greenforever]

Great stuff Don, you are doing a great job with those class UK players. Heres to another 20 years with you as manager :)


WHy keep knocking Don, remember the best of the U21s as chosen by Trap are sunning themselves in Portugal. Does that give you the impression they went out to win this tournament? How many of Nigerias top players are missing from thier squad?

Also as previously posted it's an U23 tournament we have just chosen to keep it to U21s with the crazy rule of allowing 2 or 3 overage players.

While I don't personally rate DG very highly I get fed up with the constant knocking of the man, when he is a reserve team manager and not a first team manager.

[Paddy Garcia]

Great stuff Don, you are doing a great job with those class UK players.

I'm pretty sure they are all Irish!

[Jicked]

He's not a reserve team coach, an U-21 national team manager is, or at least should be, treated a little more seriously than that.
The man has had nothing but a negative effect on Irish football for years, I can't think of any redeeming points he has and so he fully deserves the constant abuse. Making a defence of him is equivalent of saying "well at least we got the points" after our 2-1 win in San Marino.

[Greenforever]

He's not a reserve team coach, an U-21 national team manager is, or at least should be, treated a little more seriously than that.
The man has had nothing but a negative effect on Irish football for years, I can't think of any redeeming points he has and so he fully deserves the constant abuse. Making a defence of him is equivalent of saying "well at least we got the points" after our 2-1 win in San Marino.


Then your problem surely lies with the FAI and Trap for allowing U21s to link up with the senior squad for a training session and also for not considering players U23.

Do you believe Don decided on his own to make it an U21 side. Do you think he decided to send some of his squad to Portugal.

Did you honestly expect us to beat Nigeria?

Do you know the conditions the tournament is being played in?

[Rovers fan]

Jeez every thread about underage irish games descends into an arguement about givens being crap. With a young team they lost 3-1 to the favourites,its not the end of the world,its not a disgraceful result,so get over it.

[bennocelt]

How do you reckon he doesn't give a feck when he throws a wobbly about players who don't have any interest in playing for their country.

Whatever about him being competent or not, he certainly is passionate about his country.

well then he could do us all a favour then a do the decent thing - Resign:cool:

[Greenforever]

Jeez every thread about underage irish games descends into an arguement about givens being crap. With a young team they lost 3-1 to the favourites,its not the end of the world,its not a disgraceful result,so get over it.


Agree totally, no complaints about the U17s losing all 3 games in Turkey, but then Don wasn't manager.

[paudie]

I'd like to see the Nigerian team. It could be quite strong as they've qualified for the Olympics this year and could be using it as a warm up tournament.

[Wangball]

I'm not a fan of Givens at all but if he were to the decent thing and leave, who would you see take his place??

Looking across the water the English appointment of Pearce seemed to be the FA's concession to the Sun & the Daily Mirror and all that lot that there must be at least 1 Englishman (Bull Dog Spirit, En-Ger-Land, 40 years of hurt, play up Blighty etc etc) on the management team & it appears that Capello has been instructed to "groom" Pearce to be his successor

I think we should look for a young up and coming manager to take over the 21's with some fresh idea's and more importantly someone whose willing to learn from Trap, Tardelli & Brady

[Jicked]

Agree totally, no complaints about the U17s losing all 3 games in Turkey, but then Don wasn't manager.

I wouldn't have any problems if the U-21s qualified for a tournament, as the U-17s did when losing their games. Seriously, how can Givens be defended, his record and attitude speaks for itself. Again, it's an awful lot like someone saying "well, Finnan did take his goal very well" last October.

[Greenforever]

I wouldn't have any problems if the U-21s qualified for a tournament, as the U-17s did when losing their games. Seriously, how can Givens be defended, his record and attitude speaks for itself. Again, it's an awful lot like someone saying "well, Finnan did take his goal very well" last October.


Do you bother to read posts before replying?

Our 4 so called best players are with the senior squad.

All other teams are U23, the FAI have chosen to send out an U21 team.

These descisions are not Dons but the FAI and Trap's.

[gspain]

Malaysia shocked Iraq 1-0 in the other game. A draw will most likely qualify us for the semi finals. A win will certainly do so.

[ifk101]

Malaysia shocked Iraq 1-0 in the other game. A draw will most likely qualify us for the semi finals. A win will certainly do so.

I don't know if it's a "shock" as Iraq have sent a U20 team to this tournament. Our boys should be able to win today.

[as_i_say]

How long has the putz been in charge anyway? 10 years? christ what a cushty number. He must have a no sacking under any circumstances clause in his contract

[youngirish]

How long has the putz been in charge anyway? 10 years? christ what a cushty number. He must have a no sacking under any circumstances clause in his contract

He's a clown and imo has been just as responsible asr Kerr and Stan for the sharp decline in the fortunes of our International team that we've all witnessed in recent years. The U21 team is the last step on the ladder to a full senior cap and many of the current squad would have served under Givens. If you have become used to under performing at U21 level then it's only logical to assume this losing mentality will be carried over to the next level.

We've got rid of Stan now so Givens should be next on the list. His record has been shocking at U21 level.

[Jicked]

Do you bother to read posts before replying?

Our 4 so called best players are with the senior squad.

All other teams are U23, the FAI have chosen to send out an U21 team.

These descisions are not Dons but the FAI and Trap's.


This isn't an important tournament by any means. Did you read my post? The U-17s qualified for the European Championships, has Don ever managed that?

[Greenforever]

I give up, I mean do you accept that he picks the squad after Trap takes who he wants and that it really is not an important level.

Do you see the English tabloids gloating if their U21s win or baying for blood if they lose?

And then who would you replace Don with?

An EL manager? then we have the same crap as with the U23s Scully complaining that his players are being tapped up etc.

[pateen]

Good stuff Don,

For everybody else read my signature

[ifk101]

0-0 against Iraq in today's match for our boys.

Malaysia and Nigeria drew 1-1.

AFAIK we're ahead of Malaysia on goal difference. Nigeria and Iraq still have to play each other so our place in the semifinals is dependent on the result in that match.

But 0-0 against an Iraq U20 team is poor.

[back of the net]

Ireland left frustrated by Iraq at U23 Intercontinental Tournament

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Date: Monday, 19 May 2008 Section: International

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Intercontinental Cup Group A
Republic of Ireland 0-0 Iraq

Don Givens’ Ireland team dominated today’s Under-23 Intercontinental Cup tournament Group A game against Iraq in Malaysia but couldn’t put the ball away.


The result means that Iraq will have to defeat tournament favourites Nigeria by a two-goal margin in Wednesday’s final match to deny Ireland a place in the semi-final.

[gilberto_eire]

That's disgraceful that they could'nt beat Iraq, come on the country is in a complete mess and were never a decent team anyway!!. Even Iran were never up to much!!

[Cloggs]

Ireland left frustrated by Iraq at U23 Intercontinental Tournament

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Monday, 19 May 2008 Section: International

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Intercontinental Cup Group A
Republic of Ireland 0-0 Iraq

Don Givens’ Ireland team dominated today’s Under-23 Intercontinental Cup tournament Group A game against Iraq in Malaysia but couldn’t put the ball away.


The result means that Iraq will have to defeat tournament favourites Nigeria by a two-goal margin in Wednesday’s final match to deny Ireland a place in the semi-final.

hard to see iraq beating nigeria if we should have beaten them,especially as nigeria gave us a good hiding on saturday.who would we playing if we do qualify for the semi finals?are any of the games on any tv station?and finally how in the name of football is don givens allowed to be in charge of the team?his record as an underage manager in the last few years are abysmal?does he have something hanging over delaney or what??

[elroy]

Hes cheap, which is the FAIs main concern, oh and dont think hes gonna complain or cause much trouble so again perfect for the fai. It would be madness to put anyone with half decent managerial skills in place.

[Jicked]

I give up, I mean do you accept that he picks the squad after Trap takes who he wants and that it really is not an important level.

Do you see the English tabloids gloating if their U21s win or baying for blood if they lose?

And then who would you replace Don with?

An EL manager? then we have the same crap as with the U23s Scully complaining that his players are being tapped up etc.

It is an important level, its a great chance to look at young players and help their development. Lets not bring Trap in to this, Givens has been around for years before Trap came along, and still hasn't been able to muster a win, regardless of how many U-21 players are in the first team squad.
The English tabloids would be baying for blood if the U-21s were managed by someone who has a spectacularly awful record, despite the age groups below him consistently doing well.
Who would I replace Don with? I don't know. I'd ask Trap or whoever the no.1 manager at the time was. Failing that I'd give it to an Irish manager, perhaps one who has experience at LoI level.

Out of interest, were you one of the people saying to give Staunton time, how he was a lovely fella and it wasn't his fault he'd been thrown in at the deep end?

[Greenforever]

It is an important level, its a great chance to look at young players and help their development. Lets not bring Trap in to this, Givens has been around for years before Trap came along, and still hasn't been able to muster a win, regardless of how many U-21 players are in the first team squad.
The English tabloids would be baying for blood if the U-21s were managed by someone who has a spectacularly awful record, despite the age groups below him consistently doing well.
Who would I replace Don with? I don't know. I'd ask Trap or whoever the no.1 manager at the time was. Failing that I'd give it to an Irish manager, perhaps one who has experience at LoI level.

Out of interest, were you one of the people saying to give Staunton time, how he was a lovely fella and it wasn't his fault he'd been thrown in at the deep end?


Staunton is a lovely fella, and was thrown in at the deep end, but he did accept the job and why wouldnt he, blame he who gave him the job.

Let's not bring Trap into this, but it is Trap who took the best players, that makes a clear statement of how he valuues this level.

Is that not what Trap did, take players with him for the week to look at them?

Englands U21s dont set the world on fire and dont get the same press as when the senior team play crap.

Anyway let's agree to disagree on the matter,

[cestlavie]

Iraq are Asian champions, and thats a country that Is in the middle of a full scale war, we just have the FAI running football in Ireland, so I suppose we are in similar situation to Iraq!!!!:)

[finnpark]

Don Givens is doing a superb job!!!! 0-0 with Iraq, we could even beat San Marino if we meet them. Keep him in the job for ever!! We are really lucky to have such a great manager.

[Hibernian]

At least Stan got few decent results as manager.

As for Givens holy god.

He should not be in charge of the local pub team never mind this stage

[youngirish]

Staunton is a lovely fella, and was thrown in at the deep end, but he did accept the job and why wouldnt he, blame he who gave him the job.

The same illogical argument over and over again. Imagine you were offered a job as a heart surgeon even though you have no experience whatsoever. In the operating room you cause the death of your first patient but refuse to step down. You continue practicing and ignore other people's objections and concerns and are responsible for a number of other people's deaths until you are eventually forced out of your position .

By your logic you bear no responsibility for the unfortunate circumstances above though. It's all the fault of the people who employed you then. Staunton is just as much to blame as Delaney and I for one have lost any respect I held for him as a player due to his incompetence but more relevant his stubborness as a manager.

[gustavo]

The same illogical argument over and over again. Imagine you were offered a job as a heart surgeon even though you have no experience whatsoever. In the operating room you cause the death of your first patient but refuse to step down. You continue practicing and ignore other people's objections and concerns and are responsible for a number of other people's deaths until you are eventually forced out of your position .

By your logic you bear no responsibility for the unfortunate circumstances above though. It's all the fault of the people who employed you then. Staunton is just as much to blame as Delaney and I for one have lost any respect I held for him as a player due to his incompetence but more relevant his stubborness as a manager.

Heart surgeons need experience , International football managers don't neccecarily i.e Klinsmann , Donadoni , Van Basten , Riijkaard , Dunga

[youngirish]

Heart surgeons need experience , International football managers don't neccecarily i.e Klinsmann , Donadoni , Van Basten , Riijkaard , Dunga

None of the above with the exception of Klinsmann were particularly successful as International managers.

[FarBeag]

The same illogical argument over and over again. Imagine you were offered a job as a heart surgeon even though you have no experience whatsoever. In the operating room you cause the death of your first patient but refuse to step down. You continue practicing and ignore other people's objections and concerns and are responsible for a number of other people's deaths until you are eventually forced out of your position .

By your logic you bear no responsibility for the unfortunate circumstances above though. It's all the fault of the people who employed you then. Staunton is just as much to blame as Delaney and I for one have lost any respect I held for him as a player due to his incompetence but more relevant his stubborness as a manager.

You cannot compare the two.Surgeons have to be trained for up to ten years before they can carry out any type of operation. This is their speciality. This is the type of medicine they found they were more suited to as a doctor.They are bound by all sort of professional conducts and ethics and if they make a mistake there can be serious consequences for them and their patient.

On the other hand, a football manager needs little or no experience but it helps if you have.You are either a good manager or your not.The sames applies to any type of management job. Someone with a masters degree may not be a good as some with a diploma. Its all about the individual.If you mess up you get a slap on the wrist and you move on. There will always be a job out there for you somewhere eg Stan gone to Leeds.

[back of the net]

Staunton is a lovely fella, and was thrown in at the deep end, but he did accept the job and why wouldnt he, blame he who gave him the job.

Let's not bring Trap into this, but it is Trap who took the best players, that makes a clear statement of how he valuues this level.

Is that not what Trap did, take players with him for the week to look at them?

Englands U21s dont set the world on fire and dont get the same press as when the senior team play crap.

Anyway let's agree to disagree on the matter,

im sure don is a lovely fella - but what about all the times that he had full squads and continued to get crap results - he is not a manager


ireland U21 development is more important to get right than england u21 development due to the much smaller pool of players we have to choose from - so therefore we have less chances to get it right

givens job as underage international manager has to come to an end - but the sad thing is that it wont anytime soon

[Paddy Garcia]

At least Stan got few decent results as manager.


Actually not one decent result.

[zackmorris]

Ireland have qualified for the semi-finals where they will play Australia (who won all three games) after Nigeria beat Iraq 1-0 today.

[Paulie Bleecker]

Givens is a nice bloke, a lovely fella in fact.

BUT, his problem is he's too hard headed to be a top international manager. When you've got such a little squad, isolating players becomes a bigger deal. Givens hasn't copped that yet and continues to put players backs up.

I know of at least three lads who should be at that tournament but aren't because Don has had a row with them.

That in itself should call the guys involvement into question.

Also, he took up the job as caretaker boss of the national team while the 21's had a game. Obviously the FAI had asked him to do this but he really didn't seem arsed and that grated on me.

And, these are the qualifying results this campaign. FOUR points. Not good enough.

07/09/07: Republic of Ireland 0 – 2 Portugal, in Cork
16/10/07: Republic of Ireland 0 - 3 England, Turner’s Cross 8.00 pm
16/11/07: Montenegro 1-0 Republic of Ireland
20/11/07: Republic of Ireland 1 - 0 Bulgaria in Athlone
05/02/08: England 3 - 0 Republic of Ireland in Southampton
25/03/08: Republic of Ireland 1-1 Montenegro, Terryland Park, Galway

[zenokelly]

Givens is a nice bloke, a lovely fella in fact.

BUT, his problem is he's too hard headed to be a top international manager. When you've got such a little squad, isolating players becomes a bigger deal. Givens hasn't copped that yet and continues to put players backs up.

I know of at least three lads who should be at that tournament but aren't because Don has had a row with them.

That in itself should call the guys involvement into question.

Also, he took up the job as caretaker boss of the national team while the 21's had a game. Obviously the FAI had asked him to do this but he really didn't seem arsed and that grated on me.

And, these are the qualifying results this campaign. FOUR points. Not good enough.

07/09/07: Republic of Ireland 0 – 2 Portugal, in Cork
16/10/07: Republic of Ireland 0 - 3 England, Turner’s Cross 8.00 pm
16/11/07: Montenegro 1-0 Republic of Ireland
20/11/07: Republic of Ireland 1 - 0 Bulgaria in Athlone
05/02/08: England 3 - 0 Republic of Ireland in Southampton
25/03/08: Republic of Ireland 1-1 Montenegro, Terryland Park, Galway


It should be noted that the Givens was not responsible for the one decent result there (Bulgaria), it was Sean McCaffrey who was in charge that night.

And anyone who saw the match would agree that it was one of if not the best performance from the U21s in the last couple of years. And the team was actually set up properly that night and were playing good football. It just highlighted what a bad job Givens is doing. I wouldn't miond even McCaffrey himself taking over from Givens once we get a decent coach that has a clue what he's doing and doesn't fall out with players right, left and centre.

[sligoman]

Is the game Vs. Australia on tv? Can't find it listed.

[ifk101]

Not exactly what you'd want to hear on match day.

http://www.fai.ie/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3204

[amaccann]

Jaysus, nasty stuff. Though i guess we can't blame Givens for that. Or CAN we? ;)

[blobbyblob]

They are all literally ****ting it