Fergie's selective amnesia

[Angus]

The younger turks among you may not recall all of these but for those us around BS (before Sky), for anybody at Old Trafford to complain about dodgy pennos and decisions in big games is farcical.

Their breakthrough in 1993 coincided with them being the best side but significant supporting roles were played by Messrs Ashby, Wilkie, Elleray et al. Some of my favourites were:

1. The Bruce 20 minutes added time
2. The non penalty against Chelsea in the Cup Final 1994
3. The non penalty and red card (Berg) at Ewood Park in late 1994
4. The disallowed goal Sherwood scored in the return fixture
5. 1-1 at OT in the second last game of the 94 / 95 season - Cole goes through, falls down - penalty ! Cue celebrations at Sky because they have their final day showdown
6. Non penalty against City at OT when 1-0 down to a Rosler goal (cannot recall the year)
7. The non penalty given to allow them to equalise against Liverpool in Cantona's first game back after suspension
8. The penalty given when Scholes grabbed McAteer's arm and shoved it towards the ball
9. 2 or 3 years ago, they got 2 dodgy penos against Liverpool at OT
10. The non sending off when keane assaulted Andy Durso
11. The Rooney springboard triple salko with double somersault to get a peno in the game to end the Arsenal unbeaten run
12. The Ruud Van Penalty triple salko with double somersault to get a peno the previous season


These are only the ones I remember and, yes, Liverpool used to get dodgy decisions when they ruled England. It happend to all the best sides so shut up and stop giving us your paranoid chutney.

[jebus]

It's just Fergie trying to deflect attention away from his poor selection to be honest. The loss to Chelsea was solely down to the team he put out, and is his fault, so if they go on and lose the title from here it's all Sir's fault. He's a whingebag of the highest order is all

[gspain]

It was the first penalty given against Manyoo in the league all season.

It shouldn't have been given according to Fergie because he never raised his arms above his head and Rio would have got it anyway. Obviously nobody knows the rules like Alex.

Actually it clearly wasn't a penalty because

1) Carrick only used 1 hand to stop the ball
2) he wasn't on the goal line and didn't stop a certain goal
3) Manyoo weren't already 4-0 up.
4) The ref didn't ask alex's permission to give it.

Of course the benefit of this whinging is to ensure no referee will give another one against them this season (and probably next) no matter how blatant and that Ronaldo will only need to dive once to get one on saturday.

[shanman2]

Ferguson is trying to deflect the flack from his team that's plainly obvious for all to see. Angus as a football fan I thought you might understand these things even themselves out over the course of a season i.e Emertons handball which would have made the Chelski game even more irrelevant. I don't support MU but I don't dislike Fergie either he is just one of 20 managers who talk Bull-dodos the whole way through a season.

[Closed Account 2]

You could add Mascherano's red last month to this list. That wouldn't have got a red in most games, and on Saturday Man Utd croweded the ref and didn't get anything for it. In their last 2 games that I've seen Hargreaves has been mouthing off at the refs incandescantly (and Giggs too)... yet no red cards for them... anyone explain why Torres got a red at the start of that incident anyway? He was fouled?

I hope they lose both the league and the champions league, I doubt they will, but it will be justice if that happens.

[boovidge]

is this just a thread for winging Liverpool, Arsenal and Chelsea fans? :rolleyes: All managers do what SAF does. Whether it's to take the pressure off the team, to maybe get a favourable decision in the next game or just in the frustration of the moment.

Man Utd have had their fair share of favourable and dodgy decisions this season like all the other clubs.

[rambler14]

As a Man Utd fan I personally think that Ferguson has lost the plot completely.

Only recently he's lost his ability to pick a winning formation but he lost the plot in the transfer market nearly 5 years ago when he started signing rejects like David Bellion.

I think that if he wins the League and Champions league this year he should call it a day and retire at the top.
Him leaving would then allow Mark Hughes to come in as manager, who has proven himself as one of the best managers in the premiership especially in the transfer market. eg: Benni McCarthy and Roque Santa Cruz. £3.5 million pounds each with a 20 goal return.
Hughes is definetley the most succesful ex-united player to go into management.

[gustavo]

As a Man Utd fan I personally think that Ferguson has lost the plot completely.

Only recently he's lost his ability to pick a winning formation but he lost the plot in the transfer market nearly 5 years ago when he started signing rejects like David Bellion.

I think that if he wins the League and Champions league this year he should call it a day and retire at the top.
Him leaving would then allow Mark Hughes to come in as manager, who has proven himself as one of the best managers in the premiership especially in the transfer market. eg: Benni McCarthy and Roque Santa Cruz. £3.5 million pounds each with a 20 goal return.
Hughes is definetley the most succesful ex-united player to go into management.
He signed duds way before Bellion came along , No manager hasn't signed a few in their time,If I recall Bellion was a free transfer anyway so low risk. I don't think any fan of Man United can seriously question him as manager , Hughes hasn't won anything yet

[razor]

Giles called it on the premiership on Saturday, constant whinging when it was clearly a penalty, his and Quareasses comments after Portsmouth were disgraceful, it only shows what a sore loser he is.

[TheBoss]

Sore Loser's make great champions.

[EalingGreen]

All managers do what SAF does.

Simply not true. Do you remember that Pedro Mendes goal/Woy Carroll clanger at Old Trafford which denied Spurs a win? Afterwards, Martin Jol was decency itself.
Have you ever heard e.g Curbishley, Southgate, Ranieri or Pearce whinging like Ferguson invariably does when his team doesn't win? Even Roy Keane has managed mostly to contain himself this season, even though clearly incandescent at times.
As it happens, the top teams have arguably less reason for complaining, not more. For as Gspain pointed out, that was the first penalty against MU in 35 League games this season. Of course, that is mostly down to the excellence of their defending, but totally so? I doubt it, somehow.
One effect, however, of Ferguson's anti-referee ranting is that other, lesser managers are emboldened to copy him, when he ought to be setting a good example.

In the end, Brian Clough, whose teams' disciplinary records were invariably impeccable, always had a phrase for it, whether given in his favour or against:
"It was a penalty because the referee said it was a penalty".
And if that was good enough for Old Big 'Ead, it ought to be good enough for Oul Whiskey Nose. Greetin' Gorbals Bas tard

[osarusan]

One effect, however, of Ferguson's anti-referee ranting is that other, lesser managers are emboldened to copy him, when he ought to be setting a good example.

I agree with most of the post, but regarding the quoted part, I don't think Ferguson has any real duty as a role model, particularly to adult men who usually have 15 years or so of professional football behind them.

[razor]

Sore Loser's make great champions.
In my opinion there should be honour in football, Ferguson has none.

[old git]

The younger turks among you may not recall all of these but for those us around BS (before Sky), for anybody at Old Trafford to complain about dodgy pennos and decisions in big games is farcical.

Their breakthrough in 1993 coincided with them being the best side but significant supporting roles were played by Messrs Ashby, Wilkie, Elleray et al. Some of my favourites were:

1. The Bruce 20 minutes added time
2. The non penalty against Chelsea in the Cup Final 1994
3. The non penalty and red card (Berg) at Ewood Park in late 1994
4. The disallowed goal Sherwood scored in the return fixture
5. 1-1 at OT in the second last game of the 94 / 95 season - Cole goes through, falls down - penalty ! Cue celebrations at Sky because they have their final day showdown
6. Non penalty against City at OT when 1-0 down to a Rosler goal (cannot recall the year)
7. The non penalty given to allow them to equalise against Liverpool in Cantona's first game back after suspension
8. The penalty given when Scholes grabbed McAteer's arm and shoved it towards the ball
9. 2 or 3 years ago, they got 2 dodgy penos against Liverpool at OT
10. The non sending off when keane assaulted Andy Durso
11. The Rooney springboard triple salko with double somersault to get a peno in the game to end the Arsenal unbeaten run
12. The Ruud Van Penalty triple salko with double somersault to get a peno the previous season


These are only the ones I remember and, yes, Liverpool used to get dodgy decisions when they ruled England. It happend to all the best sides so shut up and stop giving us your paranoid chutney.

would i be correct in assuming you are not a big man utd fan..

you could also do the same 12 points with the top 3-4 so called teams over the last number of years only change the names of players involved so don't blame poor old man utd they need all the help they can get at the moment :D:D

[jbyrne]

1. The Bruce 20 minutes added time


while i dont disagree with most of your post the time added on in that game was realistic. the ref was injured and it took a while to sort out. remember watching on rte. great tv viewing all the same

[rambler14]

Hughes hasn't won anything yet

He won a league cup with Blackburn. Got them into Europe and absolutely transformed the Welsh National Team.

[gustavo]

He won a league cup with Blackburn. Got them into Europe and absolutely transformed the Welsh National Team.

Ok so he's won a League Cup

[TheBoss]

In my opinion there should be honour in football, Ferguson has none.

He does have honour to the opposite, he never critises the oppostion, Its the ref that he is fumes over.



Ok so he's won a League Cup

So what should he be winning with Blackburn then ?

[superfrank]

Hughes won the League Cup with Blackburn as a player in 2002. He took over as manager in 2004.

[NeilMcD]

He won a league cup with Blackburn. Got them into Europe and absolutely transformed the Welsh National Team.

Did he really win a League Cup, when did that happen.

[DmanDmythDledge]

So what should he be winning with Blackburn then ?
ramblers14's original point was that Hughes was ready to take over as Man Utd boss. Yes, there's not a lot more he can do with Blackburn but Man Utd would be after an established manager who has won European trophys rather than someone who has only won the third most important domestic trophy.

EDIT: and he didn't even win the League Cup :)

[rambler14]

Hughes won the League Cup with Blackburn as a player in 2002. He took over as manager in 2004.

Yeah just checked it. I was only half right.

But lets face it. He's managed two teams who when he took over were terrible, and he's transformed them into forces to be reckoned with unlike other former United players.
His eye for a bargain in the transfer window is amazing. Roque Santa Cruz and Benni McCarthy for £3 million and the the likes of Samba and Warnock for less than £2 million.

[Poor Student]

and he's transformed them into forces to be reckoned with unlike other former United players.

Gordon Strachan did well enough with Coventry at the start and got Southampton to an FA Cup Final. Has also won two leagues with Celtic. Probably the most successful in management of players that played under Ferguson at United.

[rambler14]

Gordon Strachan did well enough with Coventry at the start and got Southampton to an FA Cup Final.

Got them relegated in the same year if I remember correctly.



Has also won two leagues with Celtic. Probably the most successful in management of players that played under Ferguson at United.

Scottish league is completely different to the pace of the English Premiership. In the English game Strachan has done sweet fook all.

[DmanDmythDledge]

Got them relegated in the same year if I remember correctly.

Scottish league is completely different to the pace of the English Premiership. In the English game Strachan has done sweet fook all.
You should start checking facts before you post the first thing that comes into your head.

Strachan never got Southampton relegated. Got them an 8th placed finish and FA Cup runners up in the same season. As good, if not better than Hughes at Blackburn. Hardly sweet fook all as you put it.

Is getting to the knockout stages of the CL good enough for you? As well as that he is a great coach and a lot of former players have had high praise for him.

[rambler14]

You should start checking facts before you post the first thing that comes into your head.


That involves effort. I'm as lazy as they get.

But there is no way Strachan has the ability to be Man Utd manager.

[DmanDmythDledge]

But there is no way Strachan has the ability to be Man Utd manager.
Nobody ever said he did.

Changing the goalposts is a sign of someone who doesn't have a clue what they're on about.

Anyway this is way OT so I will say no more on it.

[rambler14]

Nobody ever said he did.

Changing the goalposts is a sign of someone who doesn't have a clue what they're on about.

Anyway this is way OT so I will say no more on it.

Yeah I suppose we can't decide who the next manager is, not unless we own the club.

[Closed Account 2]

Simply not true. Do you remember that Pedro Mendes goal/Woy Carroll clanger at Old Trafford which denied Spurs a win? Afterwards, Martin Jol was decency itself.
Have you ever heard e.g Curbishley, Southgate, Ranieri or Pearce whinging like Ferguson invariably does when his team doesn't win? Even Roy Keane has managed mostly to contain himself this season, even though clearly incandescent at times.



You could add Roy Hodgson to that list too. Fulham have had a very bad run in terms of luck on key decisions, yet he has hardly ever complained about it... and the cost of it to Fulham is more than the potential cost to Manchester United