Dunphy Slates Serie A

[Donadoni]

Dunphy's just had a go at Serie A.

He completely wrote the Italian game off. Conveniently he neglected to mention that Milan are reigning European Champions, that Italy have won more Champions League trophies in the last 5years than any other nation, and have more representation in the final in those 5 years than any other nation. That Italy won the World Cup less than 2 years ago with a team all sourced from Italian club sides. And that his great Real Madrid were beaten tonight by Roma.

Ok Serie A's stock is low, true, and I'm a Milan fan, true, but God he can be hard to listen to at times. He knows that Spanish and English football is the best because he admitted to not having a life and that he watches it every weekend. In other words he watches Real and Barca and the top 4 in England every weekend and never watches a Bundesliga, SuperLiga or Ligue 1 game.

Had to get that off my chest!

[centre mid]

He still likes to drink italian wine by the look of him tonight

[bellavistaman]

hes dead right, they were pathetic against a equally pathetic liverpool side. Dirk Kuyt- I wouldnt want him at Ramblers FACT. Crouch is way better, i dont even suport liverpool but like the Crouch Torres combo, why does benitez start him. Anyway Eamons dead right.

[dfx-]

I wouldn't dare write Inter off yet. They looked pretty comfortable until the deflection. I couldn't see the goal coming. They defended magnificently and Cordoba going off was a big turning point.

Did smile at Dunphy's "Who is Cordoba" as if not knowing their name means they can't be any good can they?:rolleyes:

[DaveyCakes]

Dunphy knows absolutely **** all about any football outside the Premiership. My dog knows more, and I don't have a dog.

[pineapple stu]

Dunphy is on auto-moan. If you disagree with something and Dunphy mentions (= moans about) it, you find yourself agreeing with him. Otherwise, he's a fool. In general though, he's a fool. Don't know why anyone pays any attention to him any more.

[kingdom hoop]

Fool or otherwise, he makes you think a little. And that makes him better than the vast majority of idiots populating pundit green rooms.

As for Serie A I must disclaim that I see about two games a season so I wouldn't be in a position to authoritatively comment. (unlike Eamon, I have a life :D) But when faced with evidence comprising decided also-rans from one league completely outplaying run-away leaders who couldn't string two passes together from another league then, albeit reductionistic, one could be moved to say the latter league is crap in comparison to the former.

But in general (in UEFA Cup and CL) I'd guess Spain and England have walked all over Italy over the last few years, with a stout AC Milan the only flag-flyers for Serie A of late that I can think of.

[superfrank]

Dunphy doesn't know ahything about Serie A. The only time he sees Italian sides is in the CL. He's always spouting out the same old clichés about Italian football.

Someone mentioned the also-ran category of teams. Serie A = one team last year in Inter, Milan were -15 points and there was no Juve. Most years it's a three-way between those teams. England is the same, it's one of Arsenal, Chelsea or Man U. I don't know much about La Liga but it seems to be Barca and Real and a third team, at the moment Sevilla.

Not much differences between the three in that area.

[razor]

Uncle Eamo may have been under the influence last night, what rubbish.
Slating Italian football, telling us that cos Roma lost heavily at Old Trafford that they are nowhere near as good as the top English and Spanish sides, fair play to Bill the for throwing in the hammer at him when the highlights of their 2-1 defeat of Real Madrid was finished. Told us Roma are 4 points behind Inter in the league when they are 11.
That the Irish team has better players than Inter and then turning around and saying thst Arsenal-Milan would be enthralling but surely Arsenal should easily beat a team 21 points adrift of what according to him is a very poor Inter side.
You could sense the frustration in Souness, Dunphy was spouting rubbish.
Whats new!

[cheifo]

Thanks KH,you've just put me off my lunch!;)

[John83]

...when faced with evidence comprising decided also-rans from one league completely outplaying run-away leaders who couldn't string two passes together from another league then, albeit reductionistic, one could be moved to say the latter league is crap in comparison to the former.
It would be interesting to see how Chelsea would have fared in Greece had they a man sent off half an hour into the game. Last night was no basis for comparison at all.

Am I dreaming that the analysts spent half time yesterday slating Liverpool, then sang their praises after they went ahead from a deflected goal after almost an hour's play with an extra man?


But in general (in UEFA Cup and CL) I'd guess Spain and England have walked all over Italy over the last few years, with a stout AC Milan the only flag-flyers for Serie A of late that I can think of. Juventus spent two years out of European football because of the scandal over refereeing selection and more. That cost Serie A one of its top performing teams and a number of its most talented players (Cannavaro, Zambrotta, Thuram and Emerson fecked off to Spain, Trezeguet, Del Piero, Nedved and Camoranesi spent two seasons out of Europe with Juventus).

And still, Serie A hosts the current CL champions.

I seem to recall Dunphy lambasting Manchester United (and English football in general), after a poor performance by them against Milan a couple of years ago. Italian football was far superior, he claimed. Ronaldo was hapless against the wily old Maldini (who'd actually played centre-half, I think - this may have been another rant... er, game altogether where he made this error) and Rooney was rubbish, over-hyped, clueless.

Anyway, Dunphy is employed to get people riled up over issues like this. I wouldn't pay much heed to what he's saying at any given minute. He'll have changed his mind in a week or two anyway.

[McShels]

Dunphy also claimed that Roma went on to win the league after ManU beat them 7-1 in last years CL when we all know Inter won it. At some other stage he said Inter had won the Serie A the last 3 years to which Souness replied 2 but one of them was cos of the Juve scandal.

He just rants on and on completly changing his opinions from one minute to the next, but he saved his best for aftr the game when he said 'Inter are crap!' and ranted on about the 2 levels in the CL

[Lim till i die]

Dunphy was talking garbage last night.

"Inter have no quality"

"Who is Cordoba"

"Serie A is full of poor sides"

"Ireland have more quality than Inter" :D

Just proved he hasn't a clue.

[anto1208]

You have to be used to him now last year it was the premiership is rubbish its no where near the italian league. This week its the italian league is rubbish its no where near the prem league he will contradict himself next week again.

He makes good watching as long as you know he doesnt believe what he is saying he is only saying it to get a reaction.

[citizenerased]

talkin crap again..doubt he watches one bit if italian football

[jebus]

Serie A's strength in depth is the problem, it's bottom clubs are relatively poorer than their Premiership and La Liga counterparts, but at the top end of the table Serie A is just as good as anywhere else. The fact that United had one of those games where everything goes right for you against Roma, and Liverpool scrapped over the line against 10-man Inter mean nothing

[TheBoss]

I have to say that all the teams in each league are equal enough in different ways, In my opinion there is not a top league, these 3 are the superior leagues in Europe, no doubt about that but the order of the 3 is up for much debate in my opinion.

In England, the top 3 at the moment are as good as each other really, there is not any major differences. Then there is another 6 teams that battle for European places, and the other 11 play for Mediocrity and staying in the league.

In Spain, there is 2 top teams and again similar, but there is far more teams competing for European places, about 10 teams, with the remaining 8, battling for relegation.

In Italy, 5 teams can really win the league, 8 teams try to gain that last european place and other 7 trying to avoid the drop.

The quality of players in the lower teams in Spain and Italy is far superior to that of England.

[4tothefloor]

Serie A's strength in depth is the problem, it's bottom clubs are relatively poorer than their Premiership and La Liga counterparts, but at the top end of the table Serie A is just as good as anywhere else. The fact that United had one of those games where everything goes right for you against Roma, and Liverpool scrapped over the line against 10-man Inter mean nothing
Scraped over the line? What game were you watching?! I don't recall one Inter effort on goal. On the other hand i can recall clear cut chances that should have been buried from Torres, Hyypia and two from Peter Crouch in the second half prior to any goals. There were also chances in the first half. Liverpool ate Inter for dinner last night, they hardly came out of their own half. I can't stand this utter bulls**t from people who can't recognise when Liverpool actually do well. If it was Arsenal you'd be up to your neck in cum. If that's what you call scraping over the line, I'd love to see what you'd call a comprehensive victory :rolleyes: Inter were crap and always are in Europe. Shower of bottlers

[DaveyCakes]

It's got to the stage now where the likes of Man U, Chelsea, Real Madrid, Barcelona, Milan, etc. are no indicator of the strength of their leagues. They're basically global clubs now. The UEFA Cup is probably a better indcator of strength in depth.

[Lim till i die]

The UEFA Cup is probably a better indcator of strength in depth.

But it's more or less accepted that the Italian clubs couldn't give a fig about the UEFA cup......


I can't stand this utter bulls**t from people who can't recognise when Liverpool actually do well.

In fairness Liverpool got very lucky last night with Inter losing both their centre halves.

For all the territory and all the possesion there was precious little in the way of penetration when you consider how long they were playing against ten men.

It took until late in the second half before Liverpool figured out they needed to stretch Inter across the field.

Stevie Courageous once again poxed a goal after what had been a woeful overall contribution.


Inter were crap and always are in Europe. Shower of bottlers

Agreed.

[noby]

Stevie Courageous once again poxed a goal after what had been a woeful overall contribution.


I think 'poxed' is a little harsh. If anything they should have been having more pot-shots, because try as they might they were finding it very hard to play through the Italians. They were working the ball out wide in the second half, only to cross it in to a line of blue and black defenders.

[Lim till i die]

I think 'poxed' is a little harsh. .

In the context of Stevie I think it's appropriate. :)

Keppers positioning was shocking aswell

[jebus]

Scraped over the line? What game were you watching?! I don't recall one Inter effort on goal. On the other hand i can recall clear cut chances that should have been buried from Torres, Hyypia and two from Peter Crouch in the second half prior to any goals. There were also chances in the first half. Liverpool ate Inter for dinner last night, they hardly came out of their own half. I can't stand this utter bulls**t from people who can't recognise when Liverpool actually do well. If it was Arsenal you'd be up to your neck in cum. If that's what you call scraping over the line, I'd love to see what you'd call a comprehensive victory :rolleyes: Inter were crap and always are in Europe. Shower of bottlers

In all fairness Liverpool scored two late goals after Inter lost Materazzi because of a very poor referee and a bit of theatrics on the Liverpool side, and the man of the match Cordoba, that's barely being able to beat them for me, despite their domination. And I doubt any of us would be creaming ourselves if it were Arsenal who played like that, because that would have been a poor Arsenal performance by their high standards :D

Inter may be bottlers in Europe, but they're about to win their 3rd Serie A on the trot and have to be ranked as a better team than Liverpool overall

[jmurphyc]

Liverpool were dominating the game long before Materazzi was sent off. They might not have won, but they still would have racked up a lot of chances. IMO the sending off helped Inter in a way. Before that, they were playing far too high up the pitch and it looked as though it was only a matter of time before Torres would have got clear of Materazzi and through on goal, but after that they started defending extremely deep and Liverpool couldn't break them down due to their lack of creativity in the final third.

Anyway, Dunphy really is a tw*t, but I just can't stop listening to the guy. He really is a comic genius in the studio sometimes.

[shanman2]

Eamonn Dunphy is a plonker simple as. Honestly this man is allowed to comment on the champions league when he hasn't a clue about players anyone half interested in football would know who Cordoba is and given half a brain while studying the teams would acknowledge that Inter are a good side..... It may not be essential to follow all the leagues, but surely having watched the group stages he would have noticed Inter strolling their group.

Liverpool got lucky again last night. Materazzi should never have been sent off. Whatever about conceding early I would imagine losing a centre half as being much worse. The game plan would go straight out the window...

The keeper was having a good game and looking solid up to Kuyts strike.
Deflection or no deflection it was straight at him he was on his knees by the time it left Kuyts boot, Gerrards strike keeper was in totally the wrong position...

[4tothefloor]

Liverpool got lucky again last night. Materazzi should never have been sent off. Whatever about conceding early I would imagine losing a centre half as being much worse. The game plan would go straight out the window...

The loss of Materrazzi made little difference to Inters game plan, because their game plan was simply to defend and play on the counter. When Materrazzi went off, Chivu and then Burdisso simply slotted in to position. Their defensive unit remained the same, as did their overly defensive midfield unit. Yet they were still s**t. Liverpool should have been ahead long before the 85th minute, again missing clear cut sitters in yet another game. If you as a team decide to camp yourself in your own half for the entire game without showing any interest in attacking, well then you're asking for it. That's what Inter did, and they got their just rewards. It should have been more though, not to mention the blatent penalty that Viera got away with. Liverpool got lucky my @rse :rolleyes: I haven't seen such a one sided CL game in years against a supposed great side. Even Besiktas, who were beaten 8-0, were better than Inter going forward

[4tothefloor]

In all fairness Liverpool scored two late goals after Inter lost Materazzi because of a very poor referee and a bit of theatrics on the Liverpool side, and the man of the match Cordoba, that's barely being able to beat them for me, despite their domination. And I doubt any of us would be creaming ourselves if it were Arsenal who played like that, because that would have been a poor Arsenal performance by their high standards :D

Inter may be bottlers in Europe, but they're about to win their 3rd Serie A on the trot and have to be ranked as a better team than Liverpool overall

I guess thats what watching Sheffield Wednesday does to people. Totally understand man. If we get to our third final in four seasons, I'll send you a postcard from Moscow :):D

[kingdom hoop]

Thanks KH,you've just put me off my lunch!;)

Just got my first ever infraction for it! Ah well, at least there's the consolation of ruining your lunch. :p


But it's more or less accepted that the Italian clubs couldn't give a fig about the UEFA cup......


Any idea why that would be? I'd say you're right, just wondering.

Although in fairness the English clubs often play weakened sides and still do well. I seem to recall, for example, a reserve Newcastle side winning in Palermo a year or two ago.

[Lim till i die]

Any idea why that would be? I'd say you're right, just wondering.

Although in fairness the English clubs often play weakened sides and still do well. I seem to recall, for example, .

The Italian clubs don't consider it to have any prestige.

It's right down there with the Coppa Italia


a reserve Newcastle side winning in Palermo a year or two ago

A case in point :)

[superfrank]

Parma reached the UEFA Cup semis a few years go by playing their reserve team, when their first team was struggling at the bottom of Serie A.

[Red4Eva]

"barca have a poor defence, that's why madrid are 5 points clear"

you obviously don't watch spanish football so eamonn

[TheBoss]

Can he explain that the lead was 9 points and now is 5.

[Red4Eva]

Can he explain that the lead was 9 points and now is 5.

schuster's team are s*** after xmas and robinho injured. dunphy probabaly wouldn't know who madrid's manager is and i remember him pretty much saying robinho was rubbish during the group stages. robinho had of course been the best player in the world in the previous 6 months.

[kingdom hoop]

Parma reached the UEFA Cup semis a few years go by playing their reserve team, when their first team was struggling at the bottom of Serie A.

You've just picked a cherry there though haven't you?! :)

Palermo, Sampdoria and Empoli got knocked out in first round this year by the might of Mlada Boleslav, Aalborg and Zurich respectively.

No Italian team in last 16 last year.

Three Italian teams reached last 16 the year before, all knocked out then though.

Parma were the only Italian team to make the last 32 the year before that. In fairness they did well to reach the semis; beating Stuttgart and Sevilla. But remarkable they were the only representatives in the last 32.

Pretty damning evidence there over the past four years of how poorly Italian teams have fared at the only reasonably objective criteria we have. Whether to conclude that Serie A is poor in general or it's just that for some reason or other its teams don't do well in Europe is up for debate.


(All facts taken from my memory bank. Honest.)

[noby]

But it's hardly 'reasonably objective criteria' if the Italian teams don't take it seriously. Obviously Parma, and possibly the three teams you mentioned were more interested in league survival than the UEFA cup.

[kingdom hoop]

It's objective in the sense that teams from the different leagues are openly competing against each other, for us all to see how they get on. And it's more objective in a comparative sense than just spouting meaningless crap like "Serie A is too boring, the Premiership is wonderfully exciting."

I wouldn't place enormous weight on it, but it must say something against the clubs, and league in general by association, that they don't/won't fully test themselves and try to win a major competition. Undeniably hints at weakness in my opinion.

Overall, it's a matter of taste, if you prefer watching Serie A, fine. But inevitably we'll be drawn into comparisons, and in that regard I think it's somewhat instructive to look at how teams do in various competitions.

[seand]

It's probably fair to say clubs in the bottom half of Serie A wouldn't be as strong as clubs in the bottom half of the EPL or La Liga. Middling English clubs like Boro, Everton, Bolton etc are raking in many millions in TV revenue thanks to the EPL deal with Sky which spreads the money around pretty well. In Italy Juve/Milan/Inter take 90% of the TV money. The likes of Palermo simply do not have the finance to compete with Bolton.

That said, Dunphy was talking about the top of Serie A not being very good, which is utterly ludicrous, as proved over the last couple of nights! His 6 teams operating on a different level (MU, Arsenal, Chelsea of course, plus Real, Barca, Sev.) drew in Greece, lost in Turkey, struggled in Scotland, drew in France, drew at home and lost in Italy.

[noby]

Well yes I agree it's better than hearsay to use the UEFA cup as a gauge. All I'm wondering is (and I don't watch Italian footie) if the UEFA cup is treated like seriously enough by the Italian teams to use it as a gauge for the league.

[jebus]

From what I've read/heard AC Milan are the only Italian team in recent times to really give two hoots about European competition. Inter, having waited so long to win a Serie A, are happy where they are at the moment, the Rome teams have always cared more about national success over anything else, and Juventus are happy to be in the position they are in after the bung scandal, so I wouldn't hold it against them that they care more about winning/doing well in Serie A, than getting a good European Cup run together.

Furthermore the European Cup has only gone back to England on two occasions since Heysel, and on those two occasions the English team were somewhat lucky to escape with the trophy. That says more to me about overall standards than England getting 3/4 teams in the semi finals last year and still failing to win it

[kingdom hoop]

Very narrow-minded altogether aren't they!

I can't really understand why once you qualify for UEFA Cup or CL that you wouldn't give it your best shot. Was that not the point of doing well in the league in the first place? From the fans perspective, is the glory simply in their team finishing a few places higher, say 5th versus 9th, than might be expected? And the possibility of an exciting European adventure the following season is largely irrelevant? Just seems a little odd to me.

[jmurphyc]

I'd say Inter really want to do well in Europe. They've ended their wait for a domestic league title and seeing as their walking Serie A this season I'd say they feel they can focus most of their attention on Europe now. Also, if media reports are correct (:eek:) then Mancini could lose his job to Mourinho if he doesn't do well in the Champions League. I can't really comment on the other clubs though, but I'd say that if Juventus get into the Champions League next season they'll want to have a good run in it to boost their revenue.

[an_ceannaire]

Simply put, the reason Serie A and La Liga ARE better than the premiership is this, The top 2 or 3 in them all are pretty even...Man u, arsenal, chelsea, Inter, Milan, Juve, Real, Barca, Seville, but after that....Liverpool being liverpool aside, the also rans, the nearly there but not quites....The premiership is well behind. Everton Spurs and Villa are not the same level as Valencia, Athletico, Roma, Lazio etc...
Look before anyone goes picking holes in that Milan are behind roma bla bla bla....i am not saying i have exact figures, but lets just say Everton or Spurs were to meet Roma/Atheltico/Lazio/Valencia in Europe......would you back the English side.....I wouldnt. Those leagues have far greater strength in depth

[jebus]

I'd say Inter really want to do well in Europe. They've ended their wait for a domestic league title and seeing as their walking Serie A this season I'd say they feel they can focus most of their attention on Europe now. Also, if media reports are correct (:eek:) then Mancini could lose his job to Mourinho if he doesn't do well in the Champions League. I can't really comment on the other clubs though, but I'd say that if Juventus get into the Champions League next season they'll want to have a good run in it to boost their revenue.

The money men at Inter and Juventus would wnat them to do well, that's beyond dispute, but the fans seem to put far greater emphasis on domestic achievements rather than European